Mass shooting at church in Texas, shooter dead, multiple victims

[Ghostpanther]

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/texas-c...icted-gunshot/

Yeah. At this time they believe that is how it happened. Does not change the fact he dropped his rifle and fled when confronted by the citizen who was exchanging fire with him. And they had a high speed chase. It is speculation I know to suggest he would have harmed others if the one citizen had not intervened. But it is possible.

Thanks for the link.

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His Facebook was loaded with atheist comments unfortunately.

Plus saying you are Christian and even teaching bible school does not prove you are a Christian. "You will know them by their fruits" is a well known and true bible verse.

[NYC17]

His Facebook was loaded with atheist comments unfortunately.

Show us...

[Astalnar]

Don't know if someone already posted this, but what these two Texans did to apprehend the nutcase deserves recognition. World needs more people like them. They are the real heroes. Reminds me of that foiled terrorist attack on the train in France:

Devin Patrick Kelley, 26, was leaving First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs after he opened fire on parishioners during mass when Stephen Willeford, 55, confronted him. Texas Department of Public Safety Regional Director Freeman Martin said Willeford, a keen biker, had 'grabbed his rifle and engaged the suspect.'

A local resident told DailyMail.com that Willeford, who attends a different church, was first alerted to the shooting when his daughter called him saying there was a man in body armor gunning down church goers. He grabbed his gun and bravely headed down to confront the killer.

The local said that while Willeford has no military experience, he is an excellent shot, and when he came face to face with Kelley, he didn't hesitate; he shot in between Kelley's body armor, hitting him in his side. The 26-year-old had dropped his Ruger assault rifle and climbed in an SUV to flee the scene.

He said that Kelley had taken a hostage in the passenger seat as he fled. But another local resident, Johnnie Langendorff, who had witnessed the confrontation refused to let the shooter get away. Both he and Willeford, a local plumber, jumped in his truck and gave chase.

In a Facebook post, Langendorff's girlfriend Summer Caddel described how the pair had 'jumped in my boyfriend's truck and they chased that sick b*****d down in pursuit until the cops could catch up. He was able to run the shooter off of the road on 539!'

Langendorff told KSAT 12 that he'd been speeding at 95mph, while on the phone to dispatch, while Willeford kept his rifle trained on the gunman's car. As they approached a sharp curve in the road, near the 307 and 539, he said Kelley appeared to lose control and his car swerved off the road. 'That's when I put the truck in park,' he said. 'The other gentleman jumped out, and had his rifle on him. He didn't move after that.'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...d-atheism.html

[Puupi]

Yeah. At this time they believe that is how it happened. Does not change the fact he dropped his rifle and fled when confronted by the citizen who was exchanging fire with him. And they had a high speed chase. It is speculation I know to suggest he would have harmed others if the one citizen had not intervened. But it is possible.

Source for this?
Also, even if true, he might have dropped it due to.....like... running out of bullets or the weapon malfunctioning.

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Plus saying you are Christian and even teaching bible school does not prove you are a Christian. "You will know them by their fruits" is a well known and true bible verse.

"No true Scotsman"

[GorkAndMork]

You called it a baby, it's not a baby until it is born. It is technically a fetus. You are trying to bring emotion into an argument by using the incorrect word. I already said that if you want to ban abortions when the fetus is viable, that makes more sense. Of course, the real solution is to simply have an abortion be nothing more than causing the woman to go into labor, and deliver the baby early. It's not harming the child, it's simply going through the standard labor process, albeit earlier in the pregnancy.

I have no desire to kill terminally-ill people. That doesn't mean I'm going to go out of my way to keep them alive (by paying for it).

My stance is consistent. people should be free to do whatever they want, so long as it does not harm others. Being consistent is awesome, it's a shame you don't think so.

In human development, a fetus or foetus (/ˈfiːtəs/; plural fetuses or foetuses) is a prenatal human between the embryonic state and birth.

> I have no desire to kill terminally-ill people.
Sure, but you are for it to be legal right?

> My stance is consistent.
No it's not. But hey keep living in this bubble, so you can be inconsistent and still feel awesome.

You're still in denial of the fact that interaction between 2 or more people are unavoidably requires both restriction of their freedom and accepting the fact that others can harm you in broad sense of the term. If you claim to be consistent you should go and live on Mars alone since your existence on Earth harms others and requires you to drop some freedoms.

Oh and what about private property, you're surely against it as it restricts freedom of others. Good to know.

[Deleted]

3) My own opinion, there is something to be said about the way people carry out their personal grudges that I think points to a problem of mass media glorification. It's not really a fault of the media that people are nuts and do these things, but it's giving these people ideas. It's giving them away to be glorified and galvanized, even if negatively. If this was a man who decided his in-laws should die, why take out 7% of a town with them?

Maybe it was a small town conflict. Like the texas version of a gangstas driveby.

[Ghostpanther]

Don't know if someone already posted this, but what these two Texans did to apprehend the nutcase deserves recognition. World needs more people like them. They are the real heroes. Reminds me of that foiled terrorist attack on the train in France:

Yep. Took courage to confront someone like that. He may have saved even more lives. This actually happens more than some know. It is however, not reported by major media if there are no death's or injuries.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

His Facebook was loaded with atheist comments unfortunately.

Who cares. Where I usually go with these things is he is a human. Humans do things like this sadly. Christian have burned cities to the ground and gunned down people as well. Pretty sure the muslim story is well known. I am sure every "faith" or "lack of faith" has blood on its hands. I don't understand why people always look for something to blame besides the fact this is human nature. Most of us supress this nature. Or don't let this nature explode into a mass killing and instead shit post on the internet or something instead.. but.. it is still human to lash at things they don't like or don't agree with or even flat hate. This thread is full of examples of it. The tools have just gotten better to kill with. A 100 years ago bombs, posion gas, machine guns, and massive trucks didn't exsist for you to get pretty easily and then take out whatever and whoever you wanted with it. They are now. Maybe not guns where you are? Well then some chumps are getting hit with a knife, run over by a truck, or a bomb going off in the subway. Net result is the same. Some suckers dead on the front page. Fingers pointing anywhere by at themselves. Cry. Give preys. Next big story and forget, next big killing underway.

Just deal with it. It isn't changing because people care more about political statements and jargon than finding solutions. I even imagine if the other side came up with an idea that worked for everyone the other side (either side) would refuse to support it because "them".

[zenkai]

What does it say about you, using an utter tragedy to push a pro firearms agenda?

How am I pushing pro firearms? I believe in the right for lawful citizens to own guns but that is far as it goes, I don't even own one myself.

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Quite the false narrative you're writing. Upon shooting, even liberals thought he was a liberal because of the target demographic.

I am sure some did, but a lot didn't, they saw rich white guy and assumed he was a Republican. I had on several occasions replied to people asking why they thought a Republican shot at country music fans who are usually conservative.

[Ghostpanther]

Source for this?
Also, even if true, he might have dropped it due to.....like... running out of bullets or the weapon malfunctioning.

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"No true Scotsman"

Read the post by Astalnar above yours. There are other news reports of this event also.

I guess they need to check his rifle he dropped. :P Plus he had several other weapons in his SUV. Why did he not get those when he fled in it and shot back at the citizen? Or maybe he did some, but the fact is, he fled.

Not sure what you mean by "No true Scotsman. "

[Puupi]

Not sure what you mean by "No true Scotsman. "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

[Ghostpanther]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

That sounds like a excuse some would use when others say someone is not part of a group. Does not change the fact just because you say you believe something, means you are faithful to that belief. Kind of like it is wrong to think bad of all Muslims because the actions of some radical ones.

[GorkAndMork]

That sounds like a excuse some would use when others say someone is not part of a group. Does not change the fact just because you say you believe something, means you are faithful to that belief. Kind of like it is wrong to think bad of all Muslims because the actions of some radical ones.

Yeah it becomes meta pretty quick.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy

[epLe]

His Facebook was loaded with atheist comments unfortunately.

Like his work as a bible teacher dont way any more heavy than comments on facebook.

Religious people can in some rare cases have the intellect to question something.

[Rexosaurus]

Uh guys, lets please not use Daily Mail as a legitimate source. That's a well known tabloid.

The amount of info they have on it makes me think that they're embellishing, considering that there's a few things in that story that haven't even been mentioned by any of the major media outlets. Not saying it ISN'T true, but I'll be highly suspicious until more places report.

Don't get me wrong, good on both those guys for stepping in, but lets properly vet our sources.

[Ghostpanther]

Like his work as a bible teacher dont way any more heavy than comments on facebook.

Religious people can in some rare cases have the intellect to question something.

It is not rare at all. One major reason there are so many different denominations within Christianity.

[sarahtasher]

Yep. Took courage to confront someone like that. He may have saved even more lives. This actually happens more than some know. It is however, not reported by major media if there are no death's or injuries.

Most people think that ''good guys'' stopping a killing after 25 deaths in a tiny church is not a proof of ''GOOD GUYS WITH GUNZ working. Especially that, y'know, that maniac probably walked in the church persuaded in his brain-addled head that he was a good guy-he had a very virile and very manly gun in his hands after all.

[Al Gorefiend]

Clearly we aren't profiling vastly enough.

all recent terror attacks, rather all terror attacks in history, have been perpetuated by none other than.. the MALE.

We need to crack down on males in America, close off our borders from males entering the country, close off female vaginas from producing male babies. We aren't protecting ourselves well enough letting such violent people into our country /s

[Machismo]

In human development, a fetus or foetus (/ˈfiːtəs/; plural fetuses or foetuses) is a prenatal human between the embryonic state and birth.

> I have no desire to kill terminally-ill people.
Sure, but you are for it to be legal right?

> My stance is consistent.
No it's not. But hey keep living in this bubble, so you can be inconsistent and still feel awesome.

You're still in denial of the fact that interaction between 2 or more people are unavoidably requires both restriction of their freedom and accepting the fact that others can harm you in broad sense of the term. If you claim to be consistent you should go and live on Mars alone since your existence on Earth harms others and requires you to drop some freedoms.

Oh and what about private property, you're surely against it as it restricts freedom of others. Good to know.

I've already made that stance on private property quite clear.

You are now forced to move goalposts, because calling a fetus a baby is simply incorrect. It's nice to see that you learned the difference between the two. Now, let's see if you can use your newfound knowledge.

I never said people can't harm others, which why my stance doesn't change. People should be free to do what they want, so long as they do not harm others. Freedom is awesome, it's a shame you don't think so.

[Ghostpanther]

Clearly we aren't profiling vastly enough.

all recent terror attacks, rather all terror attacks in history, have been perpetuated by none other than.. the MALE.

We need to crack down on males in America, close off our borders from males entering the country, close off female vaginas from producing male babies. We aren't protecting ourselves well enough letting such violent people into our country /s

Meh. Men commit more crimes than females do. This is nothing new. Nothing wrong with profiling anyway, if it serves the purpose of catching the crooks and no laws are broken in the process.