Do you think all criminals can be rehabilitated?

[Deleted]

some yes

ANYONE can change to whatever they want... for example, look at the gays, isnt that by choice

You can't be serious.

[unbound]

We'll use a recent story just for the sake of discussion:

http://www.wapt.com/article/boy-insi...-theft/9871713

Cliff Notes: Teens steal a car with a 6 year old in the back. Once they realized what has happened they shoot and kill the child.

I'm also curious if any charges are pending against the parent who left the child in the car in the first place.

That aside, I'm curious if anyone realistically thinks these teenagers can be rehabilitated, or at the very least, the shooter. If you do, why do you feel that way? Opinion or studies welcome.

Not all criminals can be rehabilitated, but, by the same token, not all criminals are hopeless.

As a moral person, we need to put forth the effort to try. To do anything less makes us lesser creatures. We didn't get to dominate this planet by solo efforts...we dominate this planet because we help each other out.

[Celista]

Most criminals can. Many crimes are crimes of passion/poor judgement/due to lack of economic opportunity/getting in with the wrong crowd. True sociopaths who express no remorse for their actions are rare, I would estimate one percent of the population or less would fall into this category.

[TITAN308]

Most criminals can. Many crimes are crimes of passion/poor judgement/due to lack of economic opportunity/getting in with the wrong crowd. True sociopaths who express no remorse for their actions are rare, I would estimate one percent of the population or less would fall into this category.

Does expressing remorse really change anything?

[Celista]

Does expressing remorse really change anything?

If it's sincere...it's not the expression of it that matters as much, it is the feeling it. The diagnostic criteria for antisocial personality disorder has changed to a spectrum disorder with the most recent iteration of the DSM, but a lack of empathy/continued violation of the rights of another is at the core of it.

Treatment for adults/children with antisocial personality disorder/conduct disorder (what most laypeople refer to as "sociopaths" or "psychopaths") is challenging, but successful treatment is possible, especially if it begins early. People don't realize that empathy is learned behavior for the most part, and human behavior is rarely completely attributable to genetics. It is typically a mix of genetics + environment.

[Thoughtful Trolli]

Is what you wrote like an early version of the Demolition Man script?

It's funny, as I happen to know how the three seashell clams work.

You see, in the future they fix the sewerage problems by filling the lines with biologically supreme worms, who literally live off our feces and clean it all up so well, along with various other behavior training benefits (like snitching on people hiding in the sewers or temporary landfill transfers for cleaning) that pretty much every municipality uses them. Bear in mind that the majority of these worms are the sizes of large dogs, but more lengthwise than girth, and are exceptionally flexible as well as dexterous.

There are, however, necessary changes which must be made by any municipality willing to host these magnificently beneficial organisms, and most of them are demonstrated with a video. The name of the video is "How do the three seashell clams work?" And it's as cheesy and campy as a 70's educational, finishing it's message by cajoling the audience with the phrase "He doesn't know how the clam shells work!" while everyone laughs at a person whom in the video played the role of an uneducated simpleton.

This creates a self-advertisement meme, which has existed long before the word meme became common, in the form of a trope where the educational material itself spurs a will to learn by teaching all those it has informed to mock those who are uninformed until they see the material, thus becoming informed. That's why they poke fun at Sylvester Stallone's character John Spartan. But I digress.

In the video, it's made very clear that to keep the worms and sewer systems functioning properly, the members of any municipality employing those worms have to change their behavior. When you've finished your business, you're supposed to take two of the clams and click them in one hand like castanets, while dragging the third clam across either side of that castanet to create a scraping noise similar to a güiro. This is the typical calling sound the worms have learned to listen for through the distant pipe lines of their entire sewer system, and is very familiar to them as a signal for social pleasantry, feeding, and mating, ensuring that the hungriest worm in the respective territory you've chosen to deposit your feces in comes quite promptly to clean you.

To assist with your cleaning, you should keep your lower body garments pulled below your knees, face away from the toilet bowl, and if you wish you may brace with the aid of a nearby object. Please remember that despite the sensations cleaning may produce, the worm is exceptionally hygienic and we've all shared the same experience.

Finally, at the end of the video, a message is included for anyone who finds a worm refusing to service them. Anyone in such a situation should immediately notify their employer and emergency services, at which time they'll receive a Gold Card pass to the closest hospital capable of assisting with this situation and a generous social services package including up to an entire year of vacation leave. At the hospital and under the best of care, these individuals will experience sharing the gift of life. Should you become one of the chosen for this wonderful gift, you'll also be awarded full honors for contributing to the society as a Honored Samaritan, and receive 1000 hours of community service credits!

Remember to use worms regularly to avoid being notified past the prime time for hospital assistance. Even if you haven't done your business, they're more than willing to give regular cleanings!

At this point, the uneducated man in the video asks where the toilet paper is, and everyone laughs at him, saying 'He doesn't know how the clam shells work!"

Roll credits.

[Ghostpanther]

Most criminals can. Many crimes are crimes of passion/poor judgement/due to lack of economic opportunity/getting in with the wrong crowd. True sociopaths who express no remorse for their actions are rare, I would estimate one percent of the population or less would fall into this category.

You estimate? Are you a behavior scientist or something along those lines and have data to back up your claim?

The incarceration rate has increased significantly the last 80+ years per 100k population. Now does this mean the prisons back in the 1920's were more like real prisons nowadays or we simply had tougher laws on punishing the criminal or a combination of the two? Or maybe the family unit was stronger back then and kids got better parental guidance. One can keep on guessing all they want, but something has changed.

[Shadowferal]

Actually I have to wonder (in horror) at the "Three Seashells" thing...provokes an image I hope to the gods I forget soon.
Whoever figured that out is definitely a criminal that can't be rehabbed. (Villainy at it's its most degenerate...ugh!)

[Celista]

You estimate? Are you a behavior scientist or something along those lines and have data to back up your claim?

The incarceration rate has increased significantly the last 80+ years per 100k population. Now does this mean the prisons back in the 1920's were more like real prisons nowadays or we simply had tougher laws on punishing the criminal or a combination of the two? Or maybe the family unit was stronger back then and kids got better parental guidance. One can keep on guessing all they want, but something has changed.

Yeah you can look it up, antisocial personality disorder has a prevalence rate of 0.6% in the UK and less than one percent among women in the US. It is around three percent in the US among men. This indicates to me the possibility of environment influencing its expression. Another possibility is methodology differences in regards to diagnosis, although I don't think this is it. You can read up on treatment programs online for individuals with conduct/antisocial personality disorder.

There are a lot of variables influencing incarceration rates, the criminalization of drugs and mandatory minimum sentencing for drug crimes is one notable variable...80 years ago, you could buy heroin and other opioids legally.

[Halicia]

Rehabilitation is more of a non-issue than it is spreading misconceptions about the criminal justice system in general.

I guess I'll break into four different classifications of "criminals" here.. serving time...

#1. Innocent, but found guilty. Happens on a disproportionate basis to those lacking wealth and means. Not only is rehabilitation not an issue here, but if they weren't a criminal before, they likely may be one before the time is done.

#2. Guilty of crime they don't believe is one. Rehabilitation isn't likely to change things here... if anything excessive punishment may create more antipathy towards the justice system in general among them and their peers if their crimes are largely viewed as miscarriages of justice.

#3. Guilty of a crime with regret/remorse. This is the population that can be rehabilitated. Maybe not even all of this population. Who knows ?

#4. Guilty of a crime with no remorse. Not going to be rehabilitated. The problem is... they may fake it, if its in their best interests... which makes it appear like rehabilitating group 3 is more difficult than it actually is.

[Hooked]

Parents need to set a good example for their kids. Don't lie, don't steal, don't take handouts. Even if you find a wallet turn it in, kids will understand the importance of being honest if its a way of life.

[Eazy]

It's just that you said that you cannot believe something because it's not faith. And that just makes no sense at all.

Well, maybe I just used wrong words. I meant that if something is a fact, you do not have to believe in it, it's just a fact, you know it. There's a difference between believing and knowing things... and that's all. :-)

[Deleted]

I guess I'll break into four different classifications of "criminals" here.. serving time...

You froget the Guilty of crime becuse of "profession" they do know that they do wrong, but the only thing they are good at are crime, and there frends and social life is other criminals.

Sure they can "reform" themself but start at the bottom of the social "status" rank without friends is a hard sales. Hence the need helpe to break there lifestyle, traditional prison only entrech there lifestyle, hang out for several years with criminals in prison and lern new criminal skills.

[Deleted]

I don't think Mr. Breivik can be fixed.

[xindralol]

@Bobblo
(somehow screwed up the quote : ( )[QUOTE=Bobblo;45810627]Correct me if i am wrong, i am not too familiar with the technicalities of the Bill of Rights, but is that open to interpretation? Is it possible that corporal punishment no longer be seen as 'cruel and unusual'?/QUOTE]

Pretty sure there's also basic human rights (->torture) and federal law ... it's far more complicated than just convincing a court this doesn't violate the eighth amendment.
My point is simply that even if you somehow get it on the books as an alternative to imprisonment there's still very strong arguments for invalidating any such law. We've come so far as a society - let's not take several steps back (even if recent events make that more likely ... - let's leave it at that haha).

[Shadowferal]

Correct me if i am wrong, i am not too familiar with the technicalities of the Bill of Rights, but is that open to interpretation? Is it possible that corporal punishment no longer be seen as 'cruel and unusual'?

Short answer; Yes.

Long answer; The Supreme Court tend to be the arbiters of how the US Constitution is interpreted, and they've typically left it to the states on how to proceed with the death penalty, as opposed to that which is considered "cruel and unusual," of which it isn't in many states. (Some states see it as cruel and unusual, while others don't)

Torture is banned and considered illegal in every way.

[Nurvus]

Some criminals are beyond saving.

However, Punishment is useless.
In my opinion there should only ever be 2 (or 3) types:
- Rehab
- Forced Labor - too dangerous to go free
- Death - too dangerous to stay alive

But the laws around who goes where need to be REALLY tight, because we're talking about a system that can and IS twisted to fulfil agendas, and a lot of innocent people go to prison, a lot of innocent people are denied probations.
Example: State needs "free" workers vs fair trial/rehab evaluations

[Uzkin]

Yes. Every criminal could, in principle, be rehabilitated given sufficiently advanced (neuro)science. The traditional lobotomy was already enough to fix many issues with aggression and violence. Brain, as a biochemical "computer", can in theory be rewritten and reprogrammed once the technology is sophisticated enough (f.ex. through medicine, biochemistry or nanotechnology); suitable modifications and alterations of the criminal's brain functions should then be able to remove the undesired criminal traits while still allowing the individual to be a productive member of the society.

A different question is, whether it's worth the effort to try to rehabilitate all criminals. Essentially, a thorough neural reconditioning would be equivalent to the death of the ego of the original person. (Sure, the same could be said of *any* kind of rehabilitation of a criminal, even if the process is purely non-invasive/psychiatric, but still...)

[zenkai]

We'll use a recent story just for the sake of discussion:

http://www.wapt.com/article/boy-insi...-theft/9871713

Cliff Notes: Teens steal a car with a 6 year old in the back. Once they realized what has happened they shoot and kill the child.

I'm also curious if any charges are pending against the parent who left the child in the car in the first place.

That aside, I'm curious if anyone realistically thinks these teenagers can be rehabilitated, or at the very least, the shooter. If you do, why do you feel that way? Opinion or studies welcome.

Nope, and these guys don't even deserve the chance.

[Nurvus]

This list clearly shows no goal of punishment. Rehab is quite different from death and forced labor. The law should punish violators for one reason alone: retribution. Rehab could be a secondary accomplishment; but should not interfere at all with the main goal.

If a person doesn't deserve to be free and cannot be made useful to pay for what it has done, that person should be dead.
And I mean dead in the cheapest possible way - not with fancy lethal injection execution chamber "shows".

Punishment that does nothing but spend tax money is stupid - plain and simple.

Retribution - Living on the streets and starving? Just commit a crime and be punished with food, drink and a place to sleep.