[7.2] Legion Holy Priest Discussion

[Rici]

So what about a heavy crit/mastery build with Muze's in 7.2?

Well... what about a heavy crit/mastery build also without Muze? And in 7.1.5. And in 7.0.
Holy Priest in Legion was always about those two stats. 7.1.5 just brought secondary stats closer to each other, but those two will still be our top priority.

[cruxxy]

Well... what about a heavy crit/mastery build also without Muze? And in 7.1.5. And in 7.0.
Holy Priest in Legion was always about those two stats. 7.1.5 just brought secondary stats closer to each other, but those two will still be our top priority.

Well I'm seeing holy priests run with more haste for the PoH approach. Seems like Muze could replace that.

What would the calculation be? Does Muze's effect essentially equate to 15% haste for those spells? I know it doesn't affect PoM or GCD but 15% haste is 5600 haste rating?

[Deleted]

Hello !

I decided to contribute to T0oky's topic about the current priest state in raid. For me, the main issue is its utility and not its throughput. Here's my post.

By the way, I want to thank (I'm super late...) the priest's community for helping me report the Say your Prayers' bug. It's great to be able to count on you

[rosastolemyseat]

I can't post on EU forums(at least I'm not sure how), so I'll just respond to your post here.

I don't want the same utility than druids, shamans or paladins, I just want some that can be comparable with them and opens rooms for more diversity inside a healing roster.

You want us to be different, but then you go ahead and ask them to give us the extra health that shamans already give players? Mind elaborating on this?

This is why, sometimes, I think they should rechange it for EoL and make it tick 3 times, at 2, 4 and 6 sec. Maybe with more value at 2 and then decrease over the time.

EoL is already too strong, even with the overheal. At the moment, with just one tick from our mastery, PoH heals almost as much as a shaman with chain heal. Putting more upfront healing from EoL into our kit would just exponentially increase our hps and put us way ahead of every other healer.

Also, why are you trying to give us even more throughput? Didn't you say that our problem wasn't throughput, it was utility? This change is largely insignificant to our state and it'd just make PoH/Sanctify way too strong.

For Cosmic Ripple, I'm clearly not a huge fan. I prefer something like :
When Sanctify hits, it leaves a zone for 30 sec where targets receive +x% healing (druids got 20% with their efflorescence, maybe same amount ?). Only 1 (or 2) zones at a time. It can use the ancient Sanctuary graphic effect, maybe less invasive.
Perhaps in addition to this, a line about Serenity, like :
When Serenity hits, 50% (?) of the healing done is duplicated over 2 (?) targets within 10 yards.

Please elaborate on why you do not like Cosmic Ripple. This just seems like another insignificant change that will do absolutely nothing to our current state other than increasing HPS which is the same as Cosmic Ripple.

Divine Trance : You enter in trance and can cast on movement for 10 sec. 2 min cd.
You could use it for DH or for PoH spamming too, it's up to the priest and the encounter.

Once again, you don't want the same things as the other healers. So, you just give us what shamans already have?

Guardian Angel could have its cd shorter, 3 min and buff x% of versatility in addition of healing for example.

This changes absolutely nothing. G.S. is largely useless because damage reduction>healing. It also can't cheese mechanics like seeker swarm. The only time that it is even remotely useful is when a tank is taking consistent high damage and that only really happens in the last phase of High Botanist. There's rarely any situation where G.S. is consistently useful and it is not because it has a 4 minute cd. Every other cd in the game would still be better even if it had a 3 minute cd.

My dream would be a PoM instant cast and Surge of Light baseline like a long long time ago.

I wouldn't mind this at all. However, if you were to combine this+the shaman spell you'd like to give us, it'd be overkill. We'd probably have the third most mobility if this happened. At this point, I surely wouldn't mind at least one spell being insta cast.

[Deleted]

I'm sorry if it was not clear enough that what I propose was not to be taken as is because implementing everything would make the Holy Priest too powerful. There is some balancing to do even if only one of this proposition was implemented, same for other healers, balancing one necessit balancing others to be sure that they're competitive.

You want us to be different, but then you go ahead and ask them to give us the extra health that shamans already give players? Mind elaborating on this?

Like I wrote, we were the master of stamina. I don't understand why it's us who lose this. Shamans have already plenty of CDs (HTT, SLT, Ancestral Guidance/Brez Totem, Chain Heal being the last true smart heal of the game...) so they don't need this (the talent and the bonus from their artefact).
And like I wrote in the conclusion, Inspiration can be something else than about stamina but about damage reduction or healing bonus for all healers for example (not high in value for sure).
And for the record, DH was unique (8 min CD, raid-wide and 12 heals to most injured targets), Tranquility was only for the group (8 min CD), HTT didn't even exist and now, every healer have their own version of DH. It's kind of unfair that we share our toolkit with others but never get anything in return.
We have lost so much over the course of time (healing spells (several of them were instant : CoH, proc FH, PoM, glyphed Holy Nova), offensive spells, utility spells (Psychic Scream, Mind vision, Mind Soothe, I used them...)) and so much more in Legion under the pretext of identity (Holy = you're a good soul, you can't interfere with minds and other forms of shadow...). We lose what was the core of the priest with their identity by spec and not by class. And my shaman, for example, have almost all her spells (because a lot of totems are not associated with a spec). But we are not the only class to suffer from this drastic change so it's just something that I regret.

EoL is already too strong, even with the overheal. At the moment, with just one tick from our mastery, PoH heals almost as much as a shaman with chain heal. Putting more upfront healing from EoL into our kit would just exponentially increase our hps and put us way ahead of every other healer.

Also, why are you trying to give us even more throughput? Didn't you say that our problem wasn't throughput, it was utility? This change is largely insignificant to our state and it'd just make PoH/Sanctify way too strong.

For EoL, I tend to sum up a little too much my thoughts but to make it brief, I hate overhealing and if it should be changed, for me of course, I would decrease its value. It's just a note and not a wish about a mastery that was well thought long ago (when it ticks every second) versus its state now (sometimes 30 to 50% overhealing due to its new mechanic).

Please elaborate on why you do not like Cosmic Ripple. This just seems like another insignificant change that will do absolutely nothing to our current state other than increasing HPS which is the same as Cosmic Ripple.

I love to plan the return of my Sanctify or Serenity and keep them for the right moment and with Cosmic Ripple, the risk is overhealing once again. Even if I wait for the CD of Holy Words to come back, if I cast PoM (always on CD normally), if I cast Heal or Flash Heal (my filler spells), I risk to trigger Cosmic Ripple too soon (don't forget the 2p T20 bonus). Like I read on many topics about PTR, it's a new spell for more overhealing and a kind of RNG one and like some people pointed out, Holy is already all about RNG... So no, I don't like this new gold skill.

Once again, you don't want the same things as the other healers. So, you just give us what shamans already have?

I don't really like my idea but I don't want invulnerability during DH. But DH being very complicated to channel, there is a few solutions here : DH castable on movement ? DH gives -50% damage taken to the priest (I think someone has proposed this) ? DH gives -15% damage taken to the raid (proposition from T0oky) so it's normal to be static ? A CD for movement ?
What is your solution here ? I want my DH to be less annoying for my officer who really struggle to put it in the rotation, nor for me because it's not rare that I have to interrupt it or to commit suicide with the legendary cloak.

This changes absolutely nothing. G.S. is largely useless because damage reduction>healing. It also can't cheese mechanics like seeker swarm. The only time that it is even remotely useful is when a tank is taking consistent high damage and that only really happens in the last phase of High Botanist. There's rarely any situation where G.S. is consistently useful and it is not because it has a 4 minute cd. Every other cd in the game would still be better even if it had a 3 minute cd.

Versatility decreases damage taken. I agree, it would become another generic CD for mitigation like Ironbark, Sacrifice... And if it gives an absorb, it's a second Cocoon. There is no solution here. Either it would become a generic CD, or it's just useless...
I love Ray of Hope personally but in its current incarnation, it might be too op.
What is your thoughts about it ?

For the last part, it's just a wish and it helps for more mobility but increases our hps without giving us more utility.
You are correct, I talk about utility and Inspiration is the only solution I propose, I realized it after posted it...

What utility could we bring ? It's an essential question and same goes for MW monks currently.

Another thing that bother me is the fact that many encounters are balanced around big CDs (DH, Tranqui, HTT, Revival, etc.), and another wish/dream of mine would be to erase them to come back to some form of pure healing.

Finally, the only thing that pleases me is our T20 2p and 4p bonuses, but, will mana follow this intensive gameplay (spamming Holy Words) ?


I possess a very complicated mind and it's difficult for me to translate all my thoughts in english and to make it short (which is why I rarely participate in topics and usually stay quiet).

If you want me to post our discussion on the EU topic because it may be interesting, just let me know

[Deleted]

I read the last pages of the thread, and I must say that "We are in a good spot because of the legenday cloak we are OP" like someone wrote is absolute trash: you cannot judge th stte of a spec based on IF a player has a random DROP ITEM.

My suggestion forchange/improvement ould be:

- Enlightment: baseline passive ability, like some healers get from the artifact tree;
- DH: castable while moving or gives the priest a X% reduced amount of damage taken while channeling;
- The last three PvP talents (maybe with numbers/CDs revised) become our lvl 60 row of PvE talents, with Light of the Naaru moved to the 15 row in the place of Enlightment. This would save our nature of "miracolous healer" and would give us some uniqueness worth taking a Holy Priest in a raid.

[anon5123]

Is it just me, or are the extra artifact traits kinda shit?

+20% healing bonus on an ability that has a 45 second cooldown and isn't very useful in raids, a chance to reset cooldown on a self-heal, and getting 1 free Flash Heal's worth of healing, when holy words come off CD....kinda shit compared to Disc getting a small but useful damage reduction on Atonement, a big fat heal added to PS, and practically a flat +50% buff to their best spell.

[Deleted]

Is it just me, or are the extra artifact traits kinda shit?

+20% healing bonus on an ability that has a 45 second cooldown and isn't very useful in raids, a chance to reset cooldown on a self-heal, and getting 1 free Flash Heal's worth of healing, when holy words come off CD....kinda shit compared to Disc getting a small but useful damage reduction on Atonement, a big fat heal added to PS, and practically a flat +50% buff to their best spell.

LoT and DP traits are pretty bad, yes. Cosmic Ripple is okay and should get a lot better with T20.

[anon5123]

Interesting changes. CoH getting +15% healing and -40% cost could make it a very competitive choice, being that it would help with our shitty mobility.

Binding Heal getting -23% cost as well, could make it competitive with Flash Heal, at least in terms of mana efficiency.

[anon5123]

Holy shit man, Holy's damage is OP as fuck now. Smite is critting for 550k. Chastise is critting for 900k. This is ridonkulous.

that awkward moment when a healer is doing more damage with single hits than a dps

[Crimbobbin]

Hola, I'm a raid leader for a small casual guild and we have a holy priest in need of some help. Any info or tips on how to improve her hps would be splendid, as I know next to nothing about healing. Here's our logs for the last couple of days (yes we are bad). Pockithealer is the one that wants to know how to improve.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/bmpqwJNT9yXhacF7
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/RYGf46KhmCBa7tQv

[Caladia]

Not using Prayer of Mending enough. That's a lot of free healing, especially on a fight like Tich where a lot of people have a DoT on them triggering it. It can also leave Renew for free, which is just free additional healing. It doesn't look like he's casting PoH properly after a HW: Sanctify to benefit from Divinity and Power of the Naaru. I usually cast 3 PoH following a HW: Sanctify to benefit from all that bonus healing as well as to bring the CD on HW: Sanctify down a lot. Obviously can stop casting PoH if not needed. But it looks like you were blowing up the Brands of Argus, so lots of raid wide damage to heal up with HW: Sanctify and PoH and he spent most of his time just using FH.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...6&type=healing

Here you can see he cast 54 PoH to the other Priests 8. Each cast was averaging way low. Either using it on people that weren't near others or using it when it wasn't buffed from Divinity / PotN. 9 PoM casts vs 29 PoM casts.

[anon5123]

Just got The Alabaster Lady yesterday, and....very, very underwhelming. The procs are random so you never know when it's going to happen, and when it does happen, I'm rarely prepared for it, often scrambling to use my holy words so I can make use of the short Apotheosis proc.

8 seconds just feels way too short. On average, I only got 1 or 2 Serendipity-proccing casts during its duration.

Another crap legendary from Blizzard...sigh.

[worcester]

Just got The Alabaster Lady yesterday, and....very, very underwhelming. The procs are random so you never know when it's going to happen, and when it does happen, I'm rarely prepared for it, often scrambling to use my holy words so I can make use of the short Apotheosis proc.

8 seconds just feels way too short. On average, I only got 1 or 2 Serendipity-proccing casts during its duration.

Another crap legendary from Blizzard...sigh.

While other equivalent legendaries just give you power buffs or free heals (wings/bird), apotheosis is proactive and requires some forethought to use. So when you get it randomly, of course its gonna suck.

[anon5123]

Yeah, in general, random procs are bad for healers since more often than not, they proc when you don't need them. Sucks that so many of Holy's healing boosts are random procs. (t'uure and blessing of t'uure, etc)

[anon5123]

Hm, Holy seems to be working out quite well in Tomb so far. I've only done Normal in a bunch of pugs, but in almost every pug, I was topping meters by a good deal, and I don't even have the ideal legendaries. (using neck and Alabaster Lady)

The only fight that I wanted to go Disc for was the first boss, because everyone's so spread out all the time, very hard to use Sanctify.

[anon5123]

Sea Star of the Depthmother’s Ocean's Embrace now has an 8 second internal cooldown. The proc chance has been reduced slightly for Holy Paladins and Holy Priests.

RIP

Though, from what people are saying, it's apparently still one of the best throughput trinkets for Holy. Just...not "10% of total healing" overpowered anymore.

[Chillzor]

Got hcwf version of Sea Star yesterday and while i only had 2 wipes to try it on, it was still doing 5-6% of my healing on spirit side of fakereliquaryofsouls. Possibily still the best cookie cutter throughput trinket, wonder if theres post hotfix tests already?

[anon5123]

That trinket doesn't seem to want to drop for me. Nor any trinkets, or any fucking useful gear. 6 seals, all AP, and in ~20 boss kills, only got 2 helms (both insta-d/e because I have legendary helm for both specs) and a mediocre relic.

Fuck this RNG.

In other news, is it just me or is Holy incredibly dominant on HPS now? Almost every single pug, I'm topping the meters on every fight. Not trying to brag, I'm just genuinely confused as to why I'm suddenly doing so well. Am I just good or are the other pug healers bad? I'm even outhealing resto druids, the supposed "best healer".

[Ailylia]

I still prefer to run with Velens + Cake, it's like having two extra CDs.

Holy's HPS is really nice right now. The drawback is we don't have a whole lot in the way of damage reduction so the other healer types are still relevant but yes in a larger raid especially once you have 4p you're way ahead.

But you also have to remember because of the way PoM works your healing meters get overinflated because PoM will heal someone the instant they take damage, meaning the other healers don't have any chance of healing that damage.