People expected too much of 7.2

[Jalatiphra]

You used too many words to rephrase what I said. Even if we cut the obvious bits that didn't deserve mentioning...

7.2. has less content and features than 7.1.5. Obviously players expected it to be the other way around - because that was the case since vanilla (except for some odd balls here and there, I look at you 6.1).

OP and now you think that other players are stupid.

OP is saying that 7.1.5 was the major patch and 7.2 is just a minor patch and expresses his confusion at how the rest of us don't understand that

And you use too little words because i dont understand your stuff.

Maybe , just maybe meet in the middle ground and not complain about something irrelevant for the thread if you cant find something else in a good post you just can't agree with?

Addtionally:
All the HYPE of blizzard announcing this as the biggest content patch ever.
Its just marketing.
Does anyone believe in commercials?
Why should you believe in anything until you see it?

Community fails again and again to think critically vs the inherent belief that what someone else promises must become true. (slight parallels to politics here *winkyface*)

Yes iam basically stating you guys on the hype train who are now disappointed are all not capable of critical thinking
to actually believe they will deliver what they promise - ridiculous ...

@MoDs if this was too harsh i am very sorry.
But iam not personally attacking someone but critisizing a group of individuals about their lack of key abilities necessary to survive in a world full of shit.
Why should Blizzard stick to their promises if they can get away without delivering?

Maybe keep this in mind the next time you are about to jump a hypetrain.

Does this improve the situation?
Of course not, but it could help you not get disappointed - since - we'll we will never change anything in the game by talking about it here.

[Coconut]

Again. Someone who entirely misses the point of the thread and proceeds to throw a tantrum like said lab chimps.

Not arguing the quality of the content, like I said half of it isn't meant for every player. Continuously keep saying I do not support Blizzard or their ridiculous gating.

What I am saying is that if they didn't have X.X.5. patches and would've waited with it all for major X.X. patches people may not have been as salty as they are now, since everything would've been released together and no thing would overshadow the other.

But please, keep reminding me about stuff I already know, agree with but yet again make me insist I do not wish to discuss it here, since this thread isn't about it.

What you've done was come up with a contrived theory that throws away half the context so that you can have a point that makes you look smart, while needlessly throwing insults at others who even slightly deviate from your contrivance.

You can't really discuss the X.X.5 patches without touching on gating, whether you want to or not, because you have situations like EN, ToV and NH coming out in different patches when in previous expansions all three of them would have been part of the first tier, or factions not having exalted mounts on release only for them to be listed as "new content" in X.2.

You don't have to call it gating, or take a stance on gating, but you have to address the fact that content is allocated differently to patches beyond just the X.X.5 denomination. You are willfully ignoring this when you try to lump up everything and the kitchen sink into 7.2 to make it look bigger. But sure, if your point is weak, feel free to call others lab chimps! It's a great testament to your own intelligence.

I'll suggest an alternative approach - let's compare 7.2 with 5.2 in terms of new locations and models:

In 5.2:

- an entirely new raid with a unique theme and 3 separate environments
- 11 new boss models
- 5 or 6 new mob models
- assorted armor and weapons for said mobs
- 2 new zones, one new, with several thematic subzones, one reusing assets from a nearby subzone (but with a fresh take)
- several buildings and doodads, including large ones such as an entire Zandalari ship, a new mage tower, a mini Sunwell, etc.
- several new pet models (baby dinosaurs)
- an entirely original tier set for every class
- an entirely original PvP set for every class
- a large set of original, raid themed weapons
- a set of original PvP weapons

In 7.2:

- an entirely new raid and a new dungeon, with a shared theme
- 7 new boss models
- no new mobs as far as I could tell, same old Legion fodder (maybe in the raid); instead, we have 10 new mount models (DH and Monk merely have new armors), severely limited in visibility by being class specific
- assorted armor and weapons, at least for some bosses
- reused zone from the launch event, sharing assets with Mardum, Faronaar and Azsuna. Old zones can now get a green tint during invasions.
- no new buildings, possibly a few new doodads but they don't really stand out
- no new pet models
- raid tier an HD replica of T6, with a few extra parts for mythic; PvP gear is a recolor of this tier
- one new artifact model for every spec, 36 in total (ToT alone had 38 weapons, not counting the ones from PvP)

So yeah, while the spread of the content is larger because you actually have invasions everywhere, very little of it actually feels fresh.

[Deleted]

*Panda -> releases content that involves mandatory daily quests and weekly caps (which is gating)
+People: too much dailies and "i lost a week gg QQ"
-Blizz: kk will fix it less dailies and grinds, less caps.

*WoD -> releases content that doesn't have gating
+People:lack of content and lack of dailies
-Blizz: kk we will do more shit and make daily work worth it again.

*Legion -> releases content every bit and doesnt have any mandatory shit unless you want cosmetics/flying
+People:"there is no content - there is much content / there is a lot of gating muh grind - there is not enough gating people is grinding"
-Blizz: Wut. Just wut.

People don't know what they want anymore.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I've said my piece on 7.2 and well I feel it's more fair then some of the venom ppl send Blizzard. I'm not super happy with 7.2 but it has a solid base. Unfortunately it fell short and I think Blizzard needs to learn from that overall. At the same time several ppl here will never understand and will hate Blizz regardless because their minds were already made up before 7.2 dropped.

You know who you are.

[Mlz]

People don't know what they want anymore.

Different people complain about different things; also, going from WoD to Legion is pretty much moving between two extremes - is it so hard to realize that something inbetween could exist? Basically, get off your high horse, you're not better than anyone else.

[Sam the Wiser]

How much is Blizzard paying you?

[Felarion]

Last Bellular video explain things very well imo, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTTOtAsRBiM , 7.2 is just more old tingys and we want new shiny stuff in terms of things to do.

[Deleted]

I think it was about what i was expecting honestly

[Deleted]

What you've done was come up with a contrived theory that throws away half the context so that you can have a point that makes you look smart, while needlessly throwing insults at others who even slightly deviate from your contrivance.

You don't have to call it gating, or take a stance on gating, but you have to address the fact that content is allocated differently to patches beyond just the X.X.5 denomination. You are willfully ignoring this when you try to lump up everything and the kitchen sink into 7.2 to make it look bigger. But sure, if your point is weak, feel free to call others lab chimps! It's a great testament to your own intelligence.

No 'insults' needed to be made if people just heard me out like I said in the first place. But you just need to have your own story work for you because you can't accept a different view on matter. I simply suggest that the real reason behind this upheavel may have been for reasons unseen because everyone is so caught up in their own salt.

I've probably said thrice now that I hate gating but that I didn't want to bring it up because like I said it would distort views. It's not to brush away the legitimacy of someone's arguments.

I don't really see how new locations and models add to this? 7.2 doesn't need too many new models because all demons have been updated in either 6.2, 7.0 or 7.1. In ToT they needed to add Zandalari stuff because troll models were outdated and so were their doodadds.
Also, Isle of Giants used Kun-Lai landscape for example.

- - - Updated - - -

How much is Blizzard paying you?

For publicly saying I hate Titanforging, Legendaries, gating and the endless RP grind?

100$ per post.

[clevin]

People? Ignore this shit. OP seems to be the kind of person who dismisses other opinions and any counter-arguments despite its own opinion being simply that, an opinion. They're RIGHT, you see and anything else is salt. It's not even fun or enlightening to go back and forth because they don't listen and will never admit that others who don't agree might have a point

[Deleted]

Blizzard announced the BIGGEST PATCH EVER but what we got was pointless weekly quests like Khadgar with the occasional gem, a broken Invasion system that rewards nothing, an endless AP grind and a dozen new WQs to spam. Honestly 7.2 would've been received better without the artificial timegate but it's obvious Blizzard needs to pad Legion out as thin as it can which is disappointing for a company like Blizzard

[TheFirstOnes]

Keep the white knighting strong my friend. Keep up the good fight.

Says the guy with a WOW Character as his profile.

Kind of takes away from the whole "White knight" Argument...yes?

[defnotalizardperson]

Of course people expected a lot, Blizzard oversold the fuck out of it.

[SoulSoBreezy]

Before all of you throw a tantrum at me like a bunch of laboratory chimps, allow me to explain.

It's all but assured that Blizzard is moving away from the idea of big patches to pursue the more appealing idea of X.X.5 patches which should help prevent content droughts and mass waves on unsubbing. Whatever withheld them from implementing this earlier, they have wanted this for a while.

We have begun to see this in Legion. Patch 7.1.5 was mostly received with applause, partially because the content and changes it provided were well received, but probably also because a patch name 'X.X.5' brought so much content.
With 7.2, people expected a great many things. Broken Shore, Broken Isles invasions, a new dungeon etc. Though I will not deny some of 7.2's content has been lacking, I believe that most frustrations came from the fact that a 'big patch' like X.2 brought comparatively little to the table.

However, let me show you what content 7.2 would have if X.X.5 patches weren't a thing still:
- MoP Timewalking
- Brawler's Guild return
- Micro-Holidays
- Broken Isles Assaults
- Pet Battle Dungeon
- Updated Transmog tab/ Trial of Style
- Paragon reps
- Broken Shore
- Cathedral of Eternal Night
- Black Temple Timewalking raid
- New Class campaign and Class Mounts
- Old Legion dungeons made accessible to Mythic+ and HC
- Auction House Dance Party

I am not saying all of this can be considered core content for every individual player, but just looking at it you can't really deny 7.2 wouldn't add anything to the game.

Believe me when I say I'm the last person to defend Blizzard on anything. I'm tired of RNG Titanforging, Legendaries, endless gating and AP grind. But this is just my perspective as to why 7.2 may not have lived up to the player's expectations.

TL;DR: The age of big patches is over. Blizzard is taking a new direction where content flows in bit by bit.

Edit 1: Yes, I know everyone is still butthurt about the Nethershard weekly. Get over it, I don't want it to soil this thread.

I mostly agree.
We're getting to a paradigm where activities aren't frontloaded like they were in previous patches, and the delivery of content comes in the form of updates to already existing activities to make sure everything's relevant. The days of funneling players into a single area were over as soon as Legion launched; we're just seeing how it's like with patch launches.

As for time gating? Please. Just because there isn't anything shiny and new doesn't mean 7.2 equates to the negation of all previous content platforms. That's up to the players to care about the things they like and don't like, and that's a debate of opinions - a waste of breath.

That said, Blizzard fucked up on the expectations and the marketing. 7.2 should haven't been called Tomb of Sargeras, instead name it "March of the Legionfall" or something. 7.2.5 should have been the patch with the ToS naming, the trailer, etc.

Optional video for context and expanded thoughts:

[Daveon]

Over time I have grown to notice Blizzard has an eye for detail but this patch all they really seem to have cared about is getting it out as possible to raise subsciption numbers for the first fiscal quarter. Why not wait two weeks to fix some bugs?

I agree with a lot of your post, however I must point out that Blizzard has not been posting subscription numbers for a couple quarters now. "Raising subscription numbers for the first fiscal quarter" absolutely doesn't apply because they don't report WoW sub numbers in their quarterly report anymore. This was not a quarterly report-based decision.

Now maybe there's a manager at Blizzard that set the date for when 7.2 was coming out, and he didn't want to have egg on his face if it was late, so he fought to get it out by a certain date, hence the bugs. They have said a few times they're trying to change the culture at Blizzard from "we'll release it when it's done (and it's not done until it's perfect)" to "let's provide a steady stream of content". And there's going to be growing pains of hitting dates, where the teams need to find their bugs before a certain date, but need to keep their schedules, or else that steady stream becomes an unacceptably slow trickle. I've been in software organizations where the process has significantly changed, and it takes time to get into the groove of it.

[Coconut]

No 'insults' needed to be made if people just heard me out like I said in the first place. But you just need to have your own story work for you because you can't accept a different view on matter. I simply suggest that the real reason behind this upheavel may have been for reasons unseen because everyone is so caught up in their own salt.

I've probably said thrice now that I hate gating but that I didn't want to bring it up because like I said it would distort views. It's not to brush away the legitimacy of someone's arguments.

I should probably listen to clevin, but since I posted here to begin with I might as well give it another try.

First of all, no insults need to be made at all, opening a thread doesn't entitle you to decide what people are allowed to say about the subject. Maybe if you hadn't triggered yourself before you even began to make a point in the OP, you would have been more apt to have a reasonable conversation.

I understood the point you were trying to make from the start, and I did address it, but you saw the word "gating" there and your comprehension melted in a fit of rage. I said from my first post what I think works frequent with bite-sized content releases and why I think meatier patches are needed as well. And btw, small patches and gating often have the exact same effect: "content flowing bit by bit", as you put it... I mean, where would you even put Nighthold in your narrative? It's basically a 7.0 raid "gated" until after 7.1.5 was released.

Btw, unlike yourself, I didn't say I have something against gating in principle. Just like small patches, it can work very well. You can even say it's a necessity in an MMO - but we can take issue with it when it affects the way we experience content too much.

I don't really see how new locations and models add to this? 7.2 doesn't need too many new models because all demons have been updated in either 6.2, 7.0 or 7.1. In ToT they needed to add Zandalari stuff because troll models were outdated and so were their doodadds.
Also, Isle of Giants used Kun-Lai landscape for example.

New locations and models break the monotony of doing the same shit all the time, and they constitute appealing rewards because new things are fresh and cool and desirable as opposed to "same old shit". They also take up a big chunk of the work that goes into making "new content". Puking demons all over existing zones takes a lot less time than starting from scratch with new terrain and models.

[Deleted]

I agree with a lot of your post, however I must point out that Blizzard has not been posting subscription numbers for a couple quarters now. "Raising subscription numbers for the first fiscal quarter" absolutely doesn't apply because they don't report WoW sub numbers in their quarterly report anymore. This was not a quarterly report-based decision.

Now maybe there's a manager at Blizzard that set the date for when 7.2 was coming out, and he didn't want to have egg on his face if it was late, so he fought to get it out by a certain date, hence the bugs. They have said a few times they're trying to change the culture at Blizzard from "we'll release it when it's done (and it's not done until it's perfect)" to "let's provide a steady stream of content". And there's going to be growing pains of hitting dates, where the teams need to find their bugs before a certain date, but need to keep their schedules, or else that steady stream becomes an unacceptably slow trickle. I've been in software organizations where the process has significantly changed, and it takes time to get into the groove of it.

They still need to provide quarterly activity data to shareholders. Hence Tos is coming inJune, end of Q2

[Aeula]

Is it too much to ask for content that's worth the extortionate subscription fee they have?

[Zapanth]

I only dislike the fact that we were told that this was going to be the largest patch ever. I completed all the new content available on launch day within two hours. I cant even farm invasions on other toons cause more often than not they spawn when I'ma t work. Overall I feel mislead. Then this week I was super excited for the next stage of questline and two clicks later im done. Was super syched for broken shore and its empty now. Biggest patch my buttocks. There was more to do day one of Firelands patch between new quest hub and dailies then this patch. In 10 weeks it'll be the largest patch but as of now its rather boring.

[Noah37]

The issue with 7.2 is really just that Blizzard were saying it was going to be Quel'Danas/Timeless Isles, when it really just turned into an endless grind without much actual content (so far).