Dullest character in WoW history...

[Phuongvi]

Jesus Thrall is dull

[Doffen]

Chrono-lord Epoch. Dat voice...eh..acting. Horrible.

And Arthas, just to be edgy. All that whine he managed to put out in the Human Campaign is impressive. He's more edgy than me trying to make him as a dull character.

[Eurhetemec]

No. You do it because you have valid concerns. Her actions are rational in your eyes, but you're forgetting she's killing and doing whatever she can to live, even if unreasonable.

It's not like we gave Hitler a pass.

What the fuck are you talking about?

I don't think her actions are rational. What is this strawman bullshit you're pushing?

please google what a warcrime is..before using the concept....it doesnt apply to wow

It does. The concept long-predates actual laws about it, and people were executed, excommunicated, and so on for crimes which we would consider warcrimes now. I mean, obviously a lot of the time they got away with it - the main thing is to win - but it's not some novel concept that could never apply to WoW.

[Polybius]

And that's your opinion, not a fact...

Answer: "-What good is getting a home if the leader compromises your security?" What are you talking about? You do realize they serve her willingly right? And even those that don't were still hounded as monsters by the Alliance and hunted down. Involvement or no involvement. The Forsaken are constantly defending themselves and so they have to go on the offensive.

Answer: "-We haven't heard from Quelthalas. But I recall the High Elves ultimately leaving their brethren. She's a different person now." What are you talking about again? Sylvanas may be a High Elf but died during the Scourge Invasion. She was the one who convinced the Horde to bring the Blood Elves into the Horde BECAUSE she cared for them. And even supplies them with protection. Again, granted she used that as a bargain for Lore'themar to get into War against the Lich King. But I see that as more a positive than a negative. Take that one as you will. Sylvanas never abandoned the Blood Elves, not yet anyways.

Answer: "-The plague was made by Putress under the Apothecary. She reused it for war against the Gilneans." Which Sylvanas was pushing for to be used against the Scourge and possibly the Alliance. Remember we weren't buddy buddy until MoP/Legion which even Varian was supportive and even sided with Sylvanas and welcomed her aid against the Legion.

Her motives have changed but she is still the same in my eyes. Cold, Calcuative, and bad ass.

You Alliance folks or even some muddled Horde folks are welcome to not like her. But we just lost Vol'jin and Garrosh. Calm down on the whole, "WE NEED HER HEAD". Give her a chance to grow some more and some time for us to bloody recover for peet sakes. Its a damn pattern at this point, "We hate this Leader and how this Leader works. Please kill them Blizzard after you've made them Warchief!" Blizzard : "Oh um. Okay I guess?"

Just stop asking for our Leaders deaths already. We've lost enough.

Yeah right. If they all followed Sylvanas the Apothecary wouldn't have betrayed her.

Blood Elves separated from High Elves. They're not under the same banner.

She's not a badass. She's just a coward just like any mortal. You think she cares about her people more than herself?

No one is saying they want her head. But for her to sit in a court and judge Garrosh with the August Celestials is just laughable considering her actions.

[Skoll Shorties]

i have been a horde memeber for 7 years so ;3

1. yes your not wrong, but then she kills more of those people, and forces them into undeath, instead of MAKING HOMES FOR THOSE UNDEAD she is MAKING MORE UNDEAD.
You cant make homes for homeless people, then claim your good, but then burn peoples houses down and ask for praise for giving shelter to those people you made homeless...
2. i mean yeah? but they were allies, so that is not really a "hey i did my job praise me"
3. lol you are claiming INVENTING THE PLAGUE USED ON THE WRATHGATE, AND TO DESTROY GILNEAS WAS A GOOD THING!?
4. ok... yeah? everyone helped.
5. ok again everyone did.
6. yes she did do that for the horde, good for her, but she also left the alliance to die.

shes dull because she commits war crimes and betrays her own people far more often then should be allowed, yet no one cares.
when is the horde gunna even talk to her about what the fuck she did in stormheim? shes like "hey i know im your warcheif, but ummm... Im gunan go do my own thing that will make me an enemy to everyone, i hope yall are fine with this"

No where did i say "all horde leaders are bad"
Voljin was a great man, so is baine and cairne, thrall was the best warcheif, sadly hes become a wuss, garrosh when he started was quite... interesting, he was brutal, but he had honor, he knew combat, and knew sylvanas was a threat to everyone. but then he just... flipped because blizzard, and gave up on honor when one expansion earlier he threw a guy to his death after that person forsake honor.

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yeah you are pretty right, if all of a sudden russia dropped a nuke on newyork im pretty sure they would call it a war crime because of the mass needless civilian casualties, but lets not get too political

You certainly act like an Alliance Dog. 7+ years aren't showing too well if you're asking for more of our Leaders deaths or a character to become a villain. I agree the Sylvanas community can become toxic. But I am apart of the Horde Community and I am sick of people like you asking for our leaders to turn evil or to die. Its for this reason alone that Vol'jin was probably killed off. I just want Blizzard to give the Horde a break and stop making our Leaders out to be baddies. We need time to heal.

You're allowed to dislike her, but please for the love of Cherry Donuts let our Leaders or Warchief survive for a good four expansions or so before you demand they die. And I get Sylvanas has been possibly in the eyes of hatred by the Alliance for a while but still... She's slowly growing out of that "I care only for my people and myself" her actions on the Broken Shore and in Legion are a testament to her slow growth. Its people like Genn that push her back into the evil light that everyone presumes she is.

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Yeah right. If they all followed Sylvanas the Apothecary wouldn't have betrayed her.

Blood Elves separated from High Elves. They're not under the same banner.

She's not a badass. She's just a coward just like any mortal. You think she cares about her people more than herself?

No one is saying they want her head. But for her to sit in a court and judge Garrosh with the August Celestials is just laughable considering her actions.

What are you getting at with the whole High Elves and Blood Elves thing, how is that relevant?

She's not bad ass in your eyes. Again that's... your muddled opinion? You can say she's not bad ass in your perspective but in my own and others she is. And I think she cares about herself more than her people - I never said she was a saint or a goddess like some may believe. But I do think she cares about her people and the Forsaken just fine, just in her values she cares for herself and her life more and doesn't wanna go to hell. If you had a way out of hell after being there I think you would do the same, or at least I would.

[FelPlague]

yes,I read warcrimes book,very good one,,,do u know what a war crime is?,see.....in wow theres no international/interfaction court. (in the book there is,the celestials)
or anything like the gineva conventions,there for sylvanas hasnt commited a warcrime......
btw..you keep saying evil character..what evil has she done to the horde?
again what she does to the alliance doesnt matter,its supposed to be a war

To the horde? She ditched them in stormheim to go make a deal with an old god minion and enslave an ally of both factions.
she disobeyed the warcheifs orders to stop using the plague, and stop raising undead.

also yes, again, there is warcrimes, lots of them, mass killing civilians is one of the known ones, aswell as using banned warfair, for example the theramore bombing, and capturing civilian refugees.
and yes there is internfational courts, as varian said.
also they have spoken before about the laws of war, for example, capturing mass amounts of civilians is a war crime. You attack a base and see farmers and women and children fleeing? you dont shoot them down, you let them go, they are simple, they are not soldiers.
Yes the factions have laws in war, and the celestials hold the court there because they wanted to have it in pandaria, and it allowed them to have a place for both factions ,instead of just the horde, or just the alliance deal with it.
Sylvanas used the plague when she was told not to.
She has been raising undead when she was told not to.
A war does not mean needless bloodshed.

[Polybius]

What the fuck are you talking about?

I don't think her actions are rational. What is this strawman bullshit you're pushing?
.

Strawman? The reasons given for her being dull are legitimate concerns. Not sure why you're trying to conflate dull with dislike. You can dislike a dull character, nothing new.

[Flurryfang]

she is dull. shes a big chunk of dull metal. she may do stuff. but its boring because you know its pointless.

Its not really pointless, because her character can go either way. She can be a villian or a hero, both sides have a chance to win out. That is proberly the opposite of pointless.

Many other characters are quite dull and predictable while Sylvanas is not.

[Polybius]

You certainly act like an Alliance Dog. 7+ years aren't showing too well if you're asking for more of our Leaders deaths or a character to become a villain. I agree the Sylvanas community can become toxic. But I am apart of the Horde Community and I am sick of people like you asking for our leaders to turn evil or to die. Its for this reason alone that Vol'jin was probably killed off. I just want Blizzard to give the Horde a break and stop making our Leaders out to be baddies. We need time to heal.

You're allowed to dislike her, but please for the love of Cherry Donuts let our Leaders or Warchief survive for a good four expansions or so before you demand they die. And I get Sylvanas has been possibly in the eyes of hatred by the Alliance for a while but still... She's slowly growing out of that "I care only for my people and myself" her actions on the Broken Shore and in Legion are a testament to her slow growth. Its people like Genn that push her back into the evil light that everyone presumes she is.

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What are you getting at with the whole High Elves and Blood Elves thing, how is that relevant?

She's not bad ass in your eyes. Again that's... your muddled opinion? You can say she's not bad ass in your perspective but in my own and others she is. And I think she cares about herself more than her people - I never said she was a saint or a goddess like some may believe. But I do think she cares about her people and the Forsaken just fine, just in her values she cares for herself and her life more and doesn't wanna go to hell. If you had a way out of hell after being there I think you would do the same, or at least I would.

It's pretty relevant. Considering I was referring to the OP and not you. The Sylvanas from before and Sylvanas today are very different people -- pre-death is when High Elves played a role. She's changed since Wrath.

[Friendlyimmolation]

sylvanas
because without her massive fanbase she would become a bad guy
ditching the horde to go betray the races that are supposed to help us beat the legion
make a deal with a minion of the old gods
commited war crimes by using the plague on gilneas
disobeyed orders to stop raising undeaed, and stop using the plague.
knows she is bassicly lichking2.0 and is fine with it

I don't know how many times this needs to be repeated before people understand their mistakes.

Helya was not an Old God minion,

Odyn thinks the Forsaken are valorous as long as blood is spilled.

A neutered plague that didn't even kill worgen according to their own apothecaries.

She was never ordered to stop raising undead by Garrosh, and she sarcastically answered with "lol I am the lich king," down to the mocking salute.


On topic, Arator, and his cliched shit parents are beyond nails on chalkboard boring, followed closely by so many WoW characters you can't name them all. Vereesa is in her own way, boringly insane, Orcs for the most part are boring lok'tar, humans are just plain boring with only Jaina and Genn being fairly interesting etc.

[Eurhetemec]

Strawman? The reasons given for her being dull are legitimate concerns. Not sure why you're trying to conflate dull with dislike. You can dislike a dull character, nothing new.

I've seen literally no rational reasoning for why she's dull. Just various people repeating reasons to DISLIKE or hate Sylvanas, then claiming they make her dull. Which is very much like saying Hitler was "dull" or something.

[FelPlague]

You certainly act like an Alliance Dog. 7+ years aren't showing too well if you're asking for more of our Leaders deaths or a character to become a villain. I agree the Sylvanas community can become toxic. But I am apart of the Horde Community and I am sick of people like you asking for our leaders to turn evil or to die. Its for this reason alone that Vol'jin was probably killed off. I just want Blizzard to give the Horde a break and stop making our Leaders out to be baddies. We need time to heal.

You're allowed to dislike her, but please for the love of Cherry Donuts let our Leaders or Warchief survive for a good four expansions or so before you demand they die. And I get Sylvanas has been possibly in the eyes of hatred by the Alliance for a while but still... She's slowly growing out of that "I care only for my people and myself" her actions on the Broken Shore and in Legion are a testament to her slow growth. Its people like Genn that push her back into the evil light that everyone presumes she is.

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What are you getting at with the whole High Elves and Blood Elves thing, how is that relevant?

She's not bad ass in your eyes. Again that's... your muddled opinion? You can say she's not bad ass in your perspective but in my own and others she is. And I think she cares about herself more than her people - I never said she was a saint or a goddess like some may believe. But I do think she cares about her people and the Forsaken just fine, just in her values she cares for herself and her life more and doesn't wanna go to hell. If you had a way out of hell after being there I think you would do the same, or at least I would.

you really did not even read what i said did you?
i am sad thrall left the throne, i am sad voljin and cairne died.
But Garrosh and Sylvanas have both showed their true intentions, and both should not be/have been war cheifs.
again NO WHERE HAVE I FUCKING ASKED Sylvanas to become evil, or the horde leaders to die.
But she has allready become evil, and she deserves to die.

you really are not reading, and really show your a green skin through and through :P
all you want is your hawt Bae warcheif and to blame everyone else saying they are all horde haters who want the horde to be destroyed, and garrosh/sylvanas did nothing wrong.
also really? you are saying "she's slowly growing out of that i care for only my people and myself"
but then you say genn is the one who pushes her back!?
did you even fucking do stormheim!? you know where she ditches the horde to make a deal with an old god minion so she could become immortal?
oh yeah totally looking out for the horde and not herself...

I feel like your more of just a Syvalans fan boy and not even a real horde fan.

Horde and alliance fan for life.

[Skoll Shorties]

It's pretty relevant. Considering I was referring to the OP and not you. The Sylvanas from before and Sylvanas today are very different people -- pre-death is when High Elves played a role. She's changed since Wrath.

Well yeah? Of course she's different. I was never saying She's the same she was when she was in life. Come to think of it, there are very few who are the same who died and then were raised.

[Flurryfang]

as i said before twice before now.

no i find her dull because she does all this evil shit, but somehow still gets warcheif and is going to remain a good guy.

having an evil charecter that people just ignore and dont even acknowledge what she does, is boring
garrosh was the only one who did, GARROSH!

if it wasent for
im sure she would have been made a villian, but there is waaay too many people who see her as their waifu

Okay, point out a single thing she has done that is direct evil and not only from the point of view of the alliance?

So far all she has done, that comes even close to "evil" is either through force or in the name of her races survival, which in their eyes makes her a greater good.

I think that you are just having some anime-hate influate your perception of her character. Blizzard could easily have made her into Tyrande, boring, very inactive and next to no character except "Malfurion, my love!!" and she has the same boobs as Sylvanas...But they did not. Sylvanas is one of the few characters in the game, which can go both ways and even to certain lvls. She can be good, super good, evil and uber evil, yet all are valid and none unthinkable.

If she was made a villian in the next patch, her story arc would make no sense. There is nothin in the current version of the game, that indicates that she is even a tiny amount of evil...Maybe selfish and uncaring for the rest of the races of Azeroth, but not evil.

[Polybius]

I've seen literally no rational reasoning for why she's dull. Just various people repeating reasons to DISLIKE or hate Sylvanas, then claiming they make her dull. Which is very much like saying Hitler was "dull" or something.

Mimicking another character (Garrosh) and the events that follow is pretty dull.

[FelPlague]

I don't know how many times this needs to be repeated before people understand their mistakes.

Helya was not an Old God minion,

Odyn thinks the Forsaken are valorous as long as blood is spilled.

A neutered plague that didn't even kill worgen according to their own apothecaries.

She was never ordered to stop raising undead by Garrosh, and she sarcastically answered with "lol I am the lich king," down to the mocking salute.

Helya is a minion of the old gods (technically)
he allowed them to yes, but he did not know of what happened with them trying to enslave eyir
and she wished to use a much stronger one.
really? She is being checked on by the warcheif, he calls her a monster and she makes a joke "lawl im nothing differant then the lich king"
and your like "eh whatever she was jooking"

[Destinas]

I can see why the OP wrote Odyn, but I disagree - he's just confusing. For me, Cenarius is the dullest character.

Despite the fact that he's the son of Elune, and he's said to be extremely powerful and knowledgeable, we don't see much of that as players. He survived the Burning Legion's first full assault on Azeroth, then died 10,000 years later to a few fel-corrupted orcs. He needed the help of Malfurion, Hamuul, and adventurers to bring down Ragnaros. He was inexplicably corrupted by Xavius right away in Val'sharah - even though Malfurion has been held captive and nearly corrupted twice by Xavius without ever succumbing to said corruption. Cenarius should be able to do so much more than we've seen, and they just continue to show him as a supporting character to other druids in WoW.

On top of that, we haven't learned anything about him because of him. It's said in books, magazines, and other sources that he's the son of Elune. We have no idea how he had children (including the magnataur, somehow). He's one of the few characters (aside from Malorne and perhaps Ysera) that could definitively tell us about Elune, the Blue Child, Azeroth's world-soul, and plenty of other mysteries. I find it completely boring to see him and expect to learn nothing while he's there.

[FelPlague]

Okay, point out a single thing she has done that is direct evil and not only from the point of view of the alliance?

So far all she has done, that comes even close to "evil" is either through force or in the name of her races survival, which in their eyes makes her a greater good.

I think that you are just having some anime-hate influate your perception of her character. Blizzard could easily have made her into Tyrande, boring, very inactive and next to no character except "Malfurion, my love!!" and she has the same boobs as Sylvanas...But they did not. Sylvanas is one of the few characters in the game, which can go both ways and even to certain lvls. She can be good, super good, evil and uber evil, yet all are valid and none unthinkable.

If she was made a villian in the next patch, her story arc would make no sense. There is nothin in the current version of the game, that indicates that she is even a tiny amount of evil...Maybe selfish and uncaring for the rest of the races of Azeroth, but not evil.

1. raising undead, horde and alliance.
2. using the plague when the horde ordered her not to.
3. where she made a deal with helya, to enslave a neutral race that was assisting us in the war against the legion?

[Polybius]

Okay, point out a single thing she has done that is direct evil and not only from the point of view of the alliance?

So far all she has done, that comes even close to "evil" is either through force or in the name of her races survival, which in their eyes makes her a greater good.

I think that you are just having some anime-hate influate your perception of her character. Blizzard could easily have made her into Tyrande, boring, very inactive and next to no character except "Malfurion, my love!!" and she has the same boobs as Sylvanas...But they did not. Sylvanas is one of the few characters in the game, which can go both ways and even to certain lvls. She can be good, super good, evil and uber evil, yet all are valid and none unthinkable.

If she was made a villian in the next patch, her story arc would make no sense. There is nothin in the current version of the game, that indicates that she is even a tiny amount of evil...Maybe selfish and uncaring for the rest of the races of Azeroth, but not evil.

Enslaving Eyir and forcing undeath on others.

It's also why she was given the dull tag. It's a repeat of the Lich King and Garrosh.

[danielewhite]

[QUOTE=FelPlague;47624811]To the horde? She ditched them in stormheim to go make a deal with an old god minion and enslave an ally of both factions.
she disobeyed the warcheifs orders to stop using the plague, and stop raising undead.

also yes, again, there is warcrimes, lots of them, mass killing civilians is one of the known ones, aswell as using banned warfair, for example the theramore bombing, and capturing civilian refugees.
and yes there is internfational courts, as varian said.
also they have spoken before about the laws of war, for example, capturing mass amounts of civilians is a war crime. You attack a base and see farmers and women and children fleeing? you dont shoot them down, you let them go, they are simple, they are not soldiers.
Yes the factions have laws in war, and the celestials hold the court there because they wanted to have it in pandaria, and it allowed them to have a place for both factions ,instead of just the horde, or just the alliance deal with it.
Sylvanas used the plague when she was told not to.
She has been raising undead when she was told not to.
A war does not mean needless bloodshed.

theres none,again,in warcraft there isnt a faction that as a interfaction cort. so the concept doesnt apply
(in the book they had the celestials as a neutral faction between the horde and the alliance)
but thats it,
in stormheim,she didnt ditch the horde....as a leader all her militia stood in battle,she took her personal affairs as her own,and went alone,
a crime that graymane is also guilty of,as he also "ditches" the alliance for his personal affairs.

again,when she desobeyed the the warchief.she wasnt alone...(remember there was a coup d'etat?)
they all besobeyed garrosh.......in one way or another.
if u read sylvanas novel you will she how much she cares about her forsaken