Is Odyn evil?

[Mehrunes]

They might have been arrogant twerps, but by absorbing the power of said heart they were part time gods :P

Until someone took the heart and they ran out of juice

Their biggest feat was still Vivec stopping Baar Dau mid air after Sheogorath threw it at Vivec City. And, like the arrogant twerp he was, instead of shooting it into Oblivion he kept it there as "testament to his power" or some shit. Aaaaand it worked wonders when he ran out of juice. It only brought Armageddon to Vvardenfell.

[Arrashi]

Their biggest feat was still Vivec stopping Baar Dau mid air after Sheogorath threw it at Vivec City. And, like the arrogant twerp he was, instead of shooting it into Oblivion he kept it there as "testament to his power" or some shit. Aaaaand it worked wonders when he ran out of juice. It only brought Armageddon to Vvardenfell.

He wasn't arrogant. He achieved CHIM. Do you know what that is ?

[Mehrunes]

He wasn't arrogant. He achieved CHIM. Do you know what that is ?

4th wall breaking, largely OOG, material made by an ex-employee, whose work in general, if actually introduced to TES, is weirdly enough almost always done so through lunatics that are outright wrong on certain things, like Camoran?

[Arrashi]

4th wall breaking, largely OOG, material made by an ex-employee, whose work in general, if actually introduced to TES, is weirdly enough almost always done so through lunatics that are outright wrong on certain things, like Camoran?

Thats CoDA. Chim can literally blow your head off.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Thats CoDA. Chim can literally blow your head off.

Next expand confirmed world of Warcraft: Chim simulator


Holy fuck this went OT

[Arrashi]

Next expand confirmed world of Warcraft: Chim simulator


Holy fuck this went OT

Indeed, i believe we should

and get back on topic.

Odyn in N'wah. Here we go.

[huth]

I guess Arthas committing genocide against the High Elves wasn't wrong because you can't apply human ethics to non-humans then

Because that has to mean they can never have any overlap, right?

Yeah, no. As long as you're just pretending anything not fitting your arguments doesn't exist, there's no real point in attempting to debate with you.

[Mehrunes]

Thats CoDA. Chim can literally blow your head off.

Nah, C0DA is way beyond OOG. And from what I read, wasn't particularly well received even by fans of Kirkbride's non-canon. CHIM includes elements like Godhead-the player and Vekh outright talks to the player in the 36 Sermons even though they're supposedly addressed at Nerevarine.

Holy fuck this went OT

And it's all your fault :3

[Aucald]

Let's pivot away from Elder Scrolls lore and return to something more Warcraft-centric and hopefully related to Odyn and his proposed alignment.

[Mehrunes]

Because that has to mean they can never have any overlap, right?

Yeah, no. As long as you're just pretending anything not fitting your arguments doesn't exist, there's no real point in attempting to debate with you.

Yeah, claims like "Trying to apply human ethics to inhumans is making all of us more stupid." fer sure allow for plenty of overlap right there. Given how you can't even operate in context of what you're replying to (or cherry-pick one sentence out of many - out of context misrepresentation aside - and ignore the other flaws I pointed in protean's narrative because inconvenience), there isn't even a hypothetical point in imagining to attempt to debate with you.

[Melusine]

Odyn needed intervening forces to even get out of his asylum. The results are still in favor of the Aspects.

Odyn is a single being, and him being trapped in the Halls of Valor did not bring about the end of the world. Odyn needing help to get out of the Halls of Valor < the Aspects needing intervening forces because one of the aspects is about to destroy the world. Jury's still out on whether they spent their power prematurely to save the world, and if that would be needed once N'zoth breaks out.

Turns out, Odyn is still right.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Odyn is a single being, and him being trapped in the Halls of Valor did not bring about the end of the world. Odyn needing help to get out of the Halls of Valor < the Aspects needing intervening forces because one of the aspects is about to destroy the world. Jury's still out on whether they spent their power prematurely to save the world, and if that would be needed once N'zoth breaks out.

Turns out, Odyn is still right.

How could Odyn be right when in the end the aspects did their job, and Odyn's actions got himself removed from the fight?

[Aucald]

How could Odyn be right when in the end the aspects did their job, and Odyn's actions got himself removed from the fight?

I don't think Odyn was right, but the Aspects having done their jobs is also open to debate. In the process of executing their sacred charge the Aspects had to primarily save Azeroth from a fellow Aspect corrupted by the Old Gods, and had another of their number (Malygos) go mad and threaten the world in an overzealous execution of his duties. That's not an exemplary track record.

[Friendlyimmolation]

I don't think Odyn was right, but the Aspects having done their jobs is also open to debate. In the process of executing their sacred charge the Aspects had to primarily save Azeroth from a fellow Aspect corrupted by the Old Gods, and had another of their number (Malygos) go mad and threaten the world in an overzealous execution of his duties. That's not an exemplary track record.

The aspects got fucked over and required outside intervention, but they still were able to help in large areas. Odyn's choices fucked him to the extent that he ended going pants on head crazy in his own golden halls for over ten thousand years unable to do anything.

[Arrashi]

How could Odyn be right when in the end the aspects did their job, and Odyn's actions got himself removed from the fight?

I think its the case of words are silver but silence is golden. Odyn removed himself from fight, preventing himself from fucking up 10 times worse than aspects could ever hope to.

[Aucald]

The aspects got fucked over and required outside intervention, but they still were able to help in large areas. Odyn's choices fucked him to the extent that he ended going pants on head crazy in his own golden halls for over ten thousand years unable to do anything.

That's true, though I see it more as the Old Gods ensuring that both forks of the Keepers' plans were suitably contained. Odyn was neutralized by Helya - his own mistake manipulated by an external force in the form of Loken and made to indirectly serve the will of the Old Gods. Suitably, the Aspects were suborned by their own corrupted brother Neltharion, who stole a large chunk of their powers in the Dragon Soul and went on to become the very thing they needed to stop later on. Both parties were efficiently checked.

[Friendlyimmolation]

That's true, though I see it more as the Old Gods ensuring that both forks of the Keepers' plans were suitably contained. Odyn was neutralized by Helya - his own mistake manipulated by an external force in the form of Loken and made to indirectly serve the will of the Old Gods. Suitably, the Aspects were suborned by their own corrupted brother Neltharion, who stole a large chunk of their powers in the Dragon Soul and went on to become the very thing they needed to stop later on. Both parties were efficiently checked.

I wouldn't really call what Loken did to Helya manipulation, all of her burning hatred was already there, loken just traded with her, fuck odyn up for freedom from your mental chains.

[Deleted]

Seeing the rest of the races dealing successful blows against Azeroth threats and even beating the vrykul in HOV (he said he didn't expect it and I suspect he believes current races are better canditates for his army) , I bet he will come down with a second ingenious plan to kill us, and then use a trick to bring our souls back so we can make an army that can fight the black army and the naga.

[Aucald]

I wouldn't really call what Loken did to Helya manipulation, all of her burning hatred was already there, loken just traded with her, fuck odyn up for freedom from your mental chains.

Well, not directly, no - I would agree with that. Loken used what was a readily available tool to his and his patrons' considerable advantage, I guess you could say. It was an elegant masterstroke of both planning and luck on their parts.

[Arrashi]

Seeing the rest of the races dealing successful blows against Azeroth threats and even beating the vrykul in HOV (he said he didn't expect it and I suspect he believes current races are better canditates for his army) , I bet he will come down with a second ingenious plan to kill us, and then use a trick to bring our souls back so we can make an army that can fight the black army and the naga.

This is actually quite possible.