No sense of progression in Nighthold - Preach video

[kamuimac]

Rewards for mythic raiding are muddled with titanforging all over the place, the "do harder content for better gear" is watered down to the point for many it's not worth the effort

what the actual f... happened with "we raid for chalenge" "we want chalenging content" that 3/4 of those forums were whining about for past 10 years ?

finally admiting that it was all a lie ?

and that you only raid for shiny loot and all bs about wanting chalenging content was nonsense from get go ?

if you people have so much fun clearing hc in 2 hours for tf then why even have mythic in game - clearly you would be more happy with just hc and loot tf to 925 - because you dont give rats ass about chalenge.

mythic + are proving it so painfully when people spam +9-+12 over and over again instead push for +20 because it doesnt drop loot why do it - its so well proving that next to nobody wants chalenging content - all that people want is high itlv purple as so that others dont get them so they can wave their e-pens around

[Deleted]

it's also the fact that every week after u do a boss, u lose the Vantus, already haemoing dmg.

[Deleted]

what the actual f... happened with "we raid for chalenge" "we want chalenging content" that 3/4 of those forums were whining about for past 10 years ?

Pulling a number out of nowhere doesn't make your statement real. Latest difficulty was always decently hard. And only ones who said otherwise were the ones who didn't do it.
Also, grindy doesn't equal challenging.

[Senistian]

I don't always agree with preach for sure, but he is right in this video. Every pull, even on farm bosses "FEELS" like a progression fight. Yes we may not wipe but it still feels like a progression boss. We have to have x heals. We have to have x dps. Star Auger as a fire mage is almost GG, especially if you get ejection. Half the time it just makes more sense to just run heroic and get titanforge for half the hassle and the ability to play what you want. NH has an issue of being too hard for the rewards it provides.

[Teaon]

before we started the mythic run, i only needed relics as an upgrade

loots? either bad optimized or minor upgrade, which you only want to kill the boss once, since you need no shit from him, and then the farm becomes burnout and super boring.

[Aggrophobic]

what the actual f... happened with "we raid for chalenge" "we want chalenging content" that 3/4 of those forums were whining about for past 10 years ?

finally admiting that it was all a lie ?

and that you only raid for shiny loot and all bs about wanting chalenging content was nonsense from get go ?

if you people have so much fun clearing hc in 2 hours for tf then why even have mythic in game - clearly you would be more happy with just hc and loot tf to 925 - because you dont give rats ass about chalenge.

mythic + are proving it so painfully when people spam +9-+12 over and over again instead push for +20 because it doesnt drop loot why do it - its so well proving that next to nobody wants chalenging content - all that people want is high itlv purple as so that others dont get them so they can wave their e-pens around

Repetitive and grindy is not the same as hard or challenging.

[SLSAMG]

Thrill of the kill - he dosen't feel that
Loot- he dosen't feel satisfaction in getting it
Achievments - dosen't care for them

...

Why is he playing this game again?

Clearly because it's his job (pumping out youtube content). God forbid WoW dies and this poor schmuck is forced to work a 9-5 like a normal contributing member of society.

Despite him being your typical British cynical asshole, I actually agree with him on this particular subject..

[Sarevokcz]

What ?
There has never been such a ridiculous increase in power, and you somewhat claim it needs to be even more stupid ?

the ridiculous curve is gonna be there regardless, so why the hell not? if wf/tf is to survive in its current version, then each raid tier essentially has to be soft reset on gear, not BS, where guilds can farm almost mythic level of gear from previous content, make mythic balanced around even higher numbers, but give dogshit rewards in comparison, makeing it frustratingly hard for mediocre guilds to gear and progress at somewhat steady pace

[Pruke]

I think it has a lot to do with gear being so easy to get with wf/tf. I've seen something like this happen fairly often. Last night for example I ran normal Nighthold with a few friends on alts and a few pugs to fill the raid. There were at least 5 items that upgraded to 905, 3 that upgraded to 910 and 1 upgraded to 915. I mean, we are in normal, base ilvl from the bosses is 875. There were 15 of us in the raid, bosses dropped 3 pieces if I recall, so roughly 30 drops in total for the clear (which took 3 hours) and approximately 9 (that I can immediately recall) so almost 10% were mythic level drops.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

If you get to a point where you're reliably one-shotting every boss (not there yet in NH meself), it all goes fast enough anyway. What more does he want?

Progression can mean faster kill times, but it can also mean smoother execution, fewer mistakes.
Progression as loot has always been an illusion, as today's bis becomes tomorrows souvenirs/vendor items.
The only true progression is becoming better at playing your toons and building relationships/teamwork with your mates.

[kamuimac]

I think it has a lot to do with gear being so easy to get with wf/tf. I've seen something like this happen fairly often. Last night for example I ran normal Nighthold with a few friends on alts and a few pugs to fill the raid. There were at least 5 items that upgraded to 905, 3 that upgraded to 910 and 1 upgraded to 915. I mean, we are in normal, base ilvl from the bosses is 875. There were 15 of us in the raid, bosses dropped 3 pieces if I recall, so roughly 30 drops in total for the clear (which took 3 hours) and approximately 9 (that I can immediately recall) so almost 10% were mythic level drops.

and here i have 10 alts on max level and never seen tf higher then 890 - maybe if you spam NH hc it may be true but for general crowd - what you say is complete bs about tf being to common

[KaPe]

and here i have 10 alts on max level and never seen tf higher then 890 - maybe if you spam NH hc it may be true but for general crowd - what you say is complete bs about tf being to common

Blizzard themselves said they might be a bit too common in their last Q&A. You're not bullshiting your way out of this through "well I didn't see it, so it's not true."

[Deleted]

Asmongold is very precisely on what is wrong: time-efficient play is in question.

[kamuimac]

My guild doesn't do the following, since we're semi-casual, but I have friends in a 8/10m guild who do exactly this: clear every raid on every difficulty they can (maybe except EN / TOV LFR, but NH LFR yes), because of legendary chance and titanforge chance.

and its his fault for choosing guild with such abbusive leadership - if hes unhappy he should leave - unless hes complaining for sake of complaining and to much of pussy to do something about it.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizzard themselves said they might be a bit too common in their last Q&A. You're not bullshiting your way out of this through "well I didn't see it, so it's not true."

i am not - i gave you my personal experience from doin wq / lfr on 10 alts since launch - not a single item higher then 890 - if you dont like it its your problem

[KaPe]

i am not - i gave you my personal experience from doin wq / lfr on 10 alts since launch - not a single item higher then 890 - if you dont like it its your problem

And devs disagree with your personal experience. I'd say their opinion is a bit more important than yours.

[Deleted]

The fact that it's possible to get LFR gear that is better quality than Mythic gear is digudting. Even if the chance is super low the chance is still there. Mythic is only 900/905 item level yet it's very common for a lot of equal power items to come from Heroic. Hell it feels like the chance to get a normal item is less than WF or TF.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Ccien/advanced This guy got a 925 Draught with a socket from LFR. It's 15 item levels better than the mythic one. Why? Why is this a thing? Titanforging should be capped. LFR should be capped at Normal, Normal should be capped at Heroic, Heroic should be capped at Mythic and Mythic should hit the current cap of 925.

[SLSAMG]

The fact that it's possible to get LFR gear that is better quality than Mythic gear is digudting. Even if the chance is super low the chance is still there. Mythic is only 900/905 item level yet it's very common for a lot of equal power items to come from Heroic. Hell it feels like the chance to get a normal item is less than WF or TF.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Ccien/advanced This guy got a 925 Draught with a socket from LFR. It's 15 item levels better than the mythic one. Why? Why is this a thing? Titanforging should be capped. LFR should be capped at Normal, Normal should be capped at Heroic, Heroic should be
capped at Mythic and Mythic should hit the current cap of 925.

Someone is mad. It's not like it's a common occurrence. That begs the question, why do you care so much about this random scrub? He'll likely never utilize it to its full potential anyway so good riddance.

[KaPe]

Someone is mad. It's not like it's a common occurrence. That begs the question, why do you care so much about this random scrub? He'll likely never utilize it to its full potential anyway so good riddance.

It's happening at all the levels of difficulty. Getting one from LFR is an extreme case, but it's much more common if you go to Heroic. It breaks the effort:reward ratio, making people question if all the effort put into Mythic is worth it. And it's a good question - for all the "I thought you raided for challenge herpderp" snarky comments, getting good gear was always part of the raiding. Nowadays, it's a lottery - except to get Mythic version of a lottery ticket, you have to put in way more effort. Plenty of people decide not to bother with that.

[Deleted]

Someone is mad. It's not like it's a common occurrence. That begs the question, why do you care so much about this random scrub? He'll likely never utilize it to its full potential anyway so good riddance.

Why would I be mad. I'm a tank who won't really use Draught. Why do I care? It's silly that this guy can get better quality gear than what mythic drops. It isn't the same quality it's better. The fact that he'll never use it to it's full potential is exactly why this system sucks. Why should he get rewarded for doing the easiest content?

It doesn't matter if it's common occurrence the fact that it can happen and has happened is more than enough to prove this system sucks. If you actually think the titanforge system is good you must have some brain illness.

[SLSAMG]

It's happening at all the levels of difficulty. Getting one from LFR is an extreme case, but it's much more common if you go to Heroic. It breaks the effort:reward ratio, making people question if all the effort put into Mythic is worth it. And it's a good question - for all the "I thought you raided for challenge herpderp" snarky comments, getting good gear was always part of the raiding. Nowadays, it's a lottery - except to get Mythic version of a lottery ticket, you have to put in way more effort. Plenty of people decide not to bother with that.

1. Still not a common occurrence.
2. I literally just said that.
3. And finally, no; getting TF items doesn't greatly increase with difficulty.