Kil'jaeden hc time to give up?

[Arainie]

This is only my opinion and i can understand why some people might not agree but for me heroic should be something you can clear with small amount of brute forcing. Where a failure to deal with a mechanic result in a couple of death. Where insta-wipe mechanic are easy to deal with (add interrupt on Gul'dan).
Armageddon for me is a mechanic that would fit perfectly in mythic, the soaking part is okay but to me the fact that at any point in the fight 1 missed soak result in a full raid whip is to punishing for hero, especially with the fact that the mechanic overlaps a lot with other position based stuff.

I'm not saying they should nerf it, like i said in my other post i think it's a mechanic that is a bit to harsh for hero and that it will make this boss a bigger wall than what i think a hero boss should be...

i personally disliked the fight but it's mostly because intermission 2 is to gimmicky and doesn't seem to fit in the fight super well... Phase 3 is also very boring...

I suppose I can agree that the failure punishment is a little bit too harsh. Perhaps nerfing the damage one failed soak does by 50% (meaning you can actually heal through it) and allowing it to stack so that two failed soaks would actually kill you would be more suitable for heroic.

But the fact remains as Yggdrasil wrote above:

All it does is kick people squarely in the face that are meter whores more or less.

This issue has never been as pressing as it is right now. I've been an officer and raid leader since WotLK (currently co-lead with GM in a 2 day Mythic raiding guild) and even at our level (yes I know clearing Mythic is not an achievement or anything, but I want to give some context) we have constant issues with members prioritizing damage over mechanics unless everyone explicitly has to take part in the mechanic. Unless I continuously press the issue of mechanics over damage I feel like many slip into the damage meter minigame again and again. I don't mean to criticize every single damage dealer but I can never remember this being as much of an issue in the past as it is right now, especially as current encounter design becomes increasingly complex with each expansion.

[Deleted]

Arma should have just been a stacking debuff like anihilation on xhul horac. Basically anything over 1 stack = 1 shot. Missing 1 arma atm is gonna wipe the raid with the current gear which is a bit too much for a heroic encounter.

[Fappy]

I like the spectacle of the fight, but overall KJ is super boring. The DPS check is way lower than you are fretting over. It's literally all about catching meatballs and dancing in swirlies. As a boomy, I spend half the fight in bear form emoting and waiting for something to happen.

[cuafpr]

sounds like DPS is high b.c. they tunnel the boss and ignore basic mechanics of the fight, find better dps.

[kazas]

Some people still try to dps kj while he has the damagr reduction lol while ignoring mechanics

[Korban]

I seriously dont know what to do anymore , i killed guldan hc week 2 but kil'jaeden is the true aids , i have done few p3 on him and the times i didnt was a wipe to armaggedon , literally nothing else is hard about this fight , i gathered the best possible group 6 dps out of 11 were doing 920k+ and the others 800k+ and still wiped a ton to armaggedon , every now and then someone moves out too early or something is left unsoaked , i myself as a tank soak every single time and i help as much as possible , im close to get a mental breakdown to this ability , im almost immortal on felclaw and still losing to this shit , it has become unbearable , healers and tanks dont fail anymore but armaggedon does , congrats to blizzard for thinking such a shit ability which is impossible to coordinate properly and has a ton of rng in it aswell and also favors some classes over others.

KJ HC is an easy fight. Just follow easy mechanics and use some voice communication.
I pugged it the second week with some LFR half-guild raid, with average player ilvl around 910

Gul'Dan was harder.

, every now and then someone moves out too early or something is left unsoaked

That's your problem. Don't take retards who can't follow their only assignment.

[xuros]

People tend to freak out with Armageddon when they have the big circle around them as well. The circle detonates and they for some reason think the Armageddon went off and run out of the swirl instead of staying till the swirls gone. From what I've seen when we wipped to it that was the issue. Easy to fix.

[Sylvaeres]

Literally the easiest end boss on NM and HC they have made in ages.

Boss is so unfathomably boring and easy.

Agreed. You literally just follow the mechanic pattern until the boss falls over

[Tolian]

@ OP - I feel you on the soaks. My guild is currently failing hard at this because we wipe repeatedly on soaks. It doesn't mean the boss is overtuned, it just means people aren't doing the mechanics properly. Not much to say beyond that. Mechanics are a pass/fail check, at least at this point where you can't just ignore them through raw power.

[KaPe]

Agreed. You literally just follow the mechanic pattern until the boss falls over

You could describe the majority of bosses in such way, so it doesn't really mean anything. Especially if failing this mechanic even one time is pretty much an instant wipe on heroic, which is pretty damn punishing. Outhealing the dot won't happen until the boss is way overgeared. It's even weirder when you consider how forgiving phase 3 is - you can lose people with every orb/obelisk/laser and still kill him fairly easily.

[furiousferret]

Our guild is probably on 35 pulls or so, gotten to 4%. We started with 30, but the groups been cleaved down to about 20 now. My guess is we down it with about 15.

[Spotnick]

took us 30~ish pulls in a pug. Mileage may vary i guess. How you can fail soaking in a coordinated raid is beyond me.

everybody had their reason.. mine is tank called for cd ironbark and I was out of range and had a brain fart.

It's also one of these fights that seems to me doing at 30 is not optimal.

[Bloodmagix]

It's just soaking I don't see why groups fail so hard at KJ..

Mage | Demon Hunter | Druid

[MrLachyG]

sounds like DPS is high b.c. they tunnel the boss and ignore basic mechanics of the fight, find better dps.

My thoughts exactly.

[Inuyaki]

Some people still try to dps kj while he has the damagr reduction lol while ignoring mechanics

Well, there are classes that have cooldown reduces on attacks... CoF would be the best example, but also things like Frostbolt crits reducing Icy Veins cd and such...
If you have debuff, you can't soak anyway and you stand in front of the boss so you most likely soak beam with that

[Kapaya]

I think kj is a bit overtuned on heroic but not very mechanically complicated. Just relax, you'll get it.
Side note. Serious question. Why do people put a space before a comma so often around here? Is this a European thing? I've never seen it once in game or anywhere around the forums but here it's incredibly common.

Nope, my guess is that he's writing from a phone or tablet and it's making a space after each auto corrected word.

[melodramocracy]

Literally the easiest end boss on NM and HC they have made in ages.

Boss is so unfathomably boring and easy.

You think normal mode Helya, Gul'dan were tougher than KJ? That's quaint.

[Gatao]

the hardest part of KJ is when the mechanics start to combo but still if you are wiping to armageddon alone you need to review the team you are raiding with.

[Seramore]

Gul'Dan was harder.

Mechanically yes, execution wise I would argue that Kil'jaeden is harder. It requires far more coordination and there's mechanics that punish the entire raid if you fail to do so. Missing an Armageddon soak pretty much means an inevitable wipe. I don't think there was really anything that could necessarily wipe a raid if one out of ~7 people fucked up with a mechanic on Gul'dan.

[BiggestNoob]

heroic KJ is mathematically impossible