A world without Sniper Training.

[Deleted]

It's alright, the spec would be too easy without it.

[galaxyquest]

You know what would make things interesting?

If we could only cast while moving while Sniper Training is up.

Don't want to give Blizz any ideas, though :x

[mediic]

Sniper Training is the only thing that makes MM interesting, I like it.

[Shooter McGavin]

It is a bit of a sideline thing in PVP I guess because staying still is more difficult but it's far from impossible.

You clearly don't do arenas. Lol.

[sarym13]

Not hard to keep a long uptime on it. But I do miss jumping around like a retard and DPSing with no penalty.

[seam]

rofl, i love you man.


I wish MM mastery was like every X amount of auto shots dealt increased damage based on Mastery or something... kind of like Caitlyn's headshot in League of Legends.

Didn't the Firelands tier do that?

http://www.wowhead.com/spell=99057/i...r-t12-2p-bonus

I was close, 10% chance

[Ambulatory Cube]

The mastery is okay; I don't particularly mind it since unless I -have- to move, I'm more or less standing still anyway. I will note however that at least as far as PvE goes, Mastery ranks pretty darn low on things you should be looking for on gear, which at that point it's like... why bother with it at all? 'Course it's that way for several classes, too--other stats are just plain better than Mastery.

What bugs me more about the spec is how much I really miss those instant free Aimed Shot procs, and how much I actually miss Arcane Shot of all things, too. Marksmanship just feels so boring to play for me now. Arcane Mage actually seems more exciting

[Svisalith]

IMO what we should have for mastery is when we aim shot we gain a % buff for 3-4 seconds or increase the cast speed when we aim shot by x% for 10-15 seconds. So that way we can still move cast aim shots.

Lone Wolf is literally the better spec for most or even all fights, so everything already casts while moving and cast time is pretty much irrelevant. Aimed shot is also instant cast til the next expansion

i hate the mastery personally, kinda because of this:

1; If it's worth a ton of DPS, we have to be really careful about movement. That would feel awkward and contradictory to why we are playing hunter in the first place, now that they heavily redesigned the class and made everything castable while moving with no visible resemblance to the classic+TBC hunter that i played.

2; If it's not worth much DPS, you'd just take crit, multistrike and even versatility before even considering using any mastery. That's kinda where we are now. If you're keeping high uptime on sniper training it's technically better than versatility but versatility feels like the better stat.

[Sylv_]

It's actually a really terrible thought out mastery.
It needs an overhaul.
There should be a penalty while moving for damage reduction. After moving for such and so seconds, damage is slowly decreased in 1% intervals until x clause is met.

MM mastery could really be something dope if the hunter design team wasn't full of yuppi rejects.

[Ladyoftheforest]

For me the mastery Sniper Training is not undesirable, since it actually seem to illustrate Markmanship perfectly. MM is all about concentrated fire so having your weapondamage as highest source of power and concentrating while standing still embodies this well. Just L2P, Scrotles.

[Deleted]

Good thing you have two other specs that are different.

And almost unplayable

[Sencha]

Would be great. I chose to play hunter for its mobility.

[Deleted]

And almost unplayable

Why are they unplayable?

Would be great. I chose to play hunter for its mobility.

You are mobile 100%. And if you plan your movement accordingly, you even have a nice buff to range, damage and crit damage. It saddens me that people want every spec to play the same and destroy the last remnants of skillful play on MM.

[Deleted]

I dont like Sniper Training for certain reasons:

1) It's evidently almost never up in pvp. When you consider that our otherwise best stats, crit + multistrike, are halfed in potency in pvp as well, we're left with versatility (which is hardly present on 6.2 pvp gear for w/e reason, and haste (which isn't particularly strong for us either). Having to give up a 10+% dmg buff from the get go is pretty hurtful, yes

2) While can be a measurement of skill of sorts in pve, it is not really exiting gameplay, as it doesn't feel rewarding. I from time to times lose this effect, and hardly notice, because stuff like +dmg procs from trinkets or potions make it barely noticable looking at numbers midfight to see wether mastery is up or not. There's also a basic damage range to consider. CS critting for 180k? could be either with pot/trinket and w/o mastery, or w mastery, but without procs.
In short, you dont feel your mastery.
And while that is the same for most specs like bm, sv, enh, frost dk etc etc which do not much more than add a +% tag to certain dmg sources, at least they dont have some extra shit attached.
I agree mm is very easy gameplay-wise. I've played enh before, for reference, and it's like comparing a rubik champion with a kindergartener playing with play-doh (a little bit of hyperbole, I know ) However, mastery is the wrong place to add gameplay debt. At least in such a way. Movement is important and hunter's main selling point. MM gives off a turret feel, maybe add powershot for mm only as baseline, remove knockback and make that a glyph, and add mobility restriction through that, and make a different mastery.

3) If the movement restrictions really has to stay, I'd at least have a more noticable effect. Something that makes you go: "Oooh, mastery is up, got stop recharging it, I want that special effect back", or something.
Imo, that quick quiver thingy we had before (chance to proc extra shots) was better, though I guess multistrike is to similar.
Maybe while ST is active, your shots have the chance to reset/shorten a cooldown, lower focus cost/cast time of an ability, or similar.

4) Maybe the biggest reason I dislike snipertraining and stat balance for mm in how much better of bm is in comparison. All stats are roughly the same in pve, with mastery/haste/multistrike pulling a little bit ahead. Just stack mastery (it's on almost every pvp peace anyway, making mm suffer even more) ftw, rest is also good.

Add other problematic aspects, like bm getting nice pet steroids talent-wise as well synergy with their cooldowns with barrage and ravens, while we have to decide between
-giving up Master's Call, Roar of Sacrifice, Spirit Bond/Animal Bond/James Bond () and Pillar damage for some +dmg
-getting an immobile shot that replaces (instead of adding to) our mobile one
-a passive snare

MM is basically about blasting your target down and cry if it fails. A mastery hindering movement isn't the sollution. Also:

5) MM is the master of the bow. The others are good bowmen, but mm is especially good. So good that it needs to stand still while shooting!
...Let that sink in for a while. Shouldn't the other specs (IF AT ALL!) instead have that movement restriction, thinking of it like that? SV could have serious kick-back to their explosive arrows for example, and would need to standstill to toughen their shooting stance, and BM, being specialiszed on beast handling instead of shooting, would have less accuracy unless it would stand still while shooting (looking at how pets are mobile damage, and they get most of theirs through it, I'd deem that kinda balanced).
But for MM, the saint of the missile, to have that drawback... wouldn't you expect him to have all sorts of trick shots?
Firing while on the move, firing multiple arrows at the same time (multi shot feels kinda...self-evident...(well, OF COURSE all hunters can fire 20 arrows at the same time, why wouldn't they?)), firing rapid fire (barrage), hitting their own profectile to change course mid-way, to hit behind corners or increase range.
Having to stand still only seems justifyable if you'd make MM true snipers (having huuuuge range and overwhelming damage at the cost of not being able to move at all/not being able to do anything once reached), and that's not realisable without changing the entire pvp balance severely.