AMD Zen processors...Are you interested?

[Evildeffy]

The whole Coffee Lake thing was altered to 2H 2017 due to AMD's Ryzen leaks starting a couple weeks ago, prior to that it was 1H 2018.
The 2H 2017 bit is very optimistic of Intel and they are scrambling to push out an answer and it's not going to end well for them.

Intel is having A LOT of difficulties with 10nm and that's why it's confirmed that the next gen CPUs is yet again a "refresh" of Kaby Lake with some optimizations.
Which means you won't be getting anything new for quite some time.

Cannonlake was entirely cancelled (the LGA 1151 socket version) which was the die-shrink of Kaby Lake so now we don't have Intel's Tick-Tock-Tock they said to have changed with Skylake/Kaby Lake but actually Tick-Tock-Tock-Tock.

Icelake was originally planned to replace Cannonlake (which by earlier estimates should have been out on the market a year ago) in 2018 on 10nm... and with the issues Intel is having on 10nm combined with the fact that Coffee Lake is to appear early 2018 (not going to happen this year) and is the "next generation" you will not have any new lithography or architecture enter the scene until at least 2019.

You will simply get Skylake V3.0 known as Coffee Lake, which doesn't necessarily have to be bad.
But you will already be able to extract the following from those choices:
1. There will be no major change to architecture which means it'll be only a very slight IPC increase (2 - 4%) or another few 100 MHz, either or and can't have both.
2. Due to no lithography change you will not get any die-shrink performance increases whatsoever.
3. There WILL very likely be 6-core CPUs for Coffee Lake as they were originally planned for them.

The whole thing with Skylake-X and Kaby Lake-X is a little bit retarded and confusing.. probably because of the whole Intel dominance on the CPU market.
Regardless considering there's an average of only 3% IPC gain from Broadwell to Skylake the new HEDT CPUs will not offer anything substantial.
They could likely overclock a little bit higher but still be limited to (guesstimate) ~4,6GHz on average.
Having said that if Intel is to keep their pricing scheme and the Ryzen leaks are true than no sane person but a roaring fanboy would drop down 3 times as much money on equal or less performance as current Ryzen leaks portray Ryzen to have superior SMT technology to Intel's HyperThreading.

It's really not going to be pleasant for Intel.. in fact it'll hurt a great deal if you have price/tech conscious buyers.
The Intel mindshare however is big.. the question only is how big?

A lot of Intel fanboys have become very annoyed with Intel's minimal performance increases but considerable price increases and have actually started looking towards AMD for a way out of the slump that Intel has created.
So yeah... it'll be very interesting how it will end up in popularity and financially.

[Life-Binder]

I hope Coffee 6c is out by December at least, but not holding my breath


desktop i7 Icelake definitely wont be out in 2018, it will be 2019 and it will go against Zen+ I reckon

[Denpepe]

A lot of Intel fanboys have become very annoyed with Intel's minimal performance increases but considerable price increases and have actually started looking towards AMD for a way out of the slump that Intel has created.
So yeah... it'll be very interesting how it will end up in popularity and financially.

If you check this interview out https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Proces...w-David-Kanter it mentions that the only reason Ryzen chips are so much better then AMD's old ones is mostly because those were "bad" and AMD more or less closed the gap now, but he also predicts that both AMD and intel will now be more or less in the same boat and improvements will most likely for both be in the 5% ish for the forseeable future unless they drastically change their ways.

[Evildeffy]

If you check this interview out https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Proces...w-David-Kanter it mentions that the only reason Ryzen chips are so much better then AMD's old ones is mostly because those were "bad" and AMD more or less closed the gap now, but he also predicts that both AMD and intel will now be more or less in the same boat and improvements will most likely for both be in the 5% ish for the forseeable future unless they drastically change their ways.

The process between them will be the same, the difference here is that now that there's competition there will be more innovation and desire to be on top.
Instead of sitting on your ass releasing incremental upgrades because you have no-one to challenge you.

[Kontinuum]

The top-end part is the R7 1800X. This $499 chip will have a 3.6GHz base speed and a 4.0GHz boost speed, with a 95W TDP. AMD is positioning it against Intel's i7-6900K, a $1,050 processor using the Broadwell-E core running at 3.2 GHz, and turboing up to 3.7GHz.

The other two parts are the R7 1700X, a $399 part with a base of 3.4GHz and a boost of 3.8GHz; and the R7 1700, with clocks of 3.0 and 3.7GHz, selling for $329. AMD is positioning these against the $439 Intel Core i7-6800K (a six-core, 12-thread part) and $349 Core i7-7700K, respectively.

https://arstechnica.com/information-...from-just-329/

[Life-Binder]

cores alone dont convince me

it has to be a very healthy combo of 6+ cores, strong ST performance and OC potential

either Zen delivers on that or Coffee will


though Im sure it will be a successful launch for them, the hype is very positive on the tech sites right now

[Deleted]

i mean, AMD is great if you dont have a ton of money, but you get what you pay for.

Likewise Nvidia/Intel, you don't get what you pay for.

[Life-Binder]

http://www.pcworld.com/article/31711...the-price.html

A statement from Intel, meanwhile, provided a fourth alternative: sowing dissent via a tried-and-true PR strategy known as “fear, uncertainty and doubt.”

“We take any competition seriously but as we’ve learned, consumers usually take a ‘wait and see’ approach on performance claims for untested products,” Intel said in a statement. “Seventh-gen Intel Core delivers the best experiences, and with 8th-gen Intel Core and new technologies like Intel Optane memory coming soon, Intel will not stop raising the bar.” *

interesting

[Evildeffy]

http://www.pcworld.com/article/31711...the-price.html

interesting

What's so interesting about it? It's typical marketing terms.

For example:
Do you really believe AMD's Ryzen chips have a neural net?
There would have to be an actual AI in the chip (SKYNET!) for that to be the case.

[Life-Binder]

its interesting because Im eagerly anticipating Coffee Lake as possibly taking the gaming crown away from both Zen and 7700K and if they said soon theres a chance they actually meant 2H 2017

- - - Updated - - -

if they are afraid of Zen then they would want to launch Coffee as soon as possible



because Skylake-X or that 7740K Kaby-X crap certainly wont help them win the masses

[Usagi Senshi]

Waiting to see official prices and benches of the 4 and 6 core variants at this point before flinging my wallet at Newegg/Amazon. I'm still getting Zen regardless but I'm still torn between the 1400X (4c/8t) and 1500 (6c/12t). Leaked prices don't seem to be that different between those models thus far.

Honestly will probably just get the 1500 and the Asrock Pro AB350M MB.

[Deleted]

Looks like AMD have definitely done well price wise.

[Evildeffy]

its interesting because Im eagerly anticipating Coffee Lake as possibly taking the gaming crown away from both Zen and 7700K and if they said soon theres a chance they actually meant 2H 2017

- - - Updated - - -

if they are afraid of Zen then they would want to launch Coffee as soon as possible

because Skylake-X or that 7740K Kaby-X crap certainly wont help them win the masses

In chip design the last thing you want to do is rushing it.. if it fails prototyping phase QA properly you get stuff like the Pentium 4/D division error or the very recent Atom C2000 error bricking devices.

They simply stated 2H 2017 because they are trying to appease shareholders, they will not rush a design when it's so dependent on survival as is.

The current "previews" out there (just an hour or so ago) are the "same old same old" ... so I am still waiting on independent reviews.
If Zen can be equal to very close to Intel for gaming and offer better multi-threaded loads as they boast then it's already a success.

Don't forget that whilst (as an example) Intel divides into Xeon chips into Workstation and Server chips, AMD only does so for it's Server oriented platform needing high core counts as any AMD chip out there has ECC support depending upon motherboard manufacturers to implement support in their firmware.

Gamers are but a small fraction of $$$ if you can breach the business sector smashing in with a sledgehammer.

[Deleted]

I really want this to work out..

I oc'd AMD chips on ASUS mb's from 2000-2007, they kicked pentium butt...been Intel with a 1ghz oc since 2007 as their ipc was just so much higher, and applications didn't care about the extra cores.

Intel does need competition, and in the server sector I think they now definitely have it,I look forward to seeing how enthusiasts do with them

[Turaska]

"R7 at launch, R5 and R3 coming later.

Ryzen 7 1800X: 8C/16T, 3.6 GHz base, 4.0 GHz turbo, 95W, $499
Ryzen 7 1700X: 8C/16T, 3.4 GHz base, 3.8 GHz turbo, 95W, $399
Ryzen 7 1700: 8C/16T, 3.0 GHz base, 3.7 GHz turbo, $329

All Ryzen chips are overclockable... so that R7 1700 with a 500mhz OC will perform at the 1800x level ( assuming you get a cpu that can cope with that OC )."

[Life-Binder]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment..._very_limited/

[Evildeffy]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment..._very_limited/

That's conjecture because of what the voltage readings say, means nothing on the CPU and mobos themselves till you try.

That said I don't expect the 8 cores to clock much higher than 4,5 - 4,6GHz really .. the complexity and thermal envelope you get is A LOT.

I'm expecting the Quad core variants to do better than their 8/6C brethren due to the fact it's only 1 CCX instead of 2 on the chip. (Core CompleX)

[Life-Binder]

That's conjecture because of what the voltage readings say

its based on what the guy who reviews Ryzen for computerbase.de says

https://www.computerbase.de/forum/sh...1#post19805651

and I trust computerbase.de a lot

also lines up with Linus saying XFR boosts by ~100 Mhz


4.5-4.6 would be amazing for 8c, but I expect it wont go past 4.2-4.3 on air, maybe a bit higher on water

[MonsieuRoberts]

My 4670K which I've ONLY JUST RECENTLY managed to get stable at 4.3 is beginning to sweat with these initial impressions.

Sadly, CAD pricing is ass as usual:

[Fascinate]

Wonder when the 1600x is coming out.