Equal pay law did not close the gender gap

[Daymanmb]

So you want to push to close the pay gap for short people as well as women?

Go start a group and watch the right wing shills on this forum heap scorn on you. The left will be delighted to have you, most likely.

The level of argument youre responding to is the equivilent of a meme of Paramedics against raising minimum wage.. or using All Live Matter as a counter-argument to Black Live Matter.. It just doesnt appeal to logic...

[Dreknar20]

. The fact is, its a reality.

yeah the reality.

A [I]earnings[I] gap. Women earn less than men. Not unfairly being paid less

[Daymanmb]

yeah the reality.

A [I]earnings[I] gap. Women earn less than men. Not unfairly being paid less

Wait, so if a woman works the same hours in a week and on average, makes less than men for the same work, youre saying there isnt a gap? Do you know what a gap is? Maybe we should start there.. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/gap (refer to part 3)

[Beazy]

Yes you did.



You didn't use any of that. Like, I can't believe that you think that screaming something over and over again like a child is somehow "proof" or "logic".

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So they had to work in a field that actually required skill. That...doesn't prove your point. Also, proof that you're any sort of programmer, por favor.



[citation needed]



As an actual programmer, maybe you shouldn't pretend to have a job.

Did you have a rebuttal? Or just more proof that you are uneducated?

[Gref]

there are many people arguing here but I have yet to see any of you claim;
I have exactly the same years of experience, previous achievements, education etc. to the opposite sex and while he/she is getting paid more while I am getting paid less for the exact same job.

Anybody? No? Then stfu.

[Daymanmb]

there are many people arguing here but I have yet to see any of you claim;
I have exactly the same years of experience, previous achievements, education etc. to the opposite sex and while he/she is getting paid more while I am getting paid less for the exact same job.

Anybody? No? Then stfu.

Come on.. so you'd prefer anecdotal evidence of someone in these forums, reading this as proof it exists? Why doesnt data from thousands, if not millions of people appeal to you?

[Jinpachi]

The issue seems to be more related to systemic discrimination than how much they are paid. I.E Women get hire less frequently than men.

Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense. Site specific instances or don't bother with this shitposting.

[Deletedaccount1]

Nice alt facts. Meanwhile, real facts:

snip

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender..._United_States

You can rationalise it however you want but the gap itself is a fact.

From that same wikipedia article:

The average woman's unadjusted annual salary has been cited as 78%[2] to 82%[3] of that of the average man's. However, after adjusting for choices made by male and female workers in college major, occupation, working hours, and parental leave, multiple studies find that pay rates between males and females varied by 5–6.6% or, females earning 94 cents to every dollar earned by their male counterparts. The remaining 6% of the gap has been speculated to originate from deficiency in salary negotiation skills and gender discrimination.

So it is largely bullshit.

[Dreknar20]

You can rationalise it however you want but the gap itself is a fact.

and?

A discrepancy in stats proves............that there is a discrepancy in stats.
Its a whole other step to prove why said discrepancy exists

Either that or your using some moron circular logic.

[Jinpachi]

I'm noticing everyone is talking about white collar office jobs, and not jobs that really matter, where people actually produce a good or a service. The pay gap is due to differing choices by women and men, and NOT by any "patriarchal boogeymen" or "systemic discrimination". To assert otherwise is to play the victim, and serves no purpose but to guilt shame those who put the work in to become successful.

[Dreknar20]

The gap is usually there because women tend to work less hours, less overhours, and in the longterm also are less interested in taking on promotions and greater responsibility. Women's interest is much more on their family and family time, while a lot of men are very used to working 1-2 hours overtime on a daily basis

Also more likely to move another state if their job moves.

All in all, just more likely to sacrifice for job. Probably why we are also more likely to commit suicide

[Jinpachi]

ITT: a bunch of anti-feminist gap pay deniers with no interest in discussing the actual OP.

Relevant portion:



Ie, the law isn't effective enough.



You realise that for the law to fail to close the gender pay gap, that gap must exist?

And, you know, it does. Regardless of what right wing fringe websites would like you to believe.



Nice alt facts. Meanwhile, real facts:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender..._United_States

You can rationalise it however you want but the gap itself is a fact.

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So you want to push to close the pay gap for short people as well as women?

Go start a group for short people and watch the right wing shills on this forum heap scorn on you. In fact didn't we have a thread just like that?

The pay gap exists, but not due to any form of discrimination whatsoever.

[urasim]

Wait, so if a woman works the same hours in a week and on average, makes less than men for the same work, youre saying there isnt a gap? Do you know what a gap is? Maybe we should start there.. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/gap (refer to part 3)

If you actually read the studies, you'd find that the gap is minuscule.

You're just not factoring in EVERYTHING. You're basing this shit off of a single number. You're simplifying shit that is extremely complex.

They don't.

The gap is usually there because women tend to work less hours, less overhours, and in the longterm also are less interested in taking on promotions and greater responsibility. Women's interest is much more on their family and family time, while a lot of men are very used to working 1-2 hours overtime on a daily basis.

If you want to talk about a wage gap, then consider that there is a wage gap in favour of women when we look at the average earnings of people <35yo. Consider also the fact that much more women earn graduate degrees and tend to get higher grades on average than men, and that in many cases families with stay at home dads tend to earn more than families with stay at home moms.

To be 100% fair. There are places that have been caught, and prosecuted, for giving less to females. There are also fields that give females an extreme advantage(STEM favoring females at a 2 to 1 ratio for one example). There's some discrimination, but it's no where near what these people say.

[Delana]

Once again stupid argument since you can add controls for that and doesn't really rebute the discrimination argument.

What discrimination argument? There are very serious legal penalties for paying a woman less when she does the same work as a man. Let's find just one clear-cut case of that before we assume that the correction for systematic error caused by career choice is sufficient, and that therefore everyone is discriminating.

Just because outcomes aren't equal doesn't mean there is discrimination. Just means many women make different choices. I don't think I would have spent 6.5 years in grad school if I was a woman.

[Jinpachi]

Or to give western women even more privileges and advantages while they already are the most privileged group of human beings on the planet, getting every regulation and act of positive discrimination thrown at them -at the cost- of the well being of men.

Go to any factory and spout that wage gap bullshit. They will laugh you off of the floor. Seriously, this argument ALWAYS only talks about corporate salaries, which aren't set in stone and vary from woman to woman, let alone man to man, or woman to man. People need to put more focus into being a better person to the people in their small worlds than getting on their soap boxes on the interwebz

[Dreknar20]

I'm noticing everyone is talking about white collar office jobs, and not jobs that really matter, where people actually produce a good or a service.

Its almost like .... the more power/money involved in a job, the more 'equality' matters.

Never hear anyone crying foal the injustice of equality in construction or the porta potty cleaning industries

[Gref]

Come on.. so you'd prefer anecdotal evidence of someone in these forums, reading this as proof it exists? Why doesnt data from thousands, if not millions of people appeal to you?

Millions? There is not a single research that is wholly complete. Without any missing points. There are so many points that make a difference between two people' salaries. The biggest crap I hear is omg we do the exact same job but he gets more why? Look;

Man with 10 Achievements apply to a position, employer sees it and is impressed, offers high salary to keep him refusing or going away. Then the woman comes. Definitely qualified but but 0 achievements. Nothing to be impressed but will definitely get the job done. Employer offers less. If it was a single position, the man would be chosen over the woman anytime, if two positions, while the man is indispensable, the woman is disposable (yes dispose) as there are shit loads of other people who are definitely qualified like her.

Give me a one single case. One single case. Bring me a woman and man with exactly same qualifications, achievements etc then make them talk here, face to face.

People' worth's are different. So is their salaries in these cases. If anything what I have seen is positive discrimination for women. Back when working in a university I had a call from another "woman" colleague, telling me if I can take her 8 night classes. She says she is a woman, it can be dangerous at night etc. (which is a flat out lie as the city had 0 crime) and she has kids etc. Sorry but fuck you? did you ask my permission to have kids? Our salary is same contract is same, everything is same. Then the manager called and kindly requested and of course I wouldn't say no to the department manager. I worked more, got same money, came back home late, the bitch went home early made her 4th kid.

IF anything there should be a wage gap. Men should get much more. Women is liability in most cases. That is what life taught me.

[Aquinan]

no the way they are doing it, is grabbing 500 women, and 500 men, seeing how much they earn combined, dividing it by the said 500 again, to work out how much more men are earning than women on an average.

they arent looking at the jobs they are looking at the figures only.

hence why this whole fucking idea is stupid.

if they looked at indivual jobs it would get better to understand.

Get 500 female hairdressers and 500 male surgeons...ERRMERRGERRG INEQUALITY

[Daymanmb]

IF anything there should be a wage gap. Men should get much more. Women is liability in most cases. That is what life taught me.

Well, I know what Im dealing with...

[Hisholyness]

ITT: a bunch of anti-feminist gap pay deniers with no interest in discussing the actual OP.

Relevant portion:

Ie, the law isn't effective enough.

You realise that for the law to fail to close the gender pay gap, that gap must exist?

And, you know, it does. Regardless of what right wing fringe websites would like you to believe.

Nice alt facts. Meanwhile, real facts:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender..._United_States

You can rationalise it however you want but the gap itself is a fact.

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So you want to push to close the pay gap for short people as well as women?

Go start a group for short people and watch the right wing shills on this forum heap scorn on you. In fact didn't we have a thread just like that?

You don't "change" the "pay gap" by increasing the amount of money women make. You "change" the "pay gap" by fundamentally changing the way women consider and actually work. When women ACTUALLYwork the same jobs and times as men the "pay gap" will fix itself because there will be no more natural discrepancies among genders.