Rethinking body positivity.

[Masark]

Why not?

10chars

Because if it worked, the problem wouldn't have happened to begin with.

[Player Twelve]

Because if it worked, the problem wouldn't have happened to begin with.

Sure it would, if you taught people to have self-discipline in the first place. Something that's amiss in many people today.

[Celista]

Root cause is we have reward centres ment to reward consuming energy keep us alive. Now thats turned against us when there is an abundance at hand and down right exploited by whole industries.

Stronger reward centre used to be a evolutionary benefit but now just serves to make you more prone to addiction.

People who get obese often seem to eat when they feel bad. So it ends up being more of a mental problem.
Fatshaming will really only worsen those peoples situation.
But then again if they're they should be accepted then its not really a problem and they might not deal with it, since dealing with addictions IS hard.
Actively fighting with your subconsciousness constantly.

I dunno. The health angle seems to be the only viable one.
Learning about diet and how the body works, setting realistic expectations as to not fall back to eating when they're not met and so on.

But anyway. Fatshaming wont work on most.
Active and competitive people might think so because they're motivated by challenges and have that "I'll show them" mentality.

The neuroscience seems to indicate that there are gender differences with overeating. Women are more likely to eat for emotional reasons, but men are more likely to overeat because they visually see food--like, if it's out on the counter, they'll eat it.

There are specific genes associated with binge eating disorder, so there is a genetic component as well.

[breadisfunny]

No it's fucking reality, unlike your bullshit where you think you know what you are talking about concerning this and every person individual struggle. As I said you have a solid point about drain on resources, same with smokers etc.

If someone chooses not to do WHAT THEY CAN, but I don't know what the case is in every individual circumstance and NEITHER DO YOU, you can source statistics and out of context evidence, but honestly it reveals more about you than it does just about anything else.

Obesity like a lot of things isn't an overnight epidemic, and there are many things that cause it, just like cancer, just like diabetes, WE DO KNOW what are factors. But for you or anybody to speak so succinctly about a fucking epidemic where people far smarter and in greater number than yourself have been working on it.

I am very much ok with ignoring your nonsense, over substantive facts and information brought about by a process not YouTube clips.

your just mad because i'm presenting you with cold hard truth. it's ok mall security just keep ignoring people because they're calling you out on your bullshit fallacies and red herrings.

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The neuroscience seems to indicate that there are gender differences with overeating. Women are more likely to eat for emotional reasons, but men are more likely to overeat because they visually see food--like, if it's out on the counter, they'll eat it.

There are specific genes associated with binge eating disorder, so there is a genetic component as well.

i see food right now. it's a delicious looking goat.

[Doctor Amadeus]

your just mad because i'm presenting you with cold hard truth. it's ok mall security just keep ignoring people because they're calling you out on your bullshit fallacies and red herrings.

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i see food right now. it's a delicious looking goat.

Not just you and the echo chamber of self important narcissistic nonsense. You don’t have any clue what the fuck you’re talking about.

[Calfredd]

Not just you and the echo chamber of self important narcissistic nonsense. You don’t have any clue what the fuck you’re talking about.

Are you two still arguing over the fact that not everyone who is obese and morbidly obese suffer from genetics-caused bodily issues?

[kamuimac]

Let's ignore the well known fat thread shitposters here and CI-CO self appointed nutritionists. As someone that has been varying levels of overweight for most of his adult life, this line from the article:

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Is some of the most dishonest nonsense anyone can tell themselves. Being at a proper weight range or even remotely close to it, is life on easy mode by comparision. Everything is harder when you're overweight, and continues up to nearly impossible the more you gain. Absolutely everything.

If someone is comfortable with their own level of obesity, that's fine. Asking other people to look past it and value you on some other quality is also fine. But to pretend it gives you any sort of advantage in any way shape or form is objectively incorrect.


Sorry to hear about your friend.

thats very true - alt least the part of "life on easy mode" - when i was in mid 20ties i had a period of 3 years when i stopped exercizing and focused on work - i didnt even notice when i gained 20 kg - it took me a year of semi proper diet , gym and swimmingpool - but god damit when i lost it and jumped down 2 sizes in trousers and 1 size in shirt it was feeling of nearly extasy - then when i lost additional 10kg next year i was like how the fuck i let myself down so much

obese people very often lie to themselves about how good they feel with their bodies because they cba to do anything with it.

[Rhaide]

You don’t get to determine what others personal choices are. People live their lives if you disagree with it then mind your own. Otherwise don’t complain when you attract the hostility you earned and being attacked yourself.

If that is your game so be it but I’m against that stupid shit.

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Pretty much right the fuck on.

You can't claim it's out of people's hands then insist it's a personal choice. Get your story straight, and I don't care who you are or what you want, if you stink because of your weight, or block a thin hallway and make everyone uncomfortable, or you raise the cost of healthcare or insurance you can fuck right off. Even if it is a personal choice, when it gets to that point you're a douchebag.

Smokers are assholes if they blow smoke in your face or make your car smell like smoke or drop ash on your belongings - same goes with obese people. If they get in the way of your reasonable comfort and personal space or cost you money, they are dicks.

EDIT: I shouldn't have to say this, but since your arguments are often based on attacking your opponent rather than their point, I'll clarify ahead of time: I'm only talking about people who are morbidly obese by their actions, not a legitimate disability or disorder

[breadisfunny]

Not just you and the echo chamber of self important narcissistic nonsense. You don’t have any clue what the fuck you’re talking about.

no your clearly just rage posting and not presenting any actual arguments.

[Doctor Amadeus]

no your clearly just rage posting and not presenting any actual arguments.

When you have an argument Ill have something to respond to, maybe, not interested in your bait and you screaming you are being attacked when you lose, so bye!

[breadisfunny]

When you have an argument Ill have something to respond to, maybe, not interested in your bait and you screaming you are being attacked when you lose, so bye!

good old mall security declare victory and leave the thread when his feelings get hurt. you havent had an actual argument for the last page or so just incoherent ranting.

[Doctor Amadeus]

You can't claim it's out of people's hands then insist it's a personal choice. Get your story straight, and I don't care who you are or what you want, if you stink because of your weight, or block a thin hallway and make everyone uncomfortable, or you raise the cost of healthcare or insurance you can fuck right off. Even if it is a personal choice, when it gets to that point you're a douchebag.

Smokers are assholes if they blow smoke in your face or make your car smell like smoke or drop ash on your belongings - same goes with obese people. If they get in the way of your reasonable comfort and personal space or cost you money, they are dicks.

EDIT: I shouldn't have to say this, but since your arguments are often based on attacking your opponent rather than their point, I'll clarify ahead of time: I'm only talking about people who are morbidly obese by their actions, not a legitimate disability or disorder

You don't know most people's situation and there is no conclusive data that is universally agreed upon as the cause, there are ideas by people obviously more educated and invested in the situation that people on a forum spewing nonsense to justify cruelty and hatred because people who are obese have the fucking nerve to try to actually be happy at all.

Seriously people are dying all the time and from shit that is worse or just as bad as obesity, maybe this is your pet little issue that gets you jonesed to feel better about your lot in life I don't know.

But I read the research, I have known people who struggled with obesity and weight problems, and I have known people who died from it, and other diseases, these people didn't lose their battles because they are fat lazy pigs who just never gave a fuck, they didn't die because they just didn't believe or think positively enough or in whatever bullshit platitudes either, and they damn sure didn't fucking die because they were too positive about themselves.

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good old mall security declare victory and leave the thread when his feelings get hurt. you havent had an actual argument for the last page or so just incoherent ranting.

Yep good is right, better than to listen to your nonsense babble back and fourth and declare whatever victories because I have the decency to even fucking respond to your nonsense rather than simply put your ass on ignore. I honestly guess I think you might actually I don't know get a fucking clue and have something of substance to say you didn't read somewhere or some garbage to preach to me you are equally clueless about.

Call me an optimist, but either way, I don't care what you have to say, you have no history or currency of any kind of credibility, so the only thing I can assume is you are simply entertaining yourself, for which alright, but you lost,you been shut down, and now you are just spinning your wheels, if you have nothing else to say in your next response Ill just go ahead and put you on ignore for your sake more than mine.

You know incase you think you're sensitivities are being attacked because you are wrong and can't actually argue a relevant, consistent or evidence based argument.

[doot]

My condolences OP.

[Rhaide]

You don't know most people's situation and there is no conclusive data that is universally agreed upon as the cause...

Gonna stop ya there chief. "No agreed upon cause?" There are plenty of causes, some are beyond a person's control and it's not fair to blame those people, but guess what, sometimes, sometimes people do it to themselves - if we're citing personal experience as acceptable evidence I'll happily cite the 2 people I personally knew who regularly ate north of 4000 calories a day and got no exercise. Eventually, after many years of being obese, one developed knee problems and forever after that they blamed their knees for their weight. Bullshit, they then went on welfare and other forms of gov't assistance, that was probably about 6 years ago, and guess what? They're still receiving aid from the government and while they can't realistically exercise, they still eat at fast food restaurants for almost every meal and generally get 2 combo meals when they can afford it.

Now for the analytical part, there is clearly some sort of psychiatric issue at work here (his mother was morbidly obese and enabled his behavior for years, I'm sure that didn't help). Obviously saying 'hey you need to eat better' isn't going to help, but alcoholics are in a similar position, it's an addiction that can't be beaten easily through force of will, that's why we strongly fight alcoholism and send people to treatment. Excessive eating is the same thing and should be treated the same way. I'm not saying we should be shaming fat people, but we should absolutely treat obsessive overeating as a disease just like any other dangerous addiction.

[Qnubi]

I have a friend that was 350lbs for like 5 years, I kept telling him he needs to lose weight or he dies of a stroke or heart attack by 40 and I didn't want that because, well, he's my friend. And he said he doesn't care, if he dies he dies. But I always kept telling him that I don't want him to die early and that it would be such a waste. And guess what, one day he actually told me: "you know what? I will lose fucking weight, because you keep telling me to and it annoys the fuck out of me."

Now he's down to 280 and still dropping. And he wishes to get at least down to 250lbs.

Confronting your friends/family with it is the most important thing, you should always care about their health and never stop telling them that they are loved and you would be so sad if they are gone because of stupid reasons like overweight or drugs etc.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Gonna stop ya there chief. "No agreed upon cause?" There are plenty of causes, some are beyond a person's control and it's not fair to blame those people, but guess what, sometimes, sometimes people do it to themselves - if we're citing personal experience as acceptable evidence I'll happily cite the 2 people I personally knew who regularly ate north of 4000 calories a day and got no exercise. Eventually, after many years of being obese, one developed knee problems and forever after that they blamed their knees for their weight. Bullshit, they then went on welfare and other forms of gov't assistance, that was probably about 6 years ago, and guess what? They're still receiving aid from the government and while they can't realistically exercise, they still eat at fast food restaurants for almost every meal and generally get 2 combo meals when they can afford it.

Now for the analytical part, there is clearly some sort of psychiatric issue at work here (his mother was morbidly obese and enabled his behavior for years, I'm sure that didn't help). Obviously saying 'hey you need to eat better' isn't going to help, but alcoholics are in a similar position, it's an addiction that can't be beaten easily through force of will, that's why we strongly fight alcoholism and send people to treatment. Excessive eating is the same thing and should be treated the same way. I'm not saying we should be shaming fat people, but we should absolutely treat obsessive overeating as a disease just like any other dangerous addiction.

Ok, you could probably drop the condescending and racist term Chief, I am not Native American or First Nations but all the same.

And before you leap to the Anecdotal train, let me remind you, that isn't what I argued, I am saying that the source of obesity has plenty of different routes some more common than another, but none of it clear cut and overly agreed upon science. Some things are very clear, but many things aren't.

It can be genetic and environmental do to mental development, it could be genetic and environmental and physical development, and it can be none genetic and developmental through situations such as stress or abuse. It can also be several other factors. concerning environmental.

But I really hate explaining any of this shit do you because if you had an ounce of education you would know this shit instead of spewing your tripe, honestly I don't care, you aren't worth convincing seriously. Most people who are decent and smart enough know the shit I just mentioned and can articulate it even better they teach this in school and in a lot more detail.

But I am not going to educate you, because it isn't education that is your problem because even if the evidence were provided and you could be convinced along the lines everyone and anyone else is and has been who are more intelligent and a lot more experienced than yourself or any YouTube's you watched.

The problem is for you it is simply a choice, and that can't be fixed, and honestly I wouldn't want to. Knowledge should be earned and not given, because maybe one day you will think critically in your life and you will go oh wow what was all that KNOWLEDGE I missed when I was yammering on some bullshit.


Anyways, Night.

[Saphyron]

I am fat and I'm trying to lose weight. But I feel like is a very steep upwards going hill that is impossible to climb sometimes.
Properly what most fat people think and they might have less of a will to keep going.

[Rhaide]

Ok, you could probably drop the condescending and racist term Chief, I am not Native American or First Nations but all the same.

And before you leap to the Anecdotal train, let me remind you, that isn't what I argued, I am saying that the source of obesity has plenty of different routes some more common than another, but none of it clear cut and overly agreed upon science. Some things are very clear, but many things aren't.

It can be genetic and environmental do to mental development, it could be genetic and environmental and physical development, and it can be none genetic and developmental through situations such as stress or abuse. It can also be several other factors. concerning environmental.

But I really hate explaining any of this shit do you because if you had an ounce of education you would know this shit instead of spewing your tripe, honestly I don't care, you aren't worth convincing seriously. Most people who are decent and smart enough know the shit I just mentioned and can articulate it even better they teach this in school and in a lot more detail.

But I am not going to educate you, because it isn't education that is your problem because even if the evidence were provided and you could be convinced along the lines everyone and anyone else is and has been who are more intelligent and a lot more experienced than yourself or any YouTube's you watched.

The problem is for you it is simply a choice, and that can't be fixed, and honestly I wouldn't want to. Knowledge should be earned and not given, because maybe one day you will think critically in your life and you will go oh wow what was all that KNOWLEDGE I missed when I was yammering on some bullshit.


Anyways, Night.

You are literally so ignorant that you think Native Americans coined the term chief? Wow, you're uneducated as hell. Do you really think they spoke english or french? Chief isn't a word directly associated with any Native American culture you racist.

Origin (https://www.etymonline.com/word/chief)

Middle English: from Old French chief, chef, based on Latin caput ‘head.’

[Doctor Amadeus]

You are literally so ignorant that you think Native Americans coined the term chief? Wow, you're uneducated as hell. Do you really think they spoke english or french? Chief isn't a word directly associated with any Native American culture you racist.

Origin (https://www.etymonline.com/word/chief)

Middle English: from Old French chief, chef, based on Latin caput ‘head.’

Not what you meant and not relevant to where the condescending term comes from like the word boy.

[Ghostpanther]

I have a friend that was 350lbs for like 5 years, I kept telling him he needs to lose weight or he dies of a stroke or heart attack by 40 and I didn't want that because, well, he's my friend. And he said he doesn't care, if he dies he dies. But I always kept telling him that I don't want him to die early and that it would be such a waste. And guess what, one day he actually told me: "you know what? I will lose fucking weight, because you keep telling me to and it annoys the fuck out of me."

Now he's down to 280 and still dropping. And he wishes to get at least down to 250lbs.

Confronting your friends/family with it is the most important thing, you should always care about their health and never stop telling them that they are loved and you would be so sad if they are gone because of stupid reasons like overweight or drugs etc.

This is a good post. The great majority of people have problems with being overweight because they are unwilling to take the steps your friend has. For the most part, "Captain of my ship, in command of my destination" is true. We can always look for excuses to feel better, but the choices are generally ours to make. Trying to be helpful in a positive way like you did, is very important. It helps to encourage someone.

Sorry to hear about your friends Celista. That has to be heartbreaking.