Trumpcare Back From Dead Again: Cassidy-Graham Cruelest Version Yet, Has 49 Votes

[Z-Man]

You forgot liberal arts major or anyone Indoctrinated By The Liberal College Education System.

"poor life choices"

[Grapemask]

I haven't read the bill, but I like most of what is on the list in the OP.

It shouldn't be passed though. Using reconcillation to do it is dishonorable. If Republicans don't get a Democratic buy-in, there is nothing to prevent them from pressing the Undo-button the next time they're in power... and inevitably they will be.

Ah Skroe, always reminding me that as much as we may agree on Trump's issues, on nearly everything else he's still a part of the dumpster fire that's shitting on the heart of America, its lower classes.

[Skroe]

Ah Skroe, always reminding me that as much as we may agree on Trump's issues, on nearly everything else he's still a part of the dumpster fire that's shitting on the heart of America, its lower classes.

The solution to the enormous Health Care problems in this country is not to pour federal taxpayer dollars on it. Exactly when is enough enough? Healthcare spending in the budget grows and grows, usually at twice the rate of the rest of the budget. When sequenstration hit four years ago, Healthcare grew when everything else suffered a cut. My favorite number ever is that over the last few years, Medicare grew at such a rate that it added three NASA's worth of spending to it's budget.

It. Must. Stop.

THat's why I laugh when people say dreamy things about NASA. You want to explore space? Sure. First, we gotta cut old sick people off the federal teat. The money's there. An ocean of it. We just spend it on the old.

That is not to say that Grandma can't get her pills. She should. But getting out the credit card to pay for it and cutting back on everything else is not a solution. Taxing more to pay for it, is not a solution. It grows and grows, and the cost curve bends what... a few percent here and there? Back slapping for a few percent change that gets erased in 2019 anyway? It's a fucking joke.

No. No more. Everyone should have access to healthcare. Period. But we have things just as important as that. Infrastructure. Education. Scientific research. Buying weapons. Healthcare should be a thing government plays a role in, but it is not and should not be the purpose of government. As a function of government spending, it might as well be.

A budget is a list of priorities, not a wish list, and Obamacare is executed via a budget. It exists on that list of priorities, along with many other things. It gets it fair share, and not one, cent more.

You want to spend more lavishly? You got a bank account. You pay for it. Me? I want my government buying more SpaceX rockets, paying for more AI research, giving more grants to college students, building more highways and buying more cruise missiles. Grandma's pills share the bag of money with things just as important.

[Beazy]

I still wonder why we can't have a single payer system.

=o[

[Kujako]

I still wonder why we can't have a single payer system.

=o[

'cause socialism! and because that wont make corporations money.

[Blade Wolf]

I still wonder why we can't have a single payer system.

=o[

Because of bought politicians and poorly educated people thinking single payer=communism.

[Beazy]

Because of bought politicians and poorly educated people thinking single payer=communism.

Doubt the "people" have anything to do with it what so ever. I would be willing to bet its 110% related to profits.

[Fugus]

Doubt the "people" have anything to do with it what so ever. I would be willing to bet its 110% related to profits.

Pretty much, a huge portion of our medicare expenses we have no are directly related to profits. Bush Jr. actually banned medicare from negotiating prices for drugs with them and forced them to take whatever their offer was which is why it is so expensive and why medicare can pay so much more for the medicine than the VA does who can actually negotiate or other nations whom we are not allowed to import from.

Really hope Sanders bill gets pushed as far as it can. Even if it doesn't pass because of Agent Orange and the Republican tire fire. At least get it into the public discussion so that it is a forced issues so when it comes to campaigns and agendas, it becomes a bigger part of it.

Still comes back to, all this because of Clinton's cheating. Still can't help but wonder what had happened if they had did a legit election and where we would be.

[Gestopft]

The solution to the enormous Health Care problems in this country is not to pour federal taxpayer dollars on it.

I agree, but pouring less money on it won't do a damn thing to make our healthcare failures better.

This is really indicative of why the GoP completely and utterly fails at healthcare: they're trying to address a budget problem instead of a healthcare problem- or to put it in medical terms, they're treating symptoms instead of the underlying causes.

Their other failure is being overly focused on the cost of premiums. Yes, we can get premiums down some, but there's only so far it can go when your insurance is paying for drugs and procedures that cost a fraction as much in other countries. Any solution that doesn't start from the premise of controlling costs is going to be a failed solution.

[PosPosPos]

The solution to the enormous Health Care problems in this country is not to pour federal taxpayer dollars on it. Exactly when is enough enough? Healthcare spending in the budget grows and grows, usually at twice the rate of the rest of the budget. When sequenstration hit four years ago, Healthcare grew when everything else suffered a cut. My favorite number ever is that over the last few years, Medicare grew at such a rate that it added three NASA's worth of spending to it's budget.

It. Must. Stop.

THat's why I laugh when people say dreamy things about NASA. You want to explore space? Sure. First, we gotta cut old sick people off the federal teat. The money's there. An ocean of it. We just spend it on the old.

That is not to say that Grandma can't get her pills. She should. But getting out the credit card to pay for it and cutting back on everything else is not a solution. Taxing more to pay for it, is not a solution. It grows and grows, and the cost curve bends what... a few percent here and there? Back slapping for a few percent change that gets erased in 2019 anyway? It's a fucking joke.

No. No more. Everyone should have access to healthcare. Period. But we have things just as important as that. Infrastructure. Education. Scientific research. Buying weapons. Healthcare should be a thing government plays a role in, but it is not and should not be the purpose of government. As a function of government spending, it might as well be.

A budget is a list of priorities, not a wish list, and Obamacare is executed via a budget. It exists on that list of priorities, along with many other things. It gets it fair share, and not one, cent more.

You want to spend more lavishly? You got a bank account. You pay for it. Me? I want my government buying more SpaceX rockets, paying for more AI research, giving more grants to college students, building more highways and buying more cruise missiles. Grandma's pills share the bag of money with things just as important.

Apparently, a far-off dream in the form of space exploration is more important than existing human lives.

Maybe my country should take a leaf out of your book and leave the poor to die off and put the savings to some good Martian rare rocks investment.

Then we can all look back and say "hey at least our space museum is red-pretty!"

[unfilteredJW]

Apparently, a far-off dream in the form of space exploration is more important than existing human lives.

Maybe my country should take a leaf out of your book and leave the poor to die off and put the savings to some good Martian rare rocks investment.

Then we can all look back and say "hey at least our space museum is red-pretty!"

That's not at all what he said.

Fucking read.

[Zan15]

The solution to the enormous Health Care problems in this country is not to pour federal taxpayer dollars on it. Exactly when is enough enough? Healthcare spending in the budget grows and grows, usually at twice the rate of the rest of the budget. When sequenstration hit four years ago, Healthcare grew when everything else suffered a cut. My favorite number ever is that over the last few years, Medicare grew at such a rate that it added three NASA's worth of spending to it's budget.

It. Must. Stop.

THat's why I laugh when people say dreamy things about NASA. You want to explore space? Sure. First, we gotta cut old sick people off the federal teat. The money's there. An ocean of it. We just spend it on the old.

That is not to say that Grandma can't get her pills. She should. But getting out the credit card to pay for it and cutting back on everything else is not a solution. Taxing more to pay for it, is not a solution. It grows and grows, and the cost curve bends what... a few percent here and there? Back slapping for a few percent change that gets erased in 2019 anyway? It's a fucking joke.

No. No more. Everyone should have access to healthcare. Period. But we have things just as important as that. Infrastructure. Education. Scientific research. Buying weapons. Healthcare should be a thing government plays a role in, but it is not and should not be the purpose of government. As a function of government spending, it might as well be.

A budget is a list of priorities, not a wish list, and Obamacare is executed via a budget. It exists on that list of priorities, along with many other things. It gets it fair share, and not one, cent more.

You want to spend more lavishly? You got a bank account. You pay for it. Me? I want my government buying more SpaceX rockets, paying for more AI research, giving more grants to college students, building more highways and buying more cruise missiles. Grandma's pills share the bag of money with things just as important.

So wait, they pay into the system for 30-40-50 years and you want to cut them off?
could it be that Medicare is growing because the rate at which people are retiring has increased 2 fold because of the blight of the baby boomers?

they are not on the federal teat, they are on their own teat paid for year after year in medicare taxes.

once you get over this anomaly of baby boomers Medicare is actually one of the few systems that is on firm footing.

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I still wonder why we can't have a single payer system.

=o[

cause socialism is bad, even though half of our govt programs are actually full blown socialist programs.

that and you have to be over 65 to get single payer system :P

[Glorious Leader]

Apparently, a far-off dream in the form of space exploration is more important than existing human lives.

Maybe my country should take a leaf out of your book and leave the poor to die off and put the savings to some good Martian rare rocks investment.

Then we can all look back and say "hey at least our space museum is red-pretty!"

The two arent mutually exclusive.

Having said that I imagine skroes prorities for the government differ wildly from mine. That's mostly why his post there is empty rhetoric. He can't say straight up kill grandma for space so he has to say well we can sorta have both (which is true) but he's not willing to suggest what we have to cut. Sure as shit aint the military..

[satimy]

Cant the dems just filibuster if it doesnt have 60 votes?

[DarkTZeratul]

Cant the dems just filibuster if it doesnt have 60 votes?

Not if they're trying to sneak it in as a budget reconciliation bill, which only requires 51.

[Breccia]

Not if they're trying to sneak it in as a budget reconciliation bill, which only requires 51.

The deadline for which is the 30th. Which is a Saturday, and also a holiday.

Also they need a CBO score, and they already know the won't get a full score -- there isn't enough time, and that's on the GOP for waiting until the deadline.

The usual crew -- AARP, hospitals, doctors, medical associations -- are once again nearly 100% against this bill. So is the majority of the American people. So are the ultra conservatives and Rand Paul. This will not be an easy task.

[Caolela]

The two arent mutually exclusive.

Having said that I imagine skroes prorities for the government differ wildly from mine. That's mostly why his post there is empty rhetoric. He can't say straight up kill grandma for space so he has to say well we can sorta have both (which is true) but he's not willing to suggest what we have to cut. Sure as shit aint the military..

It's the same old horseshit from our resident gutless and venal pseudo-intellectual. Anyone who is dense enough to buy Skroe's Tower of Babel is the definition of P.T. Barnum's, "there's a sucker born every minute."

[Taso]

Honestly this should be a States issue. After all we are federal republic. All 50 states have a constitution that they can adjust in order to guarantee healthcare if that's what the people want. If they don't want that's fine but don't force everyone else to have it.

[Felya]

I still wonder why we can't have a single payer system.

=o[

The only reasonable think I can think of... and I'm saying reasonable, not popular... is that it would tank the insurance industry. It would be a segnificant hit to US economy and is likely to trigger a recession. If you consider that insurance industry isn't really a bubble, it's just massive. As soon as there is single payer or Medicare for all, that turns into a bubble that immediately bursts.

Don't shoot the messenger...

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Cant the dems just filibuster if it doesnt have 60 votes?

No, budget reconciliation. They cannot filibuster it.

- - - Updated - - -

You cannot make insurance purchase compulsory, because the pyramid scheme fails. You run out of people to prop up the bottom of the pyramid. At the very least employment will need to be still tied to insurance in some way. Otherwise, all of the insured through employment are in effect getting a pay cut and insurance loses a stable revenue stream.

Insurance is an albatross. No politician in their right mind will tell you this, but tying insurance to employment for healthcare was a huge mistake. You have created a behemoth, who's fall will have segnificant ripple effect.

[DarkTZeratul]

Insurance is an albatross. No politician in their right mind will tell you this, but tying insurance to employment for healthcare was a huge mistake. You have created a behemoth, who's fall will have segnificant ripple effect.

The problem is that you can't just remove it without fucking over a lot of people. Not unless you also provide a replacement, which the Republicans have never done and seemingly aren't interested in doing.