EU Lawmakers starting down a slippery slope

[Triks]

Isn´t immunity only lifted on the twitter thing and not the other?

They lifted her immunity. Whether or not you agree is up for debate. For me personally, it has more to do with the money she misused, rather than the whole Twitter drama.

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No, she is turning herself into a martyr by lying about the reason she is silenced. The blind and gullible will cheer her for fighting this and everyone else will see the liar she is.

That's the point. You don't beat these people with silence, you beat them in a debate. All of Le Pen's policies could be destroyed if she was asked two questions:

1) Where would you get the money from?
2) Why do we need to expand the army?

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Yep. Mainly because people were using it as a way to make profit.

How exactly?

[Triks]

This is the same old line, just refute them. Well they ignore every refutation. Well then just refute them ... i uhm

In my country the far right refute themselves and no one cares. Their supporters are either into it for money or idiots.

We've allowed all of our far-right parties the right to exist in our native parliament. Whenever they propose something stupid - discrimination against minorities, bringing back compulsory service and the draft and expanding the military for "protection" - they are destroyed by everyone in the room. That's how you deal with lunatics.

[Mayhem]

They lifted her immunity. Whether or not you agree is up for debate. For me personally, it has more to do with the money she misused, rather than the whole Twitter drama.

I read that her immunity is only lifted for the twitter thing and not for the money she misused, so for the misused money she still has immunity.

That's the point. You don't beat these people with silence, you beat them in a debate. All of Le Pen's policies could be destroyed if she was asked two questions:

1) Where would you get the money from?
2) Why do we need to expand the army?

You can´t beat this people by debates because their followers aren´t interested in debates. At least that is the issue around here. Or take a look at the US, donnies followers find excuses or explanations about what he meant if what he said was uncomfortable.

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We've allowed all of our far-right parties the right to exist in our native parliament. Whenever they propose something stupid - discrimination against minorities, bringing back compulsory service and the draft and expanding the military for "protection" - they are destroyed by everyone in the room. That's how you deal with lunatics.

Yeah, that´s what we do here to, except for an outright nazi party. And despite being destroyed on every issue they gained votes. You can´t keep up with destroying their lies as fast as they come up with new ones.

[Triks]

I read that her immunity is only lifted for the twitter thing and not for the money she misused, so for the misused money she still has immunity.



You can´t beat this people by debates because their followers aren´t interested in debates. At least that is the issue around here. Or take a look at the US, donnies followers find excuses or explanations about what he meant if what he said was uncomfortable.

The Twitter thing is the cause, rather than the reason. She couldn't be brought into the police for questioning. That's just my opinion.

Donnie's followers came to power partly because they were called "misogynists", "racists", "rednecks" and "hicks". I am not saying some of them aren't but I am not willing to silence based on their opinions. I will give you a podium to speak, you just have to accept the fact that I am going to boo at you.

[Moratori]

Depends on how you act and what you want

Most immigrants are law-abiding and want nothing more than live their lives without some asshat interfering with their lives because they're not like the majority population in appearance and culture.

So, discriminating against immigrants because of some assholes that come from that group is just ridiculous and pretty racist.

not the colour of your skin mate.

Color of the skin isn't what makes people classify someone as white or not white. I'm as pale as many white people but I'm not considered white.

[Triks]

I read that her immunity is only lifted for the twitter thing and not for the money she misused, so for the misused money she still has immunity.



You can´t beat this people by debates because their followers aren´t interested in debates. At least that is the issue around here. Or take a look at the US, donnies followers find excuses or explanations about what he meant if what he said was uncomfortable.

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Yeah, that´s what we do here to, except for an outright nazi party. And despite being destroyed on every issue they gained votes. You can´t keep up with destroying their lies as fast as they come up with new ones.

Our far-right party is called ATAKA. Their leader - Volen Siderov - likes to have a crew cut and to wear leather jackets while waving his hands around like a certain Austrian. Banning him won't work. Do you know why? Well, 3 years ago he entered into a coalition with the party that represents minority rights and the rights of Turkish-Bulgarians. The party he constantly bashes, calls "anti-constitutional" and has made a career of hating.

His supporters WILL still vote him no matter what. It's the "swing" voters that get influenced.

[Mayhem]

The Twitter thing is the cause, rather than the reason. She couldn't be brought into the police for questioning. That's just my opinion.

Again that´s not what i read.

Donnie's followers came to power partly because they were called "misogynists", "racists", "rednecks" and "hicks". I am not saying some of them aren't but I am not willing to silence based on their opinions. I will give you a podium to speak, you just have to accept the fact that I am going to boo at you.

And you think people who vote someone into power because they´ve been called bad names are people you could debate?

[Triks]

Again that´s not what i read.



And you think people who vote someone into power because they´ve been called bad names are people you could debate?

What did you read?

I couldn't debate them because they were immediately insulted. Let them speak. Let them say that women belong in the kitchen. Let the public see for themselves what they really are and what they really stand for. Yank the fringe groups out of their little corners and give them the lime-light. Let the people see with their own eyes that in 2017 there are sick individuals who want "peaceful ethnic cleansing". Then demolish them.

[Mayhem]

What did you read?

That immunity is only lifted about the twitter thing but she still has immunity for the money thing.

I couldn't debate them because they were immediately insulted. Let them speak. Let them say that women belong in the kitchen. Let the public see for themselves what they really are and what they really stand for. Yank the fringe groups out of their little corners and give them the lime-light. Let the people see with their own eyes that in 2017 there are sick individuals who want "peaceful ethnic cleansing". Then demolish them.

Yeah, that doesn´t work. Their voters at least the ones i know and debated ignored everything. They´ve ignored what happened in the past, they´ve ignored what the party runs on, they´ve ignored the fucking official party line and what they wrote on their parties homepage... they wanted change and didn´t care for what happend, when asked what they wanted changed they couldn´t give an exact answer or even examples.

[Triks]

That immunity is only lifted about the twitter thing but she still has immunity for the money thing.



Yeah, that doesn´t work. Their voters at least the ones i know and debated ignored everything. They´ve ignored what happened in the past, they´ve ignored what the party runs on, they´ve ignored the fucking official party line and what they wrote on their parties homepage... they wanted change and didn´t care for what happend, when asked what they wanted changed they couldn´t give an exact answer or even examples.

How's that possible? She lost her immunity as an MEP.

You don't target their voters - you target the people that will be affected by their voters. If you expose them, you let the "swing" voters to see what they truly stand for, thus they can't become a banner that rallies people.

[Noradin]

You and the article are saying the EU Parliament are heading down a slippery slope, I'm saying they've been base jumping for a while now.(apperantly this opinion upsets you somehow?) Seeing how you write 'where' where you meant were makes me think you should try your googling for other peoples' post idea sometimes.

I didn't. Don't put words in my mouth.

You obviously do not know what you are talking about, your post had nothing to do with the topic at hand aside from vaguely mentioning the "EU" and blabbering about imagined things you assumedly heard somewhere.

[Mayhem]

How's that possible? She lost her immunity as an MEP.

No idea but apparently that is how it´s done, at least as far as i read.

You don't target their voters - you target the people that will be affected by their voters. If you expose them, you let the "swing" voters to see what they truly stand for, thus they can't become a banner that rallies people.

Again, they either don´t care or the parts that affect people are ambiguous enough that you can´t make out clear targets.

[Noradin]

You are looking for a calf under the ox.

Meaning?
Yes? No? Don't know?
I'm not trying to lead you anywhere, just curious for your answer.

If your condition for getting support is having paid taxes then obviously the next question must be "is there an maximum age before which people are excused?"

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I know two faces from the commision (because why would we know ppl with such authority in 'our europe', amirite).

The commission isn't the parliament.
(You can tell by the different name.)

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from the top of my head;
[...]
- I believe

Those are your two problems...

[Stacyrect]

So do you want to discuss an unimportant change in the EP-rules or do you want to bash Islamic citizens? Can't do both with this thread.


What?
Le Pen stole money from the EU.
Don't whine when they take away your immunity.

Sure. I think adding additional rules to specifically target and erase a members political speech is orwellian. It enables them to censor political speech. Their are other rules already on the books to deal with 'disruptive' members.

Not bashing islamic people by pointing out an issue. Which is exactly what our whole conversation just drew upon. Which just further compounds how orwellian it is to see the this change to the rule set.

[Stacyrect]

Yes, feeling like you're somehow worth more than people of other races is... you, being a racist.

Did you actually take one look at what she wants to do and where her party comes from?
You're just trolling at this point, right?

That is literally retarded. Putting your own needs, as a citizen in your own country, over others who are not from your country, doesn't make you a racist. Nor does it suggest that they are superior. Only that the needs of a citizen should be of a higher priority then those who are not, in their own country is not racist, at the very least it's common sense.

If you wanted to say her father is a person whose beliefs are fascist, you won't find any disagreement from me there. Le Pen is not her father, her policies are not racist. Can you point to one that specifically is?

[Deleted]

The commission isn't the parliament.
(You can tell by the different name.)
.

Very good,.. I think? What are you trying to say here captain obvious?

I didn't. Don't put words in my mouth.

You obviously do not know what you are talking about, your post had nothing to do with the topic at hand aside from vaguely mentioning the "EU" and blabbering about imagined things you assumedly heard somewhere.

Thats yet another heavy bout of 'pointy you you-ing' there pal.

Your type likes to cultivate this superiority image for yourselves, not realising you're a dime a dozen acting the exact same way (reminiscent of a child trying really hard to not see whats going on around them) or as I like to call it, the PC brace for impact attitude. I guess I'll leave you to your fantasies.

[Triks]

No idea but apparently that is how it´s done, at least as far as i read.



Again, they either don´t care or the parts that affect people are ambiguous enough that you can´t make out clear targets.

That sounds strange. Either you have immunity or you don't.

We can agree to disagree.

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Meaning?
Yes? No? Don't know?
I'm not trying to lead you anywhere, just curious for your answer.

If your condition for getting support is having paid taxes then obviously the next question must be "is there an maximum age before which people are excused?"

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The commission isn't the parliament.
(You can tell by the different name.)

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Those are your two problems...

What you are asking of me is to draft you a complex peace of legislation all by myself on an Internet forum while taking into accounts all possible scenarios.

To answer your question - yes they are entitled because it is in society's best interest they don't grow up to be criminals.

[Mayhem]

That sounds strange. Either you have immunity or you don't.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39141391

However, the vote only lifts her immunity in this particular case and will not cover a separate investigation into whether the FN misused European Parliament funds.

We can agree to disagree.

Looks like it. ^^

[Triks]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39141391





Looks like it. ^^

This is weird as hell.

On a side note, if I were French, I'd be voting for Macron. The guy has a pretty solid platform.

[Stacyrect]

Members shall not resort to defamatory, racist or xenophobic language or behaviour in parliamentary debates, nor in that context shall they unfurl banners.

That has always been a rule of the parliament.
It has always been against the rules. There is nothing Orwellian about it, do you even know what Orwellian means?

The problem is that kicking them out was not sufficient, they started doing it on purpose for the attention.
So now they made this rule so they don't get any attention.

God forbid we expect people to act like an adult when we are paying them 84k a year.

You say they, who is they, how many times have 'they' been kicked out for causing a disturbance?



She just eviscerated merkel there