World of Casualcraft vs World of Challengecraft

[LedZeppelin]

I played during vanilla and tbc so i guess i already beat your challenge

[ablib]

• No heirlooms. All of your XP is normal or rested, and your gear is either crafted , quest reward, or world drop. Don't put heirlooms on. *Solved*
• No mounts til 40. Your heirloom bike is gone, and you must now wait til lvl 40 to get your mount. However, you gain access to special mounts based on your selection of Challenge Mode. Each faction has a special mount that requires Challenge mode, and Exalted rep. Don't use a mount until level 40. *solved*
• No LFD or LFR access. If you want to Dungeon, or Raid, you do it the old fashioned way. Group up and walk/ride/fly there. Don't use the LFD tool. *solved*
  
• Reagents - You once again have to keep them in your bags. Not sure how this changes anything...The need to buy reagents off a vendor isn't a challenge. Strike this. *solved*
  
• Hunters - You once again use ammo/arrows, but gain access to limited edition bows/guns. You have to feed your pets and train them, See above *solved*
  

Of course these are just "for instance" options. Not everyone is a fan of how things used to be. That said, the differences would be distinctive and WoW would experience a level of difficulty similar to Diablo. Just a random thought. What are your thoughts on the matter?

** FYI - this is merely a for instance pondering. I am not asking to have the game different, I am merely opening a conversation. Anyone who's only comment is "GTFO" or "Go play something else" should likely just move on since they obviously miss the point of healthy discussion about a game we all likely enjoy just as it is.

My comments in red are above.

A pointless stupid discussion is not a healthy discussion. I for one will never understand how low of an IQ one has to be to think this stuff up. I'll never understand. Same deal with the anti-flyers pissed off that they have no self control and fly. Not flying where I don't want to fly, is easy to me. I leveled a character semi-recently and wanted to see if things really were piss easy without heirlooms. I did it. By not putting them on -- all the way to max level. It's not hard. You don't need a stupid thread or ideas like this to do something that is already available in the game.


I thank god every day, I'm not the typical gamer brain stem.

[-Joker-]

There's an interesting discussion to be had around whether or not people would like a slower game instead of the lickety-split sort of leveling we have now. I think I would like that but I'm not convinced that I would be anywhere in the majority on that. Most of the complaints now are of the variety of "I can't finish what I'm doing soon enough" or alternately "It takes too long to get anything done". I'm quite sure that if leveling time were doubled or tripled and loaded up with all sorts of detailed little tasks you would need to do to move along that people would completely freak out.

It sounds fine in concept but the reality is that most of this stuff would slow progression down quite a lot. Harder leveling fights that take much longer with more deaths and running back and the like where getting through a zone would be measured in days instead of hours with a lot of trips to somewhere to buy ammunition or reagents? Not buying that that would be a popular thing. At all.

It's entirely possible that like most discussions, this topic is driven by nostalgia. People claim a pristine server would be amazing. Problem is, pristine vanilla servers exist, yet people rally back to retail, likely for a variety of reasons. I know when I stepped away from Retail for a few months, it was to level a Gnome Paladin. Why did I go back? Because the ceiling was permanent. I think if all of these conditions existed in a retail environment, and I were able to play any Race/Class/Faction combo I choose, I would certainly give it a go. I am in no hurry and can appreciate the challenges that existed in TBC since I showed up 48 hours after the Dark Portal did.

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I don't think enough people would enjoy what you describe to justify the costs of creating it. I would not be against having it as an option... I just don't think it would go over very well in the long run.

Despite all the claims to the contrary, most people prefer easy over challenging for the bulk of their activities.

I've enjoyed it in the private sector, but then I realize little things like not being able to mog gear, or that my Raven Lord is only available on my Druid. I would need the speed and practicum of TBC combined with the QoL changes of retail.

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My comments in red are above.

A pointless stupid discussion is not a healthy discussion. Not everyone thinks it is a stupid discussion. Usually just the narrowminded who hate change of any sort, particularly change they disagree with. I for one will never understand how low of an IQ one has to be to think this stuff up. Ideas come in all shapes and sizes. One's intelligence quotient is hardly a measuring stick. Some of the smartest men in the world lack common sense. I'll never understand. Same deal with the anti-flyers pissed off that they have no self control and fly. Not flying where I don't want to fly, is easy to me. I leveled a character semi-recently and wanted to see if things really were piss easy without heirlooms. I did it. By not putting them on -- all the way to max level. It's not hard. You don't need a stupid thread or ideas like this to do something that is already available in the game. I am glad you are not a mod here. It seems any topic that pisses you off would get locked. Thankfully we have impartial individuals who allow discussion to continue,
even when faced with insults by people like yourself.


I thank god every day, I'm not the typical gamer brain stem.

My responses are in red. I would say thanks for stopping by, but aside from insults and ire, you offered nothing to the topic.

[Daevied]

I like changes , but dont like your ideas, leveling have always been a casual thing for casuals; make it a challenge and it will be a casual challenge for casuals. The real hardcore pro players only care about endgame.

If you do want a challenge right now i suggest you to try doing the ironman leveling.

[Selah]

I get where you're coming from OP but think it's a pretty bland and reused idea as a whole. Let me propose something in the same vein. We'll call them season servers.

Similar to PvP seasons we see, season servers are a PvE variant. The idea itself is rather simple, create servers that are only up for a certain period of time. Each season itself can vary in length and every new season has a new ruleset for the world.

Season Ideas:
- Ironman Season; The goal is to hit a predetermined level cap (60, 70, 80, ect.)
*Character deaths are permanent
*Only gray, white, and green items drop. All three items have a chance to upgrade on drop to blue quality
*Talents are disabled
*You may only use a DPS spec
*Heirlooms are disabled
*Only 60% mount speed is usable

- Wrath of the Lich King Seaon; The goal is to hit level cap of 80 using any class of your choice and then progress through the Wrath of the Lich King raids and topple ICC before the season ends.
*Monks and DH will not be available for this season
*Heirlooms are disabled
*DKs start at level 1 in appropriate racial starting zones
*Flying is only earned after reaching level cap
*Professions will be disabled this season

-The Wandering Isle season; The goal of this season is to hit level cap without ever leaving the Wandering Isle starting zone
*All classes will be available to Pandaren including DKs and DHs
*DKs and DHs start at level 1
*Mobs will scale with player level +1 per 20 levels the player has gained
*Legion invasions will happen on the Wandering Isle once a day at different times during the day
*Heirlooms are disabled this season
*Gear drops have a chance to upgrade and give 5% bonus to incoming player XP
*Level cap increased to 200 for the season

Rewards - all rewards gained from each season are issued to the players live account and characters. Rewards include mounts, titles, unique transmog skins, unlocking old and removed transmogs, expansion alpha access, unique heirloom pieces, ability to transmog old legendary skins, ect.

I think something like this would stop everyone complaining about wanting legacy servers or challenge servers while addressing the issue of content on these servers. Might also rope in some older players who are dying for a nostalgia trip.

[Marston]

I would like a challenge/hard mode, but the only thing it should do would be to increase the strength of enemies. Easy way would be to give your character a Debuff that makes him weaker/enemies within X yards stronger and said buff could be turned on or off, just like you can turn on/off the EXP gain.

The more complex route would be to rebalance the whole game for this specific mode, and that would be a stupid idea, because that would require its own servers and I really doubt it would work out in the long run.

[glowpipe]

Insanely awesome idea. Splitting an already split community.

The awesome idea thing was sarcasm btw

[Lightbull]

My comments in red are above.

A pointless stupid discussion is not a healthy discussion. I for one will never understand how low of an IQ one has to be to think this stuff up. I'll never understand. Same deal with the anti-flyers pissed off that they have no self control and fly. Not flying where I don't want to fly, is easy to me. I leveled a character semi-recently and wanted to see if things really were piss easy without heirlooms. I did it. By not putting them on -- all the way to max level. It's not hard. You don't need a stupid thread or ideas like this to do something that is already available in the game.


I thank god every day, I'm not the typical gamer brain stem.

A growing problem I've noticed is that even though the choice is there, people won't do it. Same with the flying dilemma, the anti-flyers will fly anyway because it's more convenient. The challenge mode he suggested encourages people to play without those features, and reward them for doing so.

[Fyersing]

I think you mistake tediousness for challenge. None of the things you listed make the game any more difficult, it just makes it more tedious / time consuming.

I would welcome more challenging content though, Artifact skin, Brawlers guild, and now Deaths of Chromie (For now), are about the only challenging single player content there is right now. Mythic raids and mythic+ dungeons are (very) challenging, but they are also group content, and that part makes a lot of people feel like not doing it. It is a shame that there is so little challenging content in the game to be honest.

This.

It isn't more difficult to fly for 9 minutes to any given dungeon/raid, it's just annoying.

[Lightbull]

Insanely awesome idea. Splitting an already split community.

The awesome idea thing was sarcasm btw

If it's anything like Diablo, they will be in the same chat channel. They just won't be able interact with each other's characters or form a party.

[Sansnom]

So it occurred to me recently, a great many things about the game have changed, and the players along with it. I think it is possible to have two distinctive play styles without interfering with one another, keeping it easy for the more casual player, and challenging for the more vested and skilled player. So, here is my idea.

When you create your character, you have two choices (similar to Diablo). You can select either:

Normal mode - You create your character, log in, and play as you did yesterday with no difference to the game whatsoever.

Challenge mode - You create your character, log in, and play with no access to anything, and the rules have changed for you. You now have:

I would hardly call it a challenge mode. More an old school mode. Heirlooms makes levelling faster, but even without it, levelling is not that difficult.

Some of the items you listed can be self imposed. That fact players needs an external element to impose the restriction kind of suggest players, despite what they are to want, still uses heirloom and mounts at 1.

[Deleted]

World of Tedious Chorecraft ResidentSleeper sure sign me up

[Sansnom]

They still need to eliminate:
LFR
Group finder
Dungeon finder
Sharding
Phasing
Massive antisocial questlines like suramar
Garrisons/order halls

What is intended to fix? Random people not talking in PUGs? Oh the shame. How do you know these people are anti-social? You do not. For all you know, they could be really funny and talkative. 10/20 minutes in a random dungeon where most people are doing something else rather than typing in chat.

People in dungeon in are there for a reason and it is not to socialize. If it happens, great, I have had some good conversations with people. But these were the players that considered to be "bad". We wiped on a bosses a couple of times so we stop to organize ourselves better. This was with LFD. Many other groups would have had people leaving or kicking. But this stuck together till the very end.

Had these people tried to PUG the old fashion way, they would gotten rejected due to lack of gear, experience or skill.

And fix the lfg channel to make it default to ON.

Right. So spamming LFG for PUGs. Lets go backward.

[-Joker-]

Insanely awesome idea. Splitting an already split community.

The awesome idea thing was sarcasm btw

It wouldn't split the community. Everyone would still be playing on the same realms. The only difference is, your character would be flagged on the back end, like a Starter Edition (for lack of example) where you are unable to see or where heirlooms, unable to access riding until the old levels, and unable to perform certain actions without the use of reagents in the game. This is where Pristine realms would divide the community, and my idea blends challenge mode players with normal retail players. Ultimately, it is to cater to the challenge of the individual without forcing everyone on the server to play in that mode.

[Eazy]

So you think that Vanilla was challenging? I thought that you mean hardcore challenge as in diablo.

[tikcol]

Nobody cares for pristine servers, challenge server or wtf you would like to call them. What we want is the real essence of WoW back in full glory, not some close approximation of the true thing.

I also don't care for your reasons not to do it, you either care for it or you don't. Hating it is petty.


Just give us legacy servers and bugger off.

[Ielenia]

Challenge mode - You create your character, log in, and play with no access to anything, and the rules have changed for you. You now have:

You do realize that none of the items you listed for your "challenge mode" would make the game any more challenging, right? The only change those items would cause is greatly stretching out the time needed to reach max level, without adding a single level of challenge at all.

[-Joker-]

Your idea of harder just seems more annoying than hard to me

And for those of us who lived it in TBC and are thankful it is behind us, I agree.

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You do realize that none of the items you listed for your "challenge mode" would make the game any more challenging, right? The only change those items would cause is greatly stretching out the time needed to reach max level, without adding a single level of challenge at all.

Oh, I know. But my idea is essentially what a Pristine server would look like, save for the fact of having the players blended on an existing realm. People ask all the time for servers frozen in time. This idea would essentially bring TBC back to life for some players. I personally would never do it just because I am a casual who enjoys the last 10 years worth of QoL changes.

[Aeula]

I hate challenge. I play games to unwind and relax, not to destroy my keyboard.

[tikcol]

I started playing at the end of vanilla, I like how people complain about how time gated and alt unfriendly legion is when both vanilla and BC were 1000x times worse in both aspects

That's because nowadays it's just normal to have 10 characters at max level and complain you don't have time to do all the content with all of them

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I hate challenge. I play games to unwind and relax, not to destroy my keyboard.

What you need is relaxation or to git gud