Wages rise on California farms. Americans still don’t want the job

[Sunseeker]

The comment in the article about the 30k/yr for farm work being only half of the median income is misleading. While outright correct, once you factor in adjustments based on education needed (Registered nurses make roughly $40/hr) the numbers start to make more sense. Also skewing that number is the Bay Area and Silicon Valley.
$33,000 a year with benefits for unskilled labor isn't a terrible wage.

In Wyoming? Yeah it's fine. In Napa? The average 1 bdrm apt rents for ~$1700/mo (no utilities), that makes up 20k of a 30k income. 10k is not going to get you through the year in Napa either.

Frankly, I'd think that these farmers could make bank by building a small apartment complex on their farm, and then charging people extremely cheap rent. Call it a "private" complex and you must be employed by "Farmer John" or whatever in order to live there.

[Captain N]

The comment in the article about the 30k/yr for farm work being only half of the median income is misleading. While outright correct, once you factor in adjustments based on education needed (Registered nurses make roughly $40/hr) the numbers start to make more sense. Also skewing that number is the Bay Area and Silicon Valley.
$33,000 a year with benefits for unskilled labor isn't a terrible wage.

Nurses make money dependent on location and the type of hospital they work in. My wife works in a college research hospital in Chicago in IV Therapy (Oncology) -- She's well into the six figure range, but would take a massive pay hit to do the same job in a suburban hospital.

I've personally also linked several railroad related Custodian jobs on these forums as well as no experience required Train Crew who start at $187/day for the Custodian or $23.75/hour or $240/day or $30/hour for a first year Conductor. Both of these jobs are far less stressful than working on a farm. Both of these are also subjected to FRA Hours of Service Laws so there is no working more than 12 hours a day.

Comparatively $33,000 to work obscene hours doing long-term damage to your back and knees is pretty terrible.

[Magicpot]

The comment in the article about the 30k/yr for farm work being only half of the median income is misleading. While outright correct, once you factor in adjustments based on education needed (Registered nurses make roughly $40/hr) the numbers start to make more sense. Also skewing that number is the Bay Area and Silicon Valley.
$33,000 a year with benefits for unskilled labor isn't a terrible wage.

It's also not enticing if you can get a job at the local McDonalds for roughly equal pay in that area.

Or stocking shelves in a walmart

Or janitorial work anywhere.


Point is, this work wreaks havoc on your body and back especially, so not a lot of people are clamoring for it

[Sunseeker]

I've personally also linked several railroad related Custodian jobs on these forums as well as no experience required Train Crew who start at $187/day for the Custodian or $23.75/hour or $240/day or $30/hour for a first year Conductor. Both of these jobs are far less stressful than working on a farm. Both of these are also subjected to FRA Hours of Service Laws so there is no working more than 12 hours a day.

Comparatively $33,000 to work obscene hours doing long-term damage to your back and knees is pretty terrible.

Having applied to the railroad several times, it's a little harder to get in than you imply. But yes. I have a couple friends who work on the railroad and their jobs pay absurdly better than what is being offered for seasonal farm labor.

[Dastreus]

Why aren't farms automated yet?

[Captain N]

Having applied to the railroad several times, it's a little harder to get in than you imply. But yes. I have a couple friends who work on the railroad and their jobs pay absurdly better than what is being offered for seasonal farm labor.

I won't deny the difficulty in getting in as every opening have literally thousands of entries, and there are a lot of scare tactics applied by the Company to run off a lot of people who think they've discovered Easy Street. Having connections is probably the easiest way to get in -- as long as the person that's agreeing to be your referral doesn't have any disciplinary problems.

To be fair this is why I always say I didn't get my job through hard work or nose deep in student debt -- I got lucky and I hope that I can pass some of that luck onto others who need a good paying job with benefits.

[Rasulis]

Anything that incentivizes automation and destroys more awful jobs that no one should have to work is a great thing.

Agriculture is one of the hardest field to mechanize. Hardy crops like almonds can be harvested mechanically. However delicate crops like cherries and berries are tougher. The ones that are going to be turned into jams, jellies, juice, or preserved in jars and cans are easy. The ones that are headed to the supermarket as fresh produce not so much. The machines still can not compete with human delicate touch, and tend to bruise the products. The French has been experimenting with robots that can pick grapes. However, an experienced harvester can easily do it much faster than the robots.

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I'll second this.
Worked as an electrician's apprentice here in AZ for a year and a half, once summer hit and I had to dig trenches to run lines to trailers I was instantly over it. Made an agreement with my boss that I could go grab some border brothers if I was willing to give up part of my pay if they dug my trenches. To this day, it was some of the best money I ever (kinda) spent.

Why are they digging trenches manually? Even a small bobcat can do the job faster than any 10 laborers.

[MonsieuRoberts]

I wouldn't be interested in hard, laborious work with no room for growth, no benefits and not in a field (no pun intendeD) that I'm interested in either. IF the money was enough to help with an impending debt (like school) maybe...but that cash would have to be ace. Either that or there'd have to be no other option, and that's just not the reality right now.

What 90s kid wants to be a farmhand when they could work in the city, even at McButts?

[Macaquerie]

I waited tables during undergrad and my favorite part of the job was setting up/breaking down the patio. It felt good and rewarding, more so than actually waiting tables haha. Although the money was good and kept my bills paid while I was in school.

There's something intrinsically rewarding about manual labor, yes it's hard though and it's really not sustainable as a career. Unless you have some sort of Herculean body that doesn't start breaking down until around retirement age.

I feel like modern American attitudes toward blue collar work are an anomaly though. I don't think the average farmer or factory worker in Mexico, China, or India feels like their work is particularly rewarding, and any of them would jump at the chance to leave that for a live of idle luxury. You can see this in the attitudes of newly minted middle classes in developing countries, who are totally unapologetic about embracing consumerism and social climbing, and barely even bother to acknowledge the existence of the poor, much less giving them any credit for keeping society functioning. Once they've had a taste of the American lifestyle, they would never dream of ever dirtying their hands with work again.

America is sort of unique in that we've been so prosperous for so long that we've grown bored of our safe and secure lifestyles of consumption and leisure, and people have started looking back to the good old days when backbreaking labor kept us strong and disciplined rather than soft and lazy. And while that does hold to some extent, it is also sort of a privilege that we have to see this kind of work as a character building exercise, whereas most people in other countries try to avoid it at all costs because they are horrified of being trapped in that life with no prospect for upward mobility.

[Elegiac]

So pay more until Americans will want to do the work. Why would I want to work out in the heat when I can make $16+/hour working in the office?

The point is that the whole 'they took our jerbs' line is a complete crock. Migrant workers are taking the jobs Americans won't do.

[Protean]

Rich people trying to pay sub par wages. He does it because he can. $16 a hour isn't enough to feed a family and most places pay $15 hr minimum on that side of the country to flip burgers...lets see, hot sun all day dusk till dawn or Air-conditioned McD's.

I know what I would do.

$16 is the minimum wage in Denmark. Our taxes take at least 40% of that and our costs of living are as high (if not higher) compared to USA. Here $16 is more than enough to live off so not sure why you think it's a subpar wage.


Working in the sun is amazing and better for your health than standing in greasefumes all day.

[Elegiac]

$16 is the minimum wage in Denmark. Our taxes take at least 40% of that and our costs of living are as high (if not higher) compared to USA. Here $16 is more than enough to live off so not sure why you think it's a subpar wage.

Working in the sun is amazing and better for your health than standing in greasefumes all day.

Aside from the whole skin cancer thing.

It's a subpar wage precisely because the US does not provide the level of public assistance that Denmark does. That wage is expected to cover transportation - meaning a car, as public transport in the US is utter garbage - housing, healthcare, education, food, et cetera.

[announced]

these guys are finally getting the right idea, switching to almond or olive trees instead of overpriced wine that tastes like shit.

[Elegiac]

these guys are finally getting the right idea, switching to almond or olive trees instead of overpriced wine that tastes like shit.

Clearly you just have bad taste in wine.

[announced]

Clearly you just have bad taste in wine.

Wine always tastes terrible to me, and plus it is often overpriced.

[Elegiac]

Wine always tastes terrible to me, and plus it is often overpriced.

As I said, no taste.

[Elim Garak]

"It's a free market, if people are willing to work for such low wages, we will pay such low wages and make a profit, nothing wrong with that"
"Oh woe is me, people are not willing to work for such low wages and if I raise the wages I will lose profit or business, please help"

Good riddance.

[Celista]

I feel like modern American attitudes toward blue collar work are an anomaly though. I don't think the average farmer or factory worker in Mexico, China, or India feels like their work is particularly rewarding, and any of them would jump at the chance to leave that for a live of idle luxury. You can see this in the attitudes of newly minted middle classes in developing countries, who are totally unapologetic about embracing consumerism and social climbing, and barely even bother to acknowledge the existence of the poor, much less giving them any credit for keeping society functioning. Once they've had a taste of the American lifestyle, they would never dream of ever dirtying their hands with work again.

America is sort of unique in that we've been so prosperous for so long that we've grown bored of our safe and secure lifestyles of consumption and leisure, and people have started looking back to the good old days when backbreaking labor kept us strong and disciplined rather than soft and lazy. And while that does hold to some extent, it is also sort of a privilege that we have to see this kind of work as a character building exercise, whereas most people in other countries try to avoid it at all costs because they are horrified of being trapped in that life with no prospect for upward mobility.

Americans are working longer hours with stagnant wages and cubicles feel like depressing cages. Of course not all offices are like that, but I can see why some would prefer fresh air + exercise with their workday. "Backbreaking labor" likely depends on the labor conditions at the farm in question and the overall health of the worker. I've had friends and boyfriends who did work on organic farms during college, they all loved the experience.

"Whereas most people in other countries try to avoid it at all costs because they are horrified of being trapped in that life with no prospect for upward mobility" not everyone is looking for upward mobility. I don't understand conservatives' circle jerk over coal and manufacturing jobs, manufacturing in particular sounds particularly soul-sucking. I bet all of those Indiana manufacturing employees making $7 an hour + West Virginia coal workers would take almost any other job in tech or the renewable energy sector if they were offered a retraining program.

[Elegiac]

Americans are working longer hours with stagnant wages and cubicles feel like depressing cages. Of course not all offices are like that, but I can see why some would prefer fresh air + exercise with their workday. "Backbreaking labor" likely depends on the labor conditions at the farm in question and the overall health of the worker. I've had friends and boyfriends who did work on organic farms during college, they all loved the experience.

Organic farms are hippie daycare centers and not remotely representative of how the majority of agricultural work in the world is actually conducted.

"Whereas most people in other countries try to avoid it at all costs because they are horrified of being trapped in that life with no prospect for upward mobility" not everyone is looking for upward mobility. I don't understand conservatives' circle jerk over coal and manufacturing jobs, manufacturing in particular sounds particularly soul-sucking. I bet all of those Indiana manufacturing employees making $7 an hour + West Virginia coal workers would take almost any other job in tech or the renewable energy sector if they were offered a retraining program.

And you'd be surprised - they aren't. The issue is that these Rust Belt folks are refusing to put in a minimal amount of effort in terms of reskilling and actually moving to where the jobs are.

[Celista]

Organic farms are hippie daycare centers and not remotely representative of how the majority of agricultural work in the world is actually conducted.



And you'd be surprised - they aren't. The issue is that these Rust Belt folks are refusing to put in a minimal amount of effort in terms of reskilling and actually moving to where the jobs are.

Well I doubt migrant farm workers are being beat with a cane...in any case I am not trying to depict migrant farm work as some sort of utopia, I'm sure there is a reason people aren't jumping for those jobs.

People in rural areas are often too poor to move to where better jobs are and schooling costs money. The poor often avoid debt at all costs (on one hand, this is wise of them but on the other hand, financial aid for an apprenticeship/job training program/degree is a worthwhile investment that yields a significant ROI as long as you get training in something useful).