[Megathread] Mass Effect Andromeda

[PACOX]

Finally finised 70hrs in 90% complete. Just couldn't be bothered to do the last few missions I had left (not counting Task). The ending was fun enough. I actually wanted to shoot the Archon, thought his death was kind of lame. The only loose end that bothered me was are the kett just going to give up on the cluster now? Especially since I told The Primus she could go fuck herself. I don't see them leaving for too long.

[Lahis]

Finally finised 70hrs in 90% complete. Just couldn't be bothered to do the last few missions I had left (not counting Task). The ending was fun enough. I actually wanted to shoot the Archon, thought his death was kind of lame. The only loose end that bothered me was are the kett just going to give up on the cluster now? Especially since I told The Primus she could go fuck herself. I don't see them leaving for too long.

Oh the Kett will definetly be back. Archon was obsessed with the Remnant, and his actions were actually holding Kett's plans back. He hadn't even reported to central command for decades. We will see the full force of the Kett in the future after the Primus delivers her report and they'll organize counterattack on Heleus.

[Adam Jensen]

I am too. But I am even more puzzled at why has this story been so harshly criticized to this drastic extent. Some critics I actually respect such as Angry Joe have called the story "Tepid" or "Average", while others have gone much further, going from "Garbage" to "Insulting SJW shit".

"Insulting SJW shit?"

Over one freaking NPC out of hundreds? An NPC who isn't a major character, whom you could ignore the entire game and not even notice?

Some people . . .

[PACOX]

"Insulting SJW shit?"

Over one freaking NPC out of hundreds? An NPC who isn't a major character, whom you could ignore the entire game and not even notice?

Some people . . .

I ignore all the sjw critics. What character is the sjw character? Its a Bioware game after, if a demographic isn't covered in one game you better believe that it will be represented in the next. Complaining about "sjws" while playing a Bioware game is like complaining about guns while playing a COD game.

[Adam Jensen]

I ignore all the sjw critics. What character is the sjw character? Its a Bioware game after, if a demographic isn't covered in one game you better believe that it will be represented in the next. Complaining about "sjws" while playing a Bioware game is like complaining about guns while playing a COD game.

From what I understand it's a transgender character named Hainly Abrams whom you meet on Eos for a side quest or two. Maybe they're mad that Gil is gay? Were they mad about Cortez and Traynor?

What it really is, is people on the internet making a mountain out of a molehill. There are gay and bi characters, and one trans. Such SJW. Wow. It's not like any of these social issues were made a significant part of the game's plot.

[Very Tired]

From what I understand it's a transgender character named Hainly Abrams whom you meet on Eos for a side quest or two. Maybe they're mad that Gil is gay? Were they mad about Cortez and Traynor?

What it really is, is people on the internet making a mountain out of a molehill. There are gay and bi characters, and one trans. Such SJW. Wow. It's not like any of these social issues were made a significant part of the game's plot.

From my guess, most of the SJW complaints actually come from people complaining about the devs at Bioware and their twitter feed. Much of which takes a hard anti-rightwing stance.

[zealo]

From what I understand it's a transgender character named Hainly Abrams whom you meet on Eos for a side quest or two. Maybe they're mad that Gil is gay? Were they mad about Cortez and Traynor?

What it really is, is people on the internet making a mountain out of a molehill. There are gay and bi characters, and one trans. Such SJW. Wow. It's not like any of these social issues were made a significant part of the game's plot.

It's a storm in a glass of water for sure, but pretending that character wasn't blatant pandering does no one any favours either.

It's just tokenism having minor characters like that even talking to the player about their gender or sexual orientation at all. Bioware knew all this by Inquisition and Krem over 2 years ago, but yet they did that same misstep here.

[mickybrighteyes]

Part of the SJW shitstorm actually isn't related to ingame happenings. Some of the development team sharing certain views and subsequently no longer being part of the development team.

And then there was that bit where people started saying they purposely went out of their way to make female characters less attractive for no reason. Even had random people going back and retouching all the shots of the main female characters and it was like totally new characters. You wouldn't recognize the 'fan made' Peebee if not for the racoon makeup she runs with.

[PACOX]

From my guess, most of the SJW complaints actually come from people complaining about the devs at Bioware and their twitter feed. Much of which takes a hard anti-rightwing stance.

But its Bioware...they've been like that since forever.

- - - Updated - - -

It's a storm in a glass of water for sure, but pretending that character wasn't blatant pandering does no one any favours either.

It's just tokenism having minor characters like that even talking to the player about their gender or sexual orientation at all. Bioware knew all this by Inquisition and Krem over 2 years ago, but yet they did that same misstep here.

How is that pandering though?

There are trying to make a believable universe. Why wouldn't a trans person be part of said universe?

And you have Gil, whose sexual orientation does actually play into his character arch.

[zealo]

How is that pandering though?

There are trying to make a believable universe. Why wouldn't a trans person be part of said universe?

And you have Gil, whose sexual orientation does actually play into his character arch.

I haven't said they shouldn't be a part of said universe. Only that minor characters would have no reason to reveal their gender orientation or sexuality that fast to the player. It makes them come across as Trans:The Character to the player. It coming up more naturally is a huge part of avoiding it coming across as tokenism.

Gil, infact, doesn't tell the player at all he might be gay unless you as a player starts hitting on him, his arch is more about parenting, and how this relates to being gay and having kids as a sub topic, but he never actually comes out and tells you this directly.

[May90]

I never see the same folks complain about "pandering" to white people, to cis-people, to straight people, to adult people. It is always an inclusion of one of the minorities that causes people to voice criticism. I think the problem is in the people, not in the devs.

A trans person who is more open about her being trans than the average trans person at the beginning of the 21st century is "pandering" how?

[mickybrighteyes]

I never see the same folks complain about "pandering" to white people, to cis-people, to straight people, to adult people. It is always an inclusion of one of the minorities that causes people to voice criticism. I think the problem is in the people, not in the devs.

We call that particular pandering 'whitewashing' these days. Doens't matter if it is actually whitewashing or not.

edit:

the problem is the perception of the idea, not just a group of people.

[PACOX]

I haven't said they shouldn't be a part of said universe. Only that minor characters would have no reason to reveal their gender orientation or sexuality that fast to the player. It makes them come across as Trans:The Character to the player. It coming up more naturally is a huge part of avoiding it coming across as tokenism.

Gil, infact, doesn't tell the player at all he might be gay unless you as a player starts hitting on him, his arch is more about parenting, and how this relates to being gay and having kids as a sub topic, but he never actually comes out and tells you this directly.

Minor characters are often given some trait that makes them stand out. I don't why one particular trait has rubbed people the the wrong way. I don't care if or why Bioware included the character because they have no impact on the story whatsoever.

Sidenote: It wasn't obvious that Gil was gay even if you ignore the option to flirt with him on male Ryder? He drops hints left and right and then it becomes obvious once he introduces his friend and what she thinks people in Andromeda should be doing.

He ends up starting a family with her, go figure

[zealo]

Minor characters are often given some trait that makes them stand out. I don't why one particular trait has rubbed people the the wrong way. I don't care if or why Bioware included the character because they have no impact on the story whatsoever.

Sidenote: It wasn't obvious that Gil was gay even if you ignore the option to flirt with him on male Ryder? He drops hints left and right and then it becomes obvious once he introduces his friend and what she thinks people in Andromeda should be doing.

He ends up starting a family with her, go figure

"being obvious" such as you seeing subtle signs, and him actually going out and telling you it like "hi I'm gay!" in clear speech isn't the same thing.

In fact, this is what one of DA:I's writers said about Krem in 2014:

Talking over drinks at the bar later, we hit two major challenges. First, any conversation about the subject had to come up naturally in-game. A minor character like a shopkeeper would have no reason to explain that she is trans, so either the conversation would never come up or it would come up because her voice was clearly masculine, at which point it would look like a joke to most players, no matter how we tried to write it. Second, the character had to serve a purpose beyond “being there to be a genderqueer person.” Every character in our game serves a purpose—reinforcing the theme of a plot, character, or area—and we do not have the budget for someone who is just there to tick off a box.

http://blog.bioware.com/2014/12/04/b...-krem-aclassi/

Bioware is going backwards with their representation of queer people going from that to what we got in ME:A with Hainley.

[May90]

“More open”, LOL! You do realize that lot of the complaints about that exact character were actually from transsexual people, right? Again, it has nothing to do with the characters being whatever they are, it’s how incredibly forced some of them look like just so Bioware can mark a check on their little list.

Yeah, so forced, I almost feel raped by having to hear that Hanley used to have a different name! I think I'll go file a sexual assault complaint with the police now...

[May90]

Congratulations on forcibly completely missing the point just to keep defending a mistake that Bioware already admitted and apologized for.

They did it because of all the fake outrage online which was hurting their business interests. I don't really care about these actions, but this is one of the pettiest complaints I've seen in my 25 years of gaming, and I've seen a lot.

[Adam Jensen]

I haven't said they shouldn't be a part of said universe. Only that minor characters would have no reason to reveal their gender orientation or sexuality that fast to the player. It makes them come across as Trans:The Character to the player. It coming up more naturally is a huge part of avoiding it coming across as tokenism.

Gil, infact, doesn't tell the player at all he might be gay unless you as a player starts hitting on him, his arch is more about parenting, and how this relates to being gay and having kids as a sub topic, but he never actually comes out and tells you this directly.

I didn't even realize Gil was gay my first play through. Just happened I felt like hitting the flirt dialogue this time around. Was like "oh, missed that." Lulz

[Sixnalia]

Gil, infact, doesn't tell the player at all he might be gay unless you as a player starts hitting on him, his arch is more about parenting, and how this relates to being gay and having kids as a sub topic, but he never actually comes out and tells you this directly.

The way he spoke with my Ryder, who never flirted, made it seem like he knew he was gay already. As he refers to his "situation" to my Ryder, as to why he has certain dilemmas. Same experience on my 3 Ryders so far that have finished the game.

[May90]

Gil reminds me a lot of a matured Gabe from Cerberus. More polished jokes, more matured behavior, and much better card skills!

[Derah]

Relax. No need to be so harsh and abrupt over something so simple.

He's got a point though. Using the tags is super easy, just highlight the spoilers, click on the quote button, then change the word "quote" for "Spoiler" on both sides of the tag, and presto.

Personally, I think the missing Ark is TOTALLY gonna be covered in a DLC instead of a sequel. Otherwise the Multiplayer would be way too barren when it comes to race selection. Only 6 available is too little. At least the missing ark would do a great deal in adding more diversity to the mix.

That said, I don't think Ryder's mom being cured will happen in a DLC. What story is there to tell? a story needs an antagonist, conflict, some sort of obstacle to overcome. I personally hope they reserve that for the sequel. The game doesn't really need all that many DLC, 2 would suffice, and I'm sure they can add a second one with an interesting story that doesn't touch the unresolved plot threads, as I believe they are better suited as sequel fodder.