Crackdown 3 delayed to 2018

[Jtbrig7390]

I don't disagree that Microsoft has screwed the pooch with the X in many ways, similar to how they screwed the pooch with the initial Xbox One rollout. But for different reasons than what you state, because frankly you're incorrect when you say that the X won't have a decent amount of support from existing/upcoming title when it launches or that Microsoft hasn't marketed it much.

If you read what i said then you would have known I never said it wouldn't have support. I said they DID NOT MARKET THE DIFFERENCE and why $500 is worth spending on it.

Yes its going to have support, But they have no new games showing it. Why should someone who already has a XB1 and Gears 4 buy this system? Playing it in upscale 4k (or native if its native) isn't enough.

If you are going to say I am wrong about what I said at lease read what I said. Also No the system has barely been marketed at all. It was shown at E3,Gamescon and last year. That's it, They have barely put anything else out for it.

Feel free to look around the web, The opinion I have of the system and how they handled it isn't just my opinion. Its the opinion of a vast amount of people when looking at the facts.

[Edge-]

If you read what i said then you would have known I never said it wouldn't have support. I said they DID NOT MARKET THE DIFFERENCE and why $500 is worth spending on it.

What do you mean "did not market the difference"? They're marketing the additional power hard, they been pushing HARD on the "TRUE 4K" nonsense since early this year.

And it's blowing up in their face now that more games are confirmed to run at sub-native 4K resolutions on it. I don't disagree that it's not really delivering that much more over the Pro for the extra $100 (beyond the proper 4K blue ray player, but that's in the S as well), just for different reasons. Because they've very much been pushing hard that the X has more raw power than the Pro by a decent margin, even if it's largely just pointless dick measures.

Yes its going to have support, But they have no new games showing it. Why should someone who already has a XB1 and Gears 4 buy this system? Playing it in upscale 4k (or native if its native) isn't enough.

I don't believe Sony had any major titles launch alongside the Pro, for context. In the window, yes, but not at launch. Granted, Sony is in a leadership position and didn't need to have that extra bump, Microsoft is coming from behind and does.

It's the same sales proposition for the X that it is for the Pro - buy a mid-gen hardware refresh for more pixels or more stable framerates. The difference is that it's a harder sell for Microsoft given their weaker position in the market and the fact that the X is retailing at $100 over the Pro. Which again, despite its added power, puts it at a similar disadvantage in terms of pricing that the Xbone had at launch compared to the PS4.

Microsoft is being stupid with this, I'm not disagreeing with you. And yes, losing Crackdown 3 as a launch title for the hardware, even if it's not a major blockbuster title, does hurt Microsoft. They'd at least have had some kind of new software going out at launch, now we've just gotta hope that they've got solid patches for all their first/second party titles lined up (I know many are already confirmed) and that they're working closely with all major third party partners to either get patches for their released games or make sure they will be supporting the X when their games launch.

If you are going to say I am wrong about what I said at lease read what I said. Also No the system has barely been marketed at all. It was shown at E3,Gamescon and last year. That's it, They have barely put anything else out for it.

This isn't true at all. They've done countless interviews about it, sent their developers out to talk about it, given it plenty of love at E3, it'll be at Gamescom this year (they already had their event over the weekend). Again, they haven't started their full force ad blitzes for it, but that's because it literally just started going on presale. The ad blitz comes closer to launch, right now major spends on ads would be a gigantic waste.

Feel free to look around the web, The opinion I have of the system and how they handled it isn't just my opinion. Its the opinion of a vast amount of people when looking at the facts.

Cool, I don't care how many people share the opinion. Appeals to popularity are pointless, especially since most folks follow very little of the business side of the industry and come at it purely from the consumer point of view. I'm a nerd and follow more of the business/marketing side of things as well, in part because that's part of my job and in part because I've always found it interesting. If you have any specific people who are saying this that would be of note, by all means please link them as I'd be curious to read their arguments.

[Jtbrig7390]

If you have any specific people who are saying this that would be of note, by all means please link them as I'd be curious to read their arguments.

Here is one example



This is the last ill post on this matter since XBOX is offtopic for this thread anyway.

[Tech614]

This is the last ill post on this matter since XBOX is offtopic for this thread anyway.

*last post until someone replies to me, then I must reply again to get final word

JT already got his MS PR skills ready.

In other news Crackdown 3 still looks like an early access game made by a 10 man dev team when it's a AAA game being developed by 100 dudes for 5 years.

Please post productively and don't bait others. Infracted. -Edge

[Edge-]

Here is one example



This is the last ill post on this matter since XBOX is offtopic for this thread anyway.

He's talking about different issues than you are. He's addressing the fact that despite the marketing push from Microsoft, which has mainly been centered around "TRUE 4K!" (and which is already bowing up in their faces, but at least they finally settled on a message after the horribly confusing mixed messaging early on) and that Microsoft really hasn't made a super compelling case for it, not that they haven't been making a push for the console. Maybe I misread your arguments, but your posts implied that Microsoft wasn't even making a push for the console yet, which is patently false, rather than that the push Microsoft has made for the X has been pretty piss poor (which is what he says, and I've been saying).

He's harping on the shit showing at E3, which was something that I was super critical of them for at the time as well, especially how fucking pathetic Crackdown 3's presence was. And he's right, Crackdown 3 thus far, is both a terrible game to showcase the new graphical capabilities of the X (and honestly right now it's not even showing off the Azure cloud tech well so far, at least outside of the technical presentations at GDC that consumers don't watch because they're not really created for consumers) and what they showed off at E3 even excluding the X was pretty boring on its own.

He's talking about Microsoft having shit marketing/messaging/outlook from what they're doing/showing so far, especially at E3, not that they're not marketing the X.

[Zephyr Storm]

He's talking about different issues than you are. He's addressing the fact that despite the marketing push from Microsoft, which has mainly been centered around "TRUE 4K!" (and which is already bowing up in their faces, but at least they finally settled on a message after the horribly confusing mixed messaging early on) and that Microsoft really hasn't made a super compelling case for it, not that they haven't been making a push for the console. Maybe I misread your arguments, but your posts implied that Microsoft wasn't even making a push for the console yet, which is patently false, rather than that the push Microsoft has made for the X has been pretty piss poor (which is what he says, and I've been saying).

He's harping on the shit showing at E3, which was something that I was super critical of them for at the time as well, especially how fucking pathetic Crackdown 3's presence was. And he's right, Crackdown 3 thus far, is both a terrible game to showcase the new graphical capabilities of the X (and honestly right now it's not even showing off the Azure cloud tech well so far, at least outside of the technical presentations at GDC that consumers don't watch because they're not really created for consumers) and what they showed off at E3 even excluding the X was pretty boring on its own.

He's talking about Microsoft having shit marketing/messaging/outlook from what they're doing/showing so far, especially at E3, not that they're not marketing the X.

There's no point in trying to discuss it with him, Edge.

He's the perfect example of the people I was referring to earlier. The same people who will bash or criticize MS/Xbox but turn around and praise (or at the very least turn their head the other way) when Sony/PS does the exact same thing. It's been par for the course this gen for everyone to hate on MS every chance they get while putting Sony on a pedestal. And it doesn't help that the gaming media seem to be egging this on as well. It just fans the flames even more.

Here is a video showing the kind of idiocy/hypocrisy of people bitching and moaning about Crackdown 3 being delayed and how there's zero point in owning a One X at launch (I don't agree with every single point he makes, but he gets the point across in general):



Jt simply proves this is how people think this gen. If Sony does it, either good for them or, at worst, "eh" who cares. If MS does it, it's all wrong and MS should just give up. It's a very bad trend of blind fanboyism and hypocrisy to say the least.

Not saying MS didn't do some of this to themselves, because we all know they shot themselves in the foot right out of the gate at the start of this gen. But the internet in general seems all to willing to continue to bash them and put them down, even when they do something good or at least try. It just gets annoying to see people continue with this trend, regardless of the actual outcomes.

[Edge-]

But the internet in general seems all to willing to continue to bash them and put them down, even when they do something good or at least try. It just gets annoying to see people continue with this trend, regardless of the actual outcomes.

Let's not kid ourselves, Microsoft has been phoning it in this entire generation. The X was their time to re-assert that they actually had a coherent strategy moving forward and to come out swinging hard. Instead, it's even more flaccid than the Pro is due to a mixture of questionable decisions (a pretty big raw power gap over the Pro that may cause other issues, driving the price above that of the comparable Sony console) and idiotic messaging (mixed messages about what the Scorpio was even going to do, was it for 4K or was it for graphical improvements and higher framerates too? Well, it depended on which Microsoft spokesperson you talked to! Followed by a hard push for "NATIVE 4K" that they're already spectacularly failing to deliver on with 2/3 of the major titles they showed off at E3 [Anthem and AC both sub 4K]).

Also remember, Crackdown was supposed to be their big display of the capability of Azure. Remember back when they tried to bullshit people into thinking that Azure would be used to increase resolution, increase framerates, and add more graphical goodies with the magic of "THE CLOUD"(tm)? Yeah, that lie fell flat instantly, and over 4 years later (unless we get more delays!) we're finally getting a potentially decent use of them in handling physics calculations online and even that game, which looks overwhelmingly average, is getting constantly delayed. Crackdown 3 is more important as a proof that the Azure bullshit wasn't complete 100% bullshit, just 80% bullshit. It being a launch title for the X was a secondary benefit, and would have definitely given it a much needed boost that the Pro didn't need. Remember, Microsoft has the tougher proposition to make given their increased price and weaker market position, they need every edge they can get when the X launches. Sony didn't, so while having solid launch day titles would have definitely benefit them it also didn't hurt them. The opposite is true for the X, solid launch day titles would have benefit them as well, but the lack of any is definitely a detriment. Were the roles reversed, the same would apply.

Thank fucking god they're at least letting most Xbox exclusive shit release on PC, I'd be mad if they locked Cuphead down as an Xbox exclusive.

[Zephyr Storm]

Let's not kid ourselves, Microsoft has been phoning it in this entire generation. The X was their time to re-assert that they actually had a coherent strategy moving forward and to come out swinging hard. Instead, it's even more flaccid than the Pro is due to a mixture of questionable decisions (a pretty big raw power gap over the Pro that may cause other issues, driving the price above that of the comparable Sony console) and idiotic messaging (mixed messages about what the Scorpio was even going to do, was it for 4K or was it for graphical improvements and higher framerates too? Well, it depended on which Microsoft spokesperson you talked to! Followed by a hard push for "NATIVE 4K" that they're already spectacularly failing to deliver on with 2/3 of the major titles they showed off at E3 [Anthem and AC both sub 4K]).

Also remember, Crackdown was supposed to be their big display of the capability of Azure. Remember back when they tried to bullshit people into thinking that Azure would be used to increase resolution, increase framerates, and add more graphical goodies with the magic of "THE CLOUD"(tm)? Yeah, that lie fell flat instantly, and over 4 years later (unless we get more delays!) we're finally getting a potentially decent use of them in handling physics calculations online and even that game, which looks overwhelmingly average, is getting constantly delayed. Crackdown 3 is more important as a proof that the Azure bullshit wasn't complete 100% bullshit, just 80% bullshit. It being a launch title for the X was a secondary benefit, and would have definitely given it a much needed boost that the Pro didn't need. Remember, Microsoft has the tougher proposition to make given their increased price and weaker market position, they need every edge they can get when the X launches. Sony didn't, so while having solid launch day titles would have definitely benefit them it also didn't hurt them. The opposite is true for the X, solid launch day titles would have benefit them as well, but the lack of any is definitely a detriment. Were the roles reversed, the same would apply.

Thank fucking god they're at least letting most Xbox exclusive shit release on PC, I'd be mad if they locked Cuphead down as an Xbox exclusive.

While true, it still doesn't account for the blatant hypocrisy that has become so prevalent in the video game industry at large this gen. First it was all about graphical power, which the PS4 did better. Now that the Xbox is going to have the most powerful console, suddenly graphical power doesn't matter. Now it's all about the One X not having a launch title, while the Pro didn't really have one either. But that didn't seem to matter to anyone at the time, but now it's suddenly a big fucking deal.

It's getting to the point that it's becoming highly toxic and, IMO, harming the video game industry more than it's helping. So many people seem to want to see MS bow out of the console market, which would be BAD for everyone in the long run. With no serious competition, Sony would run amok and do whatever the hell they please. And that wouldn't be good for any of us. Period.

[Edge-]

While true, it still doesn't account for the blatant hypocrisy that has become so prevalent in the video game industry at large this gen. First it was all about graphical power, which the PS4 did better. Now that the Xbox is going to have the most powerful console, suddenly graphical power doesn't matter. Now it's all about the One X not having a launch title, while the Pro didn't really have one either. But that didn't seem to matter to anyone at the time, but now it's suddenly a big fucking deal.

Eh, part of it is that people back whoever the "winner" is. Last gen it was Microsoft, this gen it's Sony. If it swaps back next gen, it'll be the same thing all over. People gonna people.

As for the power bit, you're ignoring context. PS4 had that extra power at a lower initial price point thanks to the Kinect bundling, and even afterwards continued to have it for the same cost or less. So you were legit getting a bit extra power for no extra money. Meanwhile, this is $100 more than the Pro and currently the results aren't significantly better than what we're seeing on the Pro (handful of native 4K titles, some running with checkerboarding to upscale more cleanly, others simply running sub-4K). So the direct comparisons between how folks reacted to the power difference in the PS4/Xbone and the Pro/X aren't really apt. Raw power matters, but it's only a part of the overall equation. The other parts are price, and what developers do with it.

As for the launch title bit, again, Microsoft is in the weaker position and consequently needs to make a stronger case for the X than Sony did with the Pro when it launched. That's how it's always been between the two, the "winner" can get away with shit the "loser" can't. Happened last gen, happened the gen before, happening this gen. It's how competitive products work.

It's getting to the point that it's becoming highly toxic and, IMO, harming the video game industry more than it's helping. So many people seem to want to see MS bow out of the console market, which would be BAD for everyone in the long run. With no serious competition, Sony would run amok and do whatever the hell they please. And that wouldn't be good for any of us. Period.

How so? I mean, fanboy shitfights have been going on for decades and they're not going anywhere. Blast processing on the Genesis vs. Nintendo for example. It's not really any worse now, when presented in full context, to how it was in the 90's or 00's.

Yeah, folks would like to see Microsoft bail. Others would like to see Sony bail. And others would like to see Nintendo bail. /whatthefuckeverman

[Jtbrig7390]

Yeah, folks would like to see Microsoft bail. Others would like to see Sony bail. And others would like to see Nintendo bail. /whatthefuckeverman

I personally don't want to see any of the three bail out, competition breeds innovation.

(Pray's Sony makes another handheld)

[GennGreymane]

I personally don't want to see any of the three bail out, competition breeds innovation.

(Pray's Sony makes another handheld)

No need to lie.

[Zephyr Storm]

I personally don't want to see any of the three bail out, competition breeds innovation.

(Pray's Sony makes another handheld)

Actions speak louder than words, so to speak. We all know what you really want.

[Jtbrig7390]

Actions speak louder than words, so to speak. We all know what you really want.

Clearly, Isn't like I have owned two XB1's and many 360's/Original systems. Buying those totally shows I just want Microsoft to bomb....

Here is a tip for ya; Calling a company out on there bullshit doesn't make you a fanboy to another company.

[GennGreymane]

Clearly, Isn't like I have owned two XB1's and many 360's/Original systems. Buying those totally shows I just want Microsoft to bomb....

Here is a tip for ya; Calling a company out on there bullshit doesn't make you a fanboy to another company.

You should do that more often. You tend to get very defensive when one of these companies is attacked for anti gamer moves.

[Jtbrig7390]

You should do that more often. You tend to get very defensive when one of these companies is attacked for anti gamer moves.

You talking about the Cross-Play shit with Sony even tho they have been doing it far longer then MS. Why would I call Sony out on not wanting to give control to MS?

Like I told you in the other thread, Fact's learn them and use them. Also I have called Sony out for many things and if they do more stupid shit ill call them out on it.

But like I said before talk to you is like talking to a wall, so on ignore you go.

[GennGreymane]

You talking about the Cross-Play shit with Sony even tho they have been doing it far longer then MS. Why would I call Sony out on not wanting to give control to MS?

Like I told you in the other thread, Fact's learn them and use them.

Also I have called Sony out for many things and if they do more stupid shit ill call them out on it.

Im talking about in general. I use facts, you use hearsay.

[RuneDK]

Welp, looks like Ill give this game a go on PC as well as all my other xbox exclusives...went to go play some madden 18 only to do a factory reset and the problem still not be resolved. Uninstalled and reinstalling M18 now....may have to go return it and hope they let me exchange for a PS4 version cause I'm not spending money on an xbox one again...

[Video Games]

Mircosoft is straight up doodoo. Has always been with its awful practices and games have been worse off for it. Eat it, nerds.

[Jtbrig7390]

Welp, looks like Ill give this game a go on PC as well as all my other xbox exclusives...went to go play some madden 18 only to do a factory reset and the problem still not be resolved. Uninstalled and reinstalling M18 now....may have to go return it and hope they let me exchange for a PS4 version cause I'm not spending money on an xbox one again...

If it was Gamestop I find it highly unlikely but u can try. It sucks but u could always trade it in or sell it yourself and buy the Ps4 version.

[RuneDK]

If it was Gamestop I find it highly unlikely but u can try. It sucks but u could always trade it in or sell it yourself and buy the Ps4 version.

unfortunately it was gamestop.