[MISTWEAVER] 7.X Discussion Thread

[Chaoslock]

Hey guys,

My raid group is struggling with Normal NH and a few of my raiders feel like they are under proforming for their item lvl. In this case its our MW monk hes doing great on the healing meter but wants to see if theres something he can do to get the most out of his healer. Any suggestions would be awesome.

log: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=healing

armory: Wouldnt do any good due to him being in the wrong spec right now.

[Rekkal]

With the new traits making Effuse and SG interact along with the t20 tier set it seems like blizzard are giving us passives that are basically trying to carrot on a stick us to using these god awful spells we have because currently we only cast EF/ Viv procs and Rem while in raids. I really dont see mw being in any better spot than it is right now unless you somehow manage to RNG some revival cooldown relics next patch and RNG the bracers or Trinket.

[SoSo]

if only we can have hpally mastery and modify the range proximity with our jade statue

[ribthanwa]

I mean, our mastery makes us better ST healers. All the changes coming in 7.2 are going to focusing us in on ST healing, whether we like it or not, so it actually fits pretty well.

[Deleted]

Hey guys,

My raid group is struggling with Normal NH and a few of my raiders feel like they are under proforming for their item lvl. In this case its our MW monk hes doing great on the healing meter but wants to see if theres something he can do to get the most out of his healer. Any suggestions would be awesome.

log: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=healing

armory: Wouldnt do any good due to him being in the wrong spec right now.

He should cast more spells as he has a lot of mana left a the end of the fight. This is the most essential.
He can use checkmywow.com for basic information about his playtime.
He don't use revival enough and he should also use more essence font.

[Supliftz]

pretty funny that there is a not so small amount of people thinking MW is fine when a flat 20% buff to everything still kinda wouldnt really make them viable

ummm a 20% buff to mw output would make the spec more than viable LOL

[Caprix]

we only use EF is because EF is our only good spell outside of UT viv, ReM and lifecycles envelop. so we have a situation where enveloping mist is only used when we use viv, and we can only use viv w/ UT, outside of that we are bound by EF/ReM to do competitive hps.

I guess it depends on relative secondary stats? For me at about 12k crit / 5k mastery/vers, when you count the mastery proc, vivify without UT is on par with EF (and better on EF hot = double proc), hpm wise. Something like that:

UT viv (2 procs) > UT viv (1proc) >viv (2 procs) > viv (1 proc) ~= EF (full hot duration) >= Envm (2 procs) > Envm (1 proc) >= EF (no hot)
And that's without the lifecycle buff...

That's raw healing, of course EF is less prone to overheal. But if there are only 3/4 people seriously injured and no UT proc, there is no reason for me to not throw in one or two vivify.

Problem with envm is potential overhealing and big cast time.

That's with the 4p bonus of course.

[Delek]

Do you have any numbers to back this up? Looks like a lot of feelycraft to me. How much mastery would you have to run to come to Viv ~=EF?

[Deleted]

Can someone give me an insight on trinkets ? I'm using heightened senses(890) and Arcanocrystal 880. I might be able to get Helya bottle, cake or map and I'm not quite sure what I should be using if i get all of those

[Caprix]

Do you have any numbers to back this up? Looks like a lot of feelycraft to me. How much mastery would you have to run to come to Viv ~=EF?

I just used a quick look to my logs from yesterday. I went there again to extract number but found i had bad positioning resulting in too much not full EF channels. So i have to increase my EF "raw number" by about 12%. This is a "real life" issue with EF however: it tends to have low overheal but you pay the full mana price before you do any actual healing and have to stand there for a few seconds afterwards. So just like you will (in real life) overheal more with envm, then vivify, then EF, you will also waste some mana on canceled EF

But back to raw theoric healing

Like i said a bit under 5k mastery, note that i happen to have 2 viv relics and 1 ef relic. Obviously Vifify and mastery benefit more from the envm buff than EF too as you can't run the envm buff on 10+ targets at the same time.

So numbers:
EF 1725K, hot 530k
Viv 913k, UT viv 1280k
Gust proc 235k
EnvM 970k

so with 8% EF, 4.5% viv and 6% envm, that's (k heals per %mana). Divide by 0.8 to get the hpm with lifecycle
EF 215k + hot 66 (total 281k)
viv 1 proc 255k 2 proc 307k with lifecycle 318k and 383k
viv UT 1 proc 336k 2 proc 388k with lifecycle 420k and 485k

so full EF (with hot) still 10% better than a simple no lifecycle viv. You will still want to cast non UT- non lifecycle vivs on the EF hot. Anyway even with a weaker EF you would want to cast it in the first place as it can boost the following 3-5 vivifys for 15-20% with the additionnal mastery proc.

I realize i don't know if the mastery proc on the envm heal gets the envm boost. My average mastery proc may then be about 10% too high for this comparison

[Teramosa]

Hey guys,

My raid group is struggling with Normal NH and a few of my raiders feel like they are under proforming for their item lvl. In this case its our MW monk hes doing great on the healing meter but wants to see if theres something he can do to get the most out of his healer. Any suggestions would be awesome.

log: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/...1&type=healing

armory: Wouldnt do any good due to him being in the wrong spec right now.

From a quick glance, here is my assessment:

- 4x healers in normal Nighthold is possibly overkill (depending on your raid DPS, which seems fine). Maybe think about reducing to 3x.
- Lack of Essence Font casting. 2-1-6-3-6-4-6 are the amount of casts in fight order.
- Take Mana Tea. Although you could arguably take 'Focused Thunder' for normal, Mana Tea provides decent enough mana savings that you should spam Essence Font with during the MT window. You can easily get off a few casts of EF, along with a buffed Viv during this window which will net lots of +healing.
- Revival usage seems fine. Remember, its a 3min or so CD, so in a 7min fight, this can be used twice (if you have the legendary wrists, this is further reduced by Renewing Mist).
- Use Thunder Focus Tea with Vivify Uplifting Trance procs over Renewing Mist in most cases. When damage is light, you should then use it with Renewing Mist to get more chance of Uplifting Trance procs.

Pretty much it.

Let me know how he gets on

- - - Updated - - -

Can someone give me an insight on trinkets ? I'm using heightened senses(890) and Arcanocrystal 880. I might be able to get Helya bottle, cake or map and I'm not quite sure what I should be using if i get all of those

Heyla bottle is your best bet (with Vers or Crit).

Other than that, I believe its Cake then Map which are next in line.

[ribthanwa]

Can someone give me an insight on trinkets ? I'm using heightened senses(890) and Arcanocrystal 880. I might be able to get Helya bottle, cake or map and I'm not quite sure what I should be using if i get all of those

It would depend on the ilvl of the new trinkets, but the 880 arcano might beat out any map or statstick you might get. Cake, however, is OP

[Deleted]

ummm a 20% buff to mw output would make the spec more than viable LOL

i went a little overboard there with the number but resto druids are already at a 12-16% advantage on skorpyron, chrono, krosus and tichondrius which is honestly ridiculous

[Spotnick]

i went a little overboard there with the number but resto druids are already at a 12-16% advantage on skorpyron, chrono, krosus and tichondrius which is honestly ridiculous

Since I'm forced to play my druid this tier, I can tell you if we still had Pool of Mist, it wouldn't be an issue.

If we kept the HFC model, Mistweavers would be king of healing this tier.

Needless to say, not being able to spec into RJW and Focused Thunder is the issue... if we had the mana to talent those 2, we'd be competitive. Gust of Mist is some kind of Extend Life, Focused Thunder is very close to what Pool of Mist was except you have to use TFT, so it's not too far, but you can't spec into those for mythic progression.

It's been so long since I used RJW, if I remember well, the Legion version doesn't allow you to cast while it's going on right? Which is of course another issue.

Again, not saying Mistweavers are not competitive, but I clearly see i do more healing on my druid.. and I'm still in learning process of how to maximize its mastery.

Makes me funny when I see some people in the reddit thread saying monks got mobility instead of utility. They clearly have not played a druid with Blink+Dash+Cat Form and utility on top of that.

[ribthanwa]

Since I'm forced to play my druid this tier, I can tell you if we still had Pool of Mist, it wouldn't be an issue.

If we kept the HFC model, Mistweavers would be king of healing this tier.

Needless to say, not being able to spec into RJW and Focused Thunder is the issue... if we had the mana to talent those 2, we'd be competitive. Gust of Mist is some kind of Extend Life, Focused Thunder is very close to what Pool of Mist was except you have to use TFT, so it's not too far, but you can't spec into those for mythic progression.

It's been so long since I used RJW, if I remember well, the Legion version doesn't allow you to cast while it's going on right? Which is of course another issue.

Again, not saying Mistweavers are not competitive, but I clearly see i do more healing on my druid.. and I'm still in learning process of how to maximize its mastery.

Makes me funny when I see some people in the reddit thread saying monks got mobility instead of utility. They clearly have not played a druid with Blink+Dash+Cat Form and utility on top of that.

You can cast while RJW is applied. It has cross functionality in this because it buffs the EFs you cast during it are buffed by 20%. But it competes with Crane and Statue, both of which are potent, useful, and mana free.

[Buildapanda]

how do you calculate drape of shame's boost to your healing?

[Spotnick]

how do you calculate drape of shame's boost to your healing?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...jaE/edit#gid=0

[Buildapanda]

http://eu.battle.net/forums/en/wow/t...page=2#post-35



TLDR

NERF MANA TEA

PUT A CD ON EF DO NOTHING ELSE TO OUR OTHER SPELLS

[worcester]

I'm more interested in the "making the value of mastery more stable". If they find a way to scale mastery with the spell cast instead of it being flat that would be great for the long term scalability of MW which is much more important in the bigger picture than the issues with current spell usage / mana constraints which are simply short term problems.

[Awsumpossum]

http://eu.battle.net/forums/en/wow/t...page=2#post-35



TLDR

NERF MANA TEA

PUT A CD ON EF DO NOTHING ELSE TO OUR OTHER SPELLS

That's definitely not an accurate TLDR. I'm as outspoken as anybody about the constraints of MW, but this is the type of response the devs point to when chastising the player base.