Warcraft Chronicle Vol 2 (Warning: Spoilers)

[Deleted]

Kil'jaeden abandoned Gul'dan because he knew that Gul'dan could not be trusted. And he was right. Gul'dan wanted to keep the demons, relatively, secret from the Horde, so summoning a bajillion demons would counter that part of the plan, besides, half of the clans were already mad it seems, summoning a legion of hellspawn can't be good for morale nor sanity.

Yet they had him further the Legions goals in Warlords by summoning Archimonde. In the MU, this world was about to become a bridge to the most important world for the Legion ever. It makes no sense at all for the Legion to suddendly pull out their assets, then go back in and try to use Draenor as an invasion bridge years later when it was open to them there and then.

Also note that it was not KJ who wanted to cut off contact with Gul'dan in this new lore, trust dosent factor into it. The new lore is basically "Sargeras wanted the mortals of Azeroth to stand a chance to survive so he forced KJ to remove all Legion forces from Draenor and cut all contact for no reason at all."

It's a terrible decision from Sargeras who is supposed to be intimidating. The old lore was better: "KJ abandoned the orcs, Sargeras found them and realized he could use them." That makes sense as to why there were almost no Demons in the Horde. But now instead we have Sargeras "tuning down the difficulty for the mortals" for no reason on his invasion of Azeroth.

[Zulkhan]

It's very interesting that the orcs' origins is a life-based (plants) curse of flesh as opposed to a void-based one (old gods). Doesn't that technically make them one of the LEAST corrupted races we know of?

Trolls came to be in a similar way, even though the Well of Eternity sped up the evolutionary process or something. We could add elves too despite the direct arcane radiation, which isn't related to Old Gods or the Void anyway.

So Harbingers movie now applies to MU Gul'dan too.

Called it. People kept arguing on that but I knew there weren't going to leave such story AU-relegated. It wasn't the case with the Warlords and surely that wasn't going to be either.

To be fair, they never were, Kil'jaeden was there all the time. Before, Gul'dan was just a shaman apprentice that learned about the Beautiful One and learned everything from him, doing the Legion's bidding. Now, he is the manipulator that forced all the events that led to the war against the Draenei and the creation of the Horde. If anything, the Chronicles' Gul'dan is a bigger piece for the entire story than the WC2 Gul'dan ever was.


On the other hand, poor Ner'zhul. The torturing part is new.

Exactly. Gul'dan feels like a way bigger and manipulative shadow behind the creation of the Horde. I especially found disturbing him slaughtering the very last remnants of the Bladewind to better sell the idea draenei were on the full offensive against the orcs.

It's because Blizzard changed the orcish shamanism from necromantic (in Warcraft Adventures, Thrall had to learn necromantic magic to become a shaman) to elemental in WC3.

If anything, it's nice that Chronicles brings back the necromantic shamanism side of the Shadowmoon.

Well, Volume 1 pretty much confirmed that Dark Shamanism comes from the very existential element giving birth to Necromancy.

• Kilrogg led BH orcs to Farahlon to destroy last bastion of Primals
• Ogre shipwrights built ships for them, Kilrogg accustomed to jungles of Farahlon
• Orcs leeched life and set forests ablaze, killing every genesaur and botani

Yeah, that's ma boi. Kilrogg rekted those plant bitches hard.

And lol to Cho'gall burning Mar'gok alive.

It's official, Gul'dan is a brutal bastard beyond compare. Carpet bombing Shattrath with Red Pox and Infernals? Damn.


Gorefiend summoned Murmur... /slowclap

Seriously, this is glorious. In a horribly creepy kind of way, but it is.

That's true - the younger generation would've never seen it and therefore had no real knowledge of its horrors.

That's also explains the existence of so many sympathizers of the Old Horde in the younger generation, idolozing a past fully of glory in their minds without the knowledge and experience of its horrors.

And "unexplored" is they keyword. Also, the whole thing about priests... Well, plenty of priests in the game already, that have nothing to do with the Holy Light. Like trolls, they heal through the Loa or Gnomes who are basically combat medics. The Night Elves use the power of Elune and the Moon, not the Holy Light. And so on and so forth.

I think "the Light" ultimately remain the one and only source. It's the strong faith in something that makes you wield it, be the Loa, Elune or the Sun. Well, at least in most cases. The High Priests of Zul'Gurub seem to be their own thing completely.

The Stormwind-Gurubashi War is now canon, nice.

EDIT: For those that doesn't know, the Gurubashi War was written for the movie prequel comic. Awful comic, but the concept was good.

I'm really glad of that. I would have loved to see that in the movie but they eventually shoehorned it in that god-awful comic. At least it's canon where it counts now. And yeah, I'm glad they replaced the fel with Hakkari blood magic. It didn't make sense and was clearly there as a way to excuse the corruption of Medivh in the movieverse.

[ravenmoon]

Illidan was specifically enchanted by Sargeras himself all those years ago and has lived with part of Sargeras' magic on him for millenia. I'd say that makes him a uniquely suited vessel.

then what about all that stuff of the golden eyes, and destiny etc.. is that an educated guess or was it explicitly stated? It's a good point, although every Satyr, eredar will qualify too, so why not them? Some sort of punishment? or is there really more to Illidan.

It appears Illidan lost to Arthas not because Arthas is more powerful necessarily, but moreso because Illidan was new to his acquired power and overconfident - his first major duel since release.

[Deleted]

Yet they had him further the Legions goals in Warlords by summoning Archimonde. In the MU, this world was about to become a bridge to the most important world for the Legion ever. It makes no sense at all for the Legion to suddendly pull out their assets, then go back in and try to use Draenor as an invasion bridge years later when it was open to them there and then.

Sargeras ordered the pull so the orcs would became desperate and ask for more. His plan would actually work if it wasn't for the death of Medivh and Gul'dan's greed.

[Deleted]

Yet they had him further the Legions goals in Warlords by summoning Archimonde. In the MU, this world was about to become a bridge to the most important world for the Legion ever. It makes no sense at all for the Legion to suddendly pull out their assets, then go back in and try to use Draenor as an invasion bridge years later when it was open to them there and then.

Also note that it was not KJ who wanted to cut off contact with Gul'dan in this new lore, trust dosent factor into it. The new lore is basically "Sargeras wanted the mortals of Azeroth to stand a chance to survive so he forced KJ to remove all Legion forces from Draenor and cut all contact for no reason at all."

It's a terrible decision from Sargeras who is supposed to be intimidating. The old lore was better: "KJ abandoned the orcs, Sargeras found them and realized he could use them." That makes sense as to why there were almost no Demons in the Horde. But now instead we have Sargeras "tuning down the difficulty for the mortals" for no reason on his invasion of Azeroth.

It's actually explained in the preview (see kids, this is a beautiful example of why one should always wait to read the final product before forming any judgment), it'S because of Medivh. Sargeras is not able to control Medivh fully, he has to twist his thoughts and manipulate him. Having a demon infested Horde would make that impossible, Medivh would never open the way for them.

[Kontinuum]

Having more demons would probably be bad for orcs' morale - several clans were already insane at the moment.

Parts 9-15.

[Shampro]

Medivh has seen some shit. He had a first seat view of the massacre of the Draenei, Draenor going to shit, etc.

[Shizari]

Aegyween went to try and kill her own son to save the world once she learned the truth, had a blue dragon with her and still lost. That's some powerful stuff.

[Shizari]

Aegwynn was no longer a Guardian at this point, she passed her powers to Medivh long ago. Yet she still managed to get a Guardian who was empowered by Sargeras himself to PANIC

I know, I can't wait to see the full text of this bit, because just those little bullet points really hooked me in.

[derpkitteh]

aegwynn was able to stand with him at least. that's guardian power + whatever amount of sargeras' power left over from the avatar.

that makes me think that, as a guardian, aegwynn was stronger than medivh. i think medivh just wasn't as power of a non-guardian mage as aegwynn was. so guardian power + medivh personal power = weaker guardian. aegwynn personal power + guardian power = stronger guardian.

[Kontinuum]

Aegwynn had a dragon... he didn't last long though.

[Deleted]

Aegwynn had a dragon... he didn't last long though.

Poor Nightbane.

[Kontinuum]

Poor Netherspire.

Arcanagos/Nightbane

[Deleted]

It's actually explained in the preview (see kids, this is a beautiful example of why one should always wait to read the final product before forming any judgment), it'S because of Medivh. Sargeras is not able to control Medivh fully, he has to twist his thoughts and manipulate him. Having a demon infested Horde would make that impossible, Medivh would never open the way for them.

Sargeras had excellent control over Medivh, he forced him to kill his servants, murder pretty much the entire Order of Tirisfal, open the Dark Portal and nearly kill his own mother. Sargeras not having control or the Orcs not accepting a "human" as their leader is no excuse for this. Kil'Jaeden or Archimonde could have easily led the Demon army.....which is exactly what we see when Gul'dan enforces the Legion's will on the Horde in Tanaan during Warlords.

The new conversation between KJ and Archimonde during Shattrah should have gone realistically gone down like this:

KJ: "Master, I have enslaved the Orcs through this Warlock Gul'dan, what is your bidding?"
Sargeras: "Excellent, my Avatar can open the way to this world through a portal and we will once again invade Azeroth in a full invasion! I will sit back and only open the portal while you Order Gul'dan to Fel infuse the entire Horde, start building forge camps and summon Archimonde. Then when the portal is ready, a the Might of the Legion will pour onto Azeroth!


But that is not what happened, instead the new lore has is go down like this:

KJ: "Master, I have enslaved the Orcs through this Warlock Gul'dan, what is your bidding?"
Sargeras "STOP TALKING TO THE ORCS RIGHT NOW!" I WANT THEM TO INVADE AZEROTH BUT YOU MUST GIVE THEM NO SUPPORT AT ALL BECASUE THAT JUST WOULDNT BE FAIR FOR THE MORTALS ON AZEROTH!!!!"
KJ: "Master, that does not seem wise, we have perfect oppertunity here to....."
Sargeras: "NO, WE DO IT MY TERRIBLY INEFFEICIENT WAY! I WANT THE ORCS UNRULY SO THEY WILL BEG FOR MORE OR SOMETHING!"


See what I mean? Sargeras is supposed to be smart and cunning. Not fully taking over the orcs and using them to get the Legion to Azeroth (Which we know they can do on Draenor as per Warlords) makes him far less of a villain then he should be. The guy had an "I-win-button" and decided not to use it because "He wanted the orcs mad and desperate" which makes no sense.

So far two arguments in defense of this obvious plot hole have been debunked:

1. Kil'jaden didnt use Gul'dan becasue he didnt trust him is not true because the order to not aid the orcs came from Sargeras.
2. Sargeras cant control Medivh isnt rue either because all Medivh has to do here is open the portal...which he did.

What we are left with is Sargeras having brain damage and not understanding how to invade properly. Geez, what a good villain!

[derpkitteh]

Poor Netherspire.

Arcanagos/Nightbane

arcanagos becomes nightbane, who the fuck is netherspite and why is he there?

[Deleted]

Arcanagos/Nightbane

Ops, right, don't even know why I wrote spire.

[TheFirstOnes]

Roses are red

Violets are blue

Nightbane still lasts

In some lucky shits own bag

[Deleted]

Sargeras had excellent control over Medivh, he forced him to kill his servants, murder pretty much the entire Order of Tirisfal, open the Dark Portal and nearly kill his own mother.

That's what the Chronicles explains, that Sargeras didn't had absolute control over Medivh.

And again, his plan was going nicely, if it wasn't for the unexpected death of Medivh and Gul'dan's greed.

[Kontinuum]

arcanagos becomes nightbane, who the fuck is netherspite and why is he there?

The only lore about him is from Hearthstone (??)
http://hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Netherspite#Lore

[Friendlyimmolation]

Roses are red

Violets are blue

Nightspire still lasts

In some lucky shits own bag

what ? Am I missing something here.