Dutch Voters Divided As Election Signals Another Test For Anti-Immigrant Populism

[Fleuria]

Bad policy to take people who can't find work..

So you are pro anti-immigration by that statement? because it actually happens quite a lot people move to new countries because unemployment is better than what they would of gotten in there country of origin, then people whine because they wonder why people want stricter checks on borders.

[Moratori]

Ethnicity isnt the reason, its culture. Why should any country allow mass immigration from anywhere that the core cultural values of the host country are in opposition to the peoples country of origin.

Given the raising crime rates in many EU countries that can be correlated with rising immigration from ME and NA, its pretty reasonable that the natives are getting restless.

So that justifies discrimination against people on the basis of their ethnicity? Anyone can belong to any culture but they specifically target people based on ethnicity.

[JohnBrown1917]

It's irrelevant where you live. Any time anyone brings about the cons of immigration and are shouted down with "RACIST!" a Trump supporter was born.

Haha wtf, no wonder if the US is laughing stock to some if that is how people vote.




RACIST
RACIST
RACIST
RACISt

[Moratori]

So you are pro anti-immigration by that statement? because it actually happens quite a lot people move to new countries because unemployment is better than what they would of gotten in there country of origin, then people whine because they wonder why people want stricter checks on borders.

I'm pro having a good immigration policy. That includes not discriminating people on the basis of their ethnicity/race/religion.

[alexw]

Here we go:

Impact on host country

Negative
Depression of wages may occur but this seems to be temporary.
Having workers willing to work for relatively low pay may allow employers to ignore productivity, training and innovation.
Migrants may be exploited.
Increases in population can put pressure on public services.
Unemployment may rise if there are unrestricted numbers of incomers.
There may be integration difficulties and friction with local people.
Large movements of people lead to more security monitoring.
Ease of movement may facilitate organised crime and people trafficking.

Impact on country of origin:

Economic disadvantage through the loss of young workers
Loss of highly trained people, especially health workers
Social problems for children left behind or growing up without a wider family circle

Some of these cons can indeed be the cause of bad policy, whereas some cannot be blamed solely on politicians. And just because some of the cons are related to policy does not mean they are not cons.

Yes, that's a great list except that if you look at who is voting for these far right parties and candidates its mostly uneducated older people (older people are far more likely to be racist), and the language and tactics used by them and those who they support are overwhelmingly racist in tone. We call them racists, deplorables, and such like because that is exactly what they are.

[Deleted]

Racism starts when somebody passes judgement on people as an collective entity and not as individuals. Let's say an ethnic japanese person steals your car, and therefore you hate every japanese person on planet earth because in your mind they steal cars, that's racism and makes your opinion irrelevant because your mind has been polluted with racial prejudice.
Many people here have clearly demonstrated that their opinions are irrelevant because their minds are polluted with racist prejudice.

[Theinquisition]

So that justifies discrimination against people on the basis of their ethnicity? Anyone can belong to any culture but they specifically target people based on ethnicity.

Because the culture in question is predominamt among that specific people seeking to migrate?

Like i said, its about culture not ethnicity.

[Noradin]

Funfact,


Wilders made integration harder by supporting privatizing the integration courses.
He could have prevented it

But then he would have removed some of that which gives him the opportunity to gain votes with his polulist rhetoric.
It is in his best interest to make the situation worse if he can without his voter base catching on.

[Deleted]

I am giving you arguments yet you choose to ignore them

First things first.

I am not calling you a racist out of spite nor as a way to shortcircuit debate. I think we all are a little racist inside, probably myself included even though I try not to. As I said I think racism/xenophobia is an inherent trait in humanity and no governmental decision would change that - it is up to you to feel attacked by me using a word. It's not something I consider inherently bad as if I would, I would lose faith in humanity pretty fast!

Nor am I calling you dumb (please show me) - thinking for a second does not imply I consider you dumb - but that this issue is not something that politics will solve. It's an issue that politics can't solve.

And because I am a decent human being and I feel everyone that wants to come here and build a better life (within our societies standards, of course!) should be welcome. Regardless of race or ethnic group. Let alone Syrians - since we brought that upon ourselves. (and before you point it out, with WE I mean the west, not the Netherlands in particular)

I mean if you'd be born in a piss poor country you would also strive for a better life somewhere else. And would be glad if other countries would offer you that opportunity.

I have given you plenty of examples to show that your view of immigrants might not be exactly the truth.
But if you want a very specific example - I am now coaching a guy whose family immigrated here from Algeria. Speaks fluent Dutch (his parents a little less, but he helps them with it) and has been trying to land a job ever since he graduated last year. In the past 12 months he has send over 300 job applications, roughly 20 got answered negatively, and ALL the others were simply never replied to at all.

He has the papers, he has the education, speaks the language, likes "kroketten" and dutch cheese, and if not for the color of his skin and his name, you would never guess he is not native Dutch.

Needless to say he is very frustrated and had a different view of our great western society. And that is one guy out of hundreds that I also had the pleasure to help. The forums here wouldn't be big enough to list them all.

You suggested i should think, therefor implying i did not, that is calling me dumb or incapable of thinking.

But i'm glad you cleared that all up.

Now i agree with you about that people who want to come and build a better live should be welcome, i was one of those, i was born in a less developed country.
I have also lived in a neighbourhood where the moroccans were in "charge" and i now live in a neighbourhood that those people can't afford and therefor i have no issues with them. But i have not forgotten how my years were in those neighbourhoods and everything i have said still stands and you can't possible argue with it because i agree with most of your points.

[jtstormrage]

The Netherlands has 28 parties. Noone can make a government without forming a coalition.

Every party has ruled out a coalition with Wilders. Wilders will never get into power. He can pretty much be ignored.

[JohnBrown1917]

But then he would have removed some of that which gives him the opportunity to gain votes with his polulist rhetoric.
It is in his best interest to make the situation worse if he can without his voter base catching on.

Yes, that is the point.

[alexw]

Fuck off with racist, Because we don't like 1 kind of group in our country doesn't make us racist.
Fuck off with that retarded statement. We have all the rights to not want immigrants here after all the things they done and not seen as racist.

Well you are a racist so what is wrong with pointing out what you are? I mean just because you don't like people pointing out the truth about you doesn't mean it should not be done. And before you go making claims that you are not for others to read your posting history is full or racist/xenophobic/Neo-Nazi type posts such as -

Let's hope the refugees will be send to auschwitz

Make Germany Reise Again!


[Infracted]

Sure, that is why majority of crime and rapes come from refugees in most countries. We don't want them.

Etc. Etc.

[Moratori]

Because the culture in question is predominamt among that specific people seeking to migrate?

Like i said, its about culture not ethnicity.

Targeting people based on ethnicity is racist no matter how you try to spin it.

[Collegeguy]

Make Holland Geert Again

He kinda looks like he went super saiyan.

[Deleted]

So you think wanting less people of x ethnicity is not racist? In what universe do you live where discrimination against people on the basis of ethnicity is not racism?

Immigration is a privilege, not a right. A person or a country is free to extend their invitation to whomever they wish, on whatever grounds they wish and it's not and will never be an issue of racism.

[Moratori]

Immigration is a privilege, not a right. A person or a country is free to extend their invitation to whomever they wish, on whatever grounds they wish and it's not and will never be an issue of racism.

If you discriminate people because of their ethnicity/race it is racism, no matter how you try to spin it.

[Deleted]

If you discriminate people because of their ethnicity/race it is racism, no matter how you try to spin it.

I don't think you understand what discrimination entails if you think that closing borders (or prohibiting immigration) is discrimination under the law.

[gyrados]

Everything is racist when you have no idea what you're talking about. Brainwashing at it's finest.

pretty much thats liberal 101 these days although they arent liberals they are regressives lets be honest lol

[Moratori]

I don't think you understand what discrimination entails if you think that closing borders (or prohibiting immigration) is discrimination under the law.

That doesn't make it not racist. It just means the racism is instituationalized.

- - - Updated - - -

pretty much thats liberal 101 these days although they arent liberals they are regressives lets be honest lol

I'm not a liberal.

[Sama-81]

Targeting people based on ethnicity is racist no matter how you try to spin it.

You do realize that targeting people from a specific country isn't necessarily racist, right? It very well could be, absolutely, but it most certainly doesn't have to be either. That ought to be self evident for anyone with a brain and the time/inclination to use it. Also, arguing that there aren't any cons with immigration, is not even an argument unless you're specifically talking about very modest volumes. For one, my home country is the top western country when it comes to immigration (well, until recently), and here pretty much everyone, including official statistics, are crystal clear regarding the economic reality of it - it's a large net loss economically, even when talking about a time span of some 50 years into the future. There's literally no policy that can alter that fact, none, when the volumes are what they are.