Scotland's First Minister, Nicola Sturgeon, calls for fresh independence referendum

[Puremallace]

Source: http://www.cnbc.com/2017/03/13/scotl...to-brexit.html

Over under on this? UK did make a lot of promises to Scotland that got them to stay and now they are trying to pull out of the Euro. This would hammer the Scottish economy. Xenophobia in the UK has already cost them billions and gutted the value of the pound. It is going to get much worse once the EU starts bleeding the UK.

The Scottish leader said she expected a referendum to take place sometime between Autumn next year and the Spring of 2019.

In a speech in Edinburgh, the First Minister said that the language of partnership from the United Kingdom had "gone completely" in relation to Scotland's view on Brexit.

Sturgeon told reporters that she will take steps to make sure Scotland will have the choose whether to become an independent country.

Sturgeon said she is not turning back on further discussions should UK government change mind.

In 2014, Scotland voted to remain a member of the United Kingdom.

[Deletedaccount1]

They may take our lives, but they will never take our freedom

[Deleted]

Think it's only fair for Scotland as their main, if not, the only reason to remain part of the UK was so they could stay in the EU. Now there's Brexit. Not sure how it will impact Scotland and if they can stay in the EU when they leave or can rejoin... But yeah.

[Valerean]

(If) indyref2 goes ahead, Scotland will do exactly what it did 3 years ago and vote with its wallet.

With oil trading at circa 50% of what it was in 2014, the UK coming out of the EU as a whole and an independent Scotland facing having to apply for membership from scratch, Wee Crankie is asking her compatriots for a lot more than Mr Salmond did last time.

Have a feeling she will get the same answer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[caervek]

Over under on this?

Two big problems here:

1: She doesn't have the power ot call a referendum.

2: Last time only 37% of Scottish voters voted to stay in the EU, the rest either wanted to leave or didn't care either way, and the prospects of independance have gotten much worse since. That's not exactly a great basis to stake the fate of your career on (it was her predecessors defeat in the last ref that gave her the job).

[Puremallace]

Now, I like everyone else was patient after the first vote, we voted No, and we let the UK prove us wrong, that we were a valued member, but that hasnt been the case, its an almost indefensible position to say that the UK is listening to our voice. I'm personally a bit worried that the vote might be too soon, however I do hope the vote this time round, will be one thats conducted in a manner befitting a developed country as our own.

Well I think she is extremely smart to say it would be Spring 2019 because by then every single minor detail about Brexit would be out in public and I guarantee even the UK citizens will hate it. Good chance they end up having to pay out 64 billion to the Euro countries to get out. I seriously doubt Merkel will be gracious towards the UK especially if she wins re-election and if Lepen gets beat in France.

If Lepen wins and Merkel goes down then you can kiss the Euro goodbye and the only person smiling then would be Putin as it would create absolute chaos across the entire Euro zone.

[Elba]

If Lepen wins and Merkel goes down then you can kiss the Euro goodbye and the only person smiling then would be Putin as it would create absolute chaos across the entire Euro zone.

Why would Merkel going down mean the end of the Euro? Her opponent, Martin Schulz, was president of the European Parliament, rofl.

[Deleted]

I wounder what currency Scotland would use if they voted to leave the UK, I doubt they could keep the British pound and wouldn't be able to use the euro either as they would not be a member of the EU.

[caervek]

Now, I like everyone else was patient after the first vote, we voted No, and we let the UK prove us wrong, that we were a valued member, but that hasnt been the case, its an almost indefensible position to say that the UK is listening to our voice.

Out of interest, in what way is the UK not listening to your voice? You were given increased devolved power (Scotland Act 2016) as per the vow made during the first independence referendum campaign.

[caervek]

I wounder what currency Scotland would use if they voted to leave the UK, I doubt they could keep the British pound and wouldn't be able to use the euro either as they would not be a member of the EU.

They could still use either (just like many countries use US dollars) or they could just use scottish pounds and peg their currency to the pound/Euro.

[caervek]

I dont consider token gestures as listening to our voice, the ability to control taxation is something every country should have at a basic level. Clawing back autonomy doesnt equate to respect.

In fairness you were given the ability to raise/lower income tax in 1999, your government has just never chose to use it iirc, you also have control over property tax, and you now get half the VAT generated in Scotland assigned directly to the Scottish government's budget.

I mean, you do have the best deal of any country in the UK lol.

[Mormolyce]

Honestly it's a fucking mess and almost certainly Putin is sitting back rubbing his greasy palms together watching Europe tear itself apart.

[Machismo]

They would have to issue their own currency though (which is both costly and takes anything from 6 months to two years). And maintaining a peg is costly and requires a central bank with significant reserves (not that they'd have another option; outside of a peg they'd be a free meal for currency speculators and their inflation would likely not be stable)

I assume that if they voted to leave, then the EU would gladly scoop them up, and cover the currency issue quite quickly.

[caervek]

The rational decision would have been to postpone the Scottish independence referendum until after the Brexit referendum had taken place.

Had that happened:
a) If the UK had voted for Brexit, Scottish Independence would likely have succeeded as a referendum (especially if held just months after when the shock and uncertainty was fresh)

You are assuming that the Scots who voted to remain in the EU wouldn't have done so if they knew for certain it meant leaving the EU. Granted there are probably a few "no" voters who wish they could take it back, but there are also a fair few yes voters who wanted to leave the EU. As it stands the vast majority of Scots either wanted to leave the EU or didn't care either way, those actively supporting EU membership are a minority and it's unlikely they would have swung the independence referendum (it's actually plausible that the "no" vote would have won by a larger margin).

[Puremallace]

Why would Merkel going down mean the end of the Euro? Her opponent, Martin Schulz, was president of the European Parliament, rofl.

Better wording would be if she goes down to the anti immigrant party in Germany. Either way the markets see Merkel as an extremely strong figure in Europe and her getting defeated would send shockwaves.

[Puupi]

I wounder what currency Scotland would use if they voted to leave the UK, I doubt they could keep the British pound and wouldn't be able to use the euro either as they would not be a member of the EU.

UK, and therefore Scotland, hasn't left the EU yet.

[caervek]

They would have to issue their own currency though (which is both costly and takes anything from 6 months to two years). And maintaining a peg is costly and requires a central bank with significant reserves (not that they'd have another option; outside of a peg they'd be a free meal for currency speculators and their inflation would likely not be stable)

They do sort of have most of it in place already though. Scottish banknotes are proxies for UK pounds held by the issuing Scottish banks, they would just need to issue coins too (assuming they don't, I've never seen any just Scottish notes).

[Deleted]

Do they have enough of an economy to hold up their own pants?

I don't think the EU is to keen to have another "Greece" in the union.

[Rockyreg]

Source: http://www.cnbc.com/2017/03/13/scotl...to-brexit.html

Over under on this? UK did make a lot of promises to Scotland that got them to stay and now they are trying to pull out of the Euro. This would hammer the Scottish economy. Xenophobia in the UK has already cost them billions and gutted the value of the pound. It is going to get much worse once the EU starts bleeding the UK.

I would still argue that the grounds for another referendum are not there. People knew when they voted in 2014 that there could be an upcoming EU referendum.

We are also constantly being told that any trade agreement between the EU and the UK will take years. So how will the Scottish people know what they are voting for in 2018/2019?

[Tennis]

Let's get it done. Scotlanders deserve freedom.

Yeah it's overdue, but better late than never. Let your people stand on their own 2 feet.