Possible future hero classes.

[Hctaz]

It was in a blue post long ago from Blizz.
Hero Class, it's a char that will not start at lvl 1 and with a unique starting area.

Those are just aspects of it. I mean it's very obvious to make the connection. It's called a hero class and it's literally the class based on a hero unit in WC3. They just arbitrarily decided that those two conditions needed to be met but it has nothing to do with why it's a "hero"

[HeiAggra]

Those are just aspects of it. I mean it's very obvious to make the connection. It's called a hero class and it's literally the class based on a hero unit in WC3. They just arbitrarily decided that those two conditions needed to be met but it has nothing to do with why it's a "hero"

Well then go complaint to blizzard i just said what they wrote on that blue post.

[Hctaz]

Well then go complaint to blizzard i just said what they wrote on that blue post.

There's nothing to complain about. Until they release a non-hero WC3 class as a labeled hero class then I'm not wrong anyway. This is just a known factor: The hero classes are heroes from WC3. Most people just know that's the case.

[Belisaurio]

If you dont know DH was supposed to be launched in Vanilla but ok!

Uff, alot of points here:
-People believed that because there was one DH in the back of WOW vanilla Box, but Blizzard used alot of Warcraft 3 re-models/arts in WOW (they had an amani troll too btw) so..., and even in interviews, the DH concept was present at the start of TBC first design process (like Pandarens to be TBC alliance race before Draeneys).
-The discipline priests were designed to be something like monks (this is why some of ther auto-buffs had atack dmg early alpha/vanilla), but you see what become after...we have monks!!!.
-There was a Demon Hunter NPC too (one long chain quest), there was some DK NPCs too (eastern plagues/Stratholme) and there was Necromacners NPCs too (Scholomance).

But one thing to know, all this points proves NOTHING. All of them are concepts, brainstorming, first talks within the design team, etc... adn we don't know how all this things were really supported in the design process (you know that vanilla had 52 concepts of classes?), so it's just smoke.

Here's the thing though, Blizzard is notorious for making sure that certain aspects of classes remain unique to those classes. They have been systematically removing shared spells between classes. For example. Priests lost their Devouring Plague because DKs use diseases. Warlocks lost Metamorphosis because of the Demon Hunter inclusion. Shadow Priests got their entire theme redone because it was too close to Affliction.

In other words, it's highly doubtful that Blizzard would introduce another class that summons undead, drains life, utilizes diseases, etc. The Demon Hunter proved that.

No, Demon Hunter proved that I was right in your last Demonhunter/Tinkerer thread. Blizzard can do whatever they want. So if Blizzard think that necromancers fit their new expansion, they can design them solving any problem with overlaping/uniqueness/whetever arguments you want to use.

Btw, I don't think that blizzards are designing a new necromancer class for 8.0, but don't lie yourself using this types of arguements.

[HeiAggra]

True it waas vanilla of course they had to think alot on what to do, what classes races and all that, so only a part would be available.
I remember a interview from a dev a few years saying that DH were to be in vanilla but it was sidelined until TBC and never camed and would have been the perfect time. DK's they new it had to be with LK expansion and stuff like that.

[Teriz]

No, Demon Hunter proved that I was right in your last Demonhunter/Tinkerer thread. Blizzard can do whatever they want. So if Blizzard think that necromancers fit their new expansion, they can design them solving any problem with overlaping/uniqueness/whetever arguments you want to use.

Btw, I don't think that blizzards are designing a new necromancer class for 8.0, but don't lie yourself using this types of arguements.

No, I always said that a DH class cannot exist in WoW as long as Warlocks have meta. I was right about that, Blizzard completely removed meta from the Warlock class. They would have to equally strip abilities from DKs and a Warlocks in order to bring in a Necromancer class.

[Deleted]

http://www.wowhead.com/death-knight

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I'm just saying that a Shadow Hunter is essentially a Troll Shaman at this point, because that's what it is in WC3. It's abilities were placed into the Shaman class, and Voodoo is an aspect of Shamanism.

Blizzard could change what a Shadow Hunter is, and make them into a WoW class. Honestly though, if a Shadow Hunter isn't a Troll Shaman, then what is it?

Oh Teriz, and I agree with you! Troll shaman is that, so is troll survival hunter atleast slightly with camouflage, poisons, axe throwing. But that doesnt mean we cant have it as a future class or spec that embraces the physical prowess of a hunter and the wisdom of a shaman. I hope they will introduce or change some specs in the coming expansion but I dont know if its too much work or not for them. I cant wait to see the reveal.

I also agree that even if goblins and gnomes arent popular. If we got tinker A LOT of people would roll a goblin on gnome. I personally love gnome stuff.

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No, I always said that a DH class cannot exist in WoW as long as Warlocks have meta. I was right about that, Blizzard completely removed meta from the Warlock class. They would have to equally strip abilities from DKs and a Warlocks in order to bring in a Necromancer class.

Its a double edged sword. Bring forth a new spec and devour an old. I do think demo locks are really cool in Legion but it does make old demo locks very upset. Thats why Id like shaman to have more specs so they dont remove shaman abilities in case of a witch doctor and shadow hunter spec.

Other mmos allow cross classing. This would open up a way for unique specs. Sounds way to complicated and time consuming for Blizzard though.

[Hitei]

I also agree that even if goblins and gnomes arent popular. If we got tinker A LOT of people would roll a goblin on gnome. I personally love gnome stuff.

Or it would see a pretty minimal amount of play because people don't want to play those races, goblins especially.

[Deleted]

The last 3 classes had a tank spec. I doubt the next one will guys

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PRETTY sure if tinker became available orcs, undead, troll, humans, dwarves, draenei would also be able to be tinker

Yeah, goblins arent too popular are they

[Belisaurio]

No, I always said that a DH class cannot exist in WoW as long as Warlocks have meta. I was right about that, Blizzard completely removed meta from the Warlock class. They would have to equally strip abilities from DKs and a Warlocks in order to bring in a Necromancer class.

Well, that's not true. You said ALOT of things to debunk the Demonhunter concept from the game. But that's offtopic btw.

Necromancers have the same "overlapping" problem like Demon Hunters had (main points):

-Pet cloth class: Warlocks.
-Use of skeletons/undead pets (theme): Death Knight.
-Use of undead/decay magic: Death knights
-Spell/ranged user: Warlocks/mages/Shadow priest.

That's the main points of the necromancer, the thing is how can you create the necromancer class with all this points in mind? Maybe you can't, but we are not talking about you, we are talking about how Blizzard can.

[Deleted]

It was in a blue post long ago from Blizz.
Hero Class, it's a char that will not start at lvl 1 and with a unique starting area.

I also liked the input of someone who said that all the hero classes have been (from a lore viewpoint) other classes before they became the hero class.

Arthas was a paladin before he turned into a death knight and Illidan was a mage before becoming a demon hunter.

[Faenskap]

Dark Ranger could be a hero class but again what specs could you add to it? There was warden idea but again it is special to n.elf as far as i know. All i can think more is something related to Murky and his class but who the heck wants a murloc race/class combination?

I do! Murlock warlock, his name shall be Murlock. Yes, I'm not creative, but neither are others, as I saw a DH named Demonhuñter some days ago.

[HeiAggra]

I also liked the input of someone who said that all the hero classes have been (from a lore viewpoint) other classes before they became the hero class.

Arthas was a paladin before he turned into a death knight and Illidan was a mage before becoming a demon hunter.

The problem is that ppl think "hero class" is stronger then oters and in game thats is not the case, is just a class that does not start at lvl 1.

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I do! Murlock warlock, his name shall be Murlock. Yes, I'm not creative, but neither are others, as I saw a DH named Demonhuñter some days ago.

That name is reserved for that day...

[Deleted]

A warlock murloc called Murlock. Laughed out loud, thank you xD I should expect this.

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Hero class just sounded shiny in Wotlk. Dont think too much about it now. No new class will start at lvl 1 now because everything before Legion will be irrelephant when the new expansion starts. Probably will start at 108 or something. The ONLY reason I didnt play Monk in MoP was because it started at lvl 1 it was the first class I boosted in WoD when lvl boosts came out and its been my most played class in Legion and the end of WoD.

I think... Im going to place my bets on more specs rather than a new class. Some further shaping of current Legion specs especially the ones players have had a problem enjoying. But Im grasping at straws. Why cant I see the future!?

[Kagdar]

The term "Hero Class" surely was first used to reference the Hero Unit in W3. Geez WoW as a game is all derived from the RPG aspect of W3 so having classes in both games that share the same names is kinda obvious. Both games are following the same story.

But since they introduced DKs, they had to take a stance on what exactly is a Hero Class in WoW considering WoW is a mmorpg that need some class balancing to make everybody somewhat equals.

So Ghostcrawler was asked about this in a Q&A and that is hos response :

Quoted from the official Q&A on Death Knights.[1]
"Hero class" meant that the DK started at higher level (and also with a lot of blue gear and so on). We thought it made sense for the DK story because you're treated as a high-level character and veteran of past events. We didn't think that made as much sense for the monk, especially when there were so many low-level pandaren running around, and the (perhaps flimsy) justification for non-pandaren monks learning how to be monks from the pandaren. We might very well use hero classes again if it makes sense for a future class though."

— Ghostcrawler - The Term "Hero Class".[2]

No where does in imply that it need to be referencing a Hero Unit from WC3

Sure DK and DH are both linking to exactly that. But in no way ever say that futur Hero Units need to come from WC3 Hero Units.

So can we stop arguing about that?
@Thimagryn @HeiAggra @Hctaz @Ielenia You guys are ALL correct.

[Directionalk9]

The term "Hero Class" surely was first used to reference the Hero Unit in W3. Geez WoW as a game is all derived from the RPG aspect of W3 so having classes in both games that share the same names is kinda obvious. Both games are following the same story.

But since they introduced DKs, they had to take a stance on what exactly is a Hero Class in WoW considering WoW is a mmorpg that need some class balancing to make everybody somewhat equals.

So Ghostcrawler was asked about this in a Q&A and that is hos response :



No where does in imply that it need to be referencing a Hero Unit from WC3

Sure DK and DH are both linking to exactly that. But in no way ever say that futur Hero Units need to come from WC3 Hero Units.

So can we stop arguing about that?
@Thimagryn @HeiAggra @Hctaz @Ielenia You guys are ALL correct.

This, so much this!

[Teriz]

Or it would see a pretty minimal amount of play because people don't want to play those races, goblins especially.

Well the question is why don't people play those races?

Sure, there is a contingent of players who view Goblins and Gnomes as "stupid" or "gay", so those players are unreachable.

However, there is also a group of players who don't play Goblins or Gnomes because they can't find a class that completely fits them properly. I'm within that group, and I seriously doubt that I'm alone.

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Well, that's not true. You said ALOT of things to debunk the Demonhunter concept from the game. But that's offtopic btw.

That was my main issue though, and Blizzard resolved that issue by completely erasing a Warlock spec. It's on topic because people asking for Necromancers don't seem to understand that if Blizzard brought that class into the game, they would have to erase elements of existing classes. Warlock players are still pretty bitter about losing old school demonology, especially since the current version isn't doing so hot. You think they're going to be happy with another class taking elements of Affliction? You think Death Knights are going to be happy about losing iconic spells like Raise Dead, Army of the Dead, Death Coil, etc?

I'm not opposed to the concept of Necromancers, I'm opposed to the concept of taking concepts away from existing classes to cobble together a new class. This leads to classes feeling "samey" and a loss of distinction between the classes, and that's not a good thing for the game.

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Oh Teriz, and I agree with you! Troll shaman is that, so is troll survival hunter atleast slightly with camouflage, poisons, axe throwing. But that doesnt mean we cant have it as a future class or spec that embraces the physical prowess of a hunter and the wisdom of a shaman. I hope they will introduce or change some specs in the coming expansion but I dont know if its too much work or not for them. I cant wait to see the reveal.

I also agree that even if goblins and gnomes arent popular. If we got tinker A LOT of people would roll a goblin on gnome. I personally love gnome stuff.

We'll see I suppose. I'd prefer Blizzard simply expanding the existing Voodoo theme in the Shaman class. I think the only thing that really makes people "feel" that Shaman aren't Shadow Hunters is the unique throwing weapon that the SH hero used.

Also I agree that people will re-roll into a Tinker class. Especially if said Tinker class is mech-based and properly implemented.

[Ielenia]

You are literally using correlation is not causation to say a chicken coming from an egg is a coincidence every time you see it happen. That's not logic, it's ignorance.

Your comparison fails because we're not actually seeing the "chicken come from the egg", here. I.E. we have no confirmation from the developers that hero classes in WoW must come from heroes of WC3.

Blizzard designing a Death Knight class that incorporates abilities and appearance of a Warcraft 3 Death Knight is pure coincidence.

That is nowhere near what I said, considering we're talking about the hero part of 'hero class'.

Blizzard devs talking about keeping the Demon Hunter 'close to its fantasy', resembling the Demon Hunters of Warcraft 3 and using similar abilities, is to you, coincidence and not intentional design.

Again, nowhere near what I said, since we're talking about what makes one potential class eligible for being a 'hero class', not their fantasy or abilities.

You are essentially saying Death Knights and Demon Hunters are a result of acts of randomness.

And you accuse me of ignorance. Congratulations on the projection, I guess?

[Thimagryn]

we're talking about what makes one potential class eligible for being a 'hero class', not their fantasy or abilities.

No we're not. We're not talking about potential class eligibility. YOU are, and you took what I mentioned out of context to fit some narrative for which you're now arguing against, which I've explained many times is your own misunderstanding. No part of what I've said has anything to do with POTENTIAL classes.

"Where do you think the concept of Hero classes come from?" doesn't mention anything about what Hero classes will or can be. Do you see anywhere that it mentions that Hero Classes will only be from Warcraft 3? I've even said many times that a Dragonsworn would make a great fit as a Hero class, so I don't see how you can even bring this topic up with me. I believe ANYTHING can be a Hero class given that Blizzard has the will to make it work. Yet it's pretty damn clear where the origin of the Hero Class comes from - Warcraft 3 Heros; and the two examples that we have, the Death Knight and Demon Hunter. Calling this a 'coincidence' is absolutely ignoring the intentional design by Blizzard developers.

Again for the final time - the statement I made and am making is not relevant to what CAN BE a Hero class. You are taking it out of context and making an argument where there is none. I'm saying Chickens come from eggs, you're saying other things can come from eggs too. At this point I'm telling you you're still misunderstanding and I can't figure out why you think I'm saying ONLY chickens can come from eggs when that was never part of the original statement. Chickens come from eggs. The Hero class in WoW (as it stands) was derived from Warcraft 3 Heroes. Honestly, there is no narrative beyond that simple statement.

[Shakou]

Dark Ranger is the only decent hero class option I can see happening.

If the class is based on Sylvanas who was a high elven ranger general before her undeath, then there's at least room for two specs, a melee and a ranged one. People have been craving a necromancer spec for a long time, you could work that in there as well.

Realistically, there is absolutely no chance at all whatsoever in any way shape or form that there will ever be another class added to this game that uses a bow, or similar ranged weapons. It is not going to happen and it is simply not unique enough to warrant being it's own playable class. The hunter as it is envisioned by blizzard encompasses elements of all the classic tropes of this character type in it's 3 specs. Besides, Dark Rangers were added to the game when they made Undead a playable hunter race the same way that Sunwalkers were added when Tauren Paladins became a thing, you can already *be* a Dark Ranger.

Also Death Knights are WOW's answer to Necromancers 100%. They even have a straight up necromancer spec called Unholy.