Faerie Fire - a huge quality of life issue.

[Phototropic]

What he said rings true to me too, Faerie Fire, a very much spammable spell, to a lessened extent even in Feral forms, prevents two Rogue key abilities. That does not happen for any other class with any spell that has such a short CD + long duration. Feral Druids are the second most affected by this, but it's not quite as bad seeing as Prowl is not as much of a signature/must-have ability as Stealth.

I said that you can't stealth whilst afflicted by FF, to which he replied that I didn't 'know my class' Blind fury that the first reply didn't necessarily state that it agrees with his opinion?

[Deleted]

Really? Last time I checked Rogues have - a self heal (that's pretty powerful and gives evergy when talented), high opening burst, plenty of stuns, a snare, a talent that gives them like 1000000% damage reduction when they are close to death, Blind, Smoke Bomb and an ability that removes all damage over time effects and makes them immune to magic damage for x seconds.

Now throw the balance arguement at me again please. Rogues do not need Vanish, it only encourages bad Rogues to stay bad.

Congratulations you successfully listed up some abilities. Now please do the same with retri paladin, warrior, death knight

and then try again to point out how much more stuff rogues have

[styopa]

I'm a rogue, and we already whinged our way into dispellable hunter's mark, short-duration hunter's mark, etc. we need to ramp up the campaign against Faerie Fire!

[Venant]

Simple solution is to make spells/abilities like faerie fire drop off automatically when combat ends, this would have no impact on pve and would allow for an effective counter in pvp.

[Seolla]

If your healer have problem throwing one dispel on you in a whole 5mins, you've lost the game already stealth or no stealth.

[Deleted]

Congratulations you successfully listed up some abilities. Now please do the same with retri paladin, warrior, death knight

and then try again to point out how much more stuff rogues have

You don't get it do you? Those 3 classes you just listed do not have the ability to stealth out of combat and run away. Can't believe I'm saying this about faceroll DK's but those 3 classes require more than just annoy people then run off.

Decent Rogues should be able to 1v1 without running away, they have the tools for it.

[Deleted]

Don't worry, you don't sound like a troll. You only sound like someone who doesn't have much of a clue about actual PvP and balance.

And Blizzard does? : P *Could not resist*

But are rogues really in such a bad state in pvp that FF completely ruin it for them? Have never played pvp at high level as rogue, but aint it that why you have cloak of shadow?

[Evolixe]

Honestly OP, i agree completely.
Stealth vision or even tracking.. Hell make it put a lazer show on top my head.
But completely locking it out preventing the use of the core ability of the class? Too much.

[Deleted]

You don't get it do you? Those 3 classes you just listed do not have the ability to stealth out of combat and run away. Can't believe I'm saying this about faceroll DK's but those 3 classes require more than just annoy people then run off.

Decent Rogues should be able to 1v1 without running away, they have the tools for it.

Pala bubble is different but brings you out of combat, outside arena/bg you can heartstone to safety
DK has bubble against casters instant heal with goul sacrifice and chains of ice as root
warri can charge another target /intervene to a friend

A rouge can only vanish away if he has no bleeds on him and no magic dot or cloak is ready.
The grass is always greener on the other side as they say.

[Loonatek]

Lol rogue crying about FF. Oh what have we reached.If FF will have a 5s duration let's make it also on DR. Actually let's remove it from the game, oh and also let's buff rogues, they seems a bit underpowered, oh actually why buff then, all rogues start @ 2.4 arena so it can be easy mode for all the cry babies.C'mon bro... did you srsly make a topic to cry about FF ? If you play 3s you have a healer, if you are skilled enuf to play 3 dps you use CoS for it cause if you don't kill a target in under 30s you lost anyway so there's no " saving cos for herp derp later in fight". If you play 2s... why do you come and moan here, 2s is shit, not balanced at all.Stop carrying like most of us and just kill ppl in a shadow dance or vanish with 1k hp after cheat death and come back 2 min later with full hp and all cds up.Don't get me started on the BS rogues have.

[Super Kami Dende]

No offense but I personaly love taking down 3 clueless people at once without losing even 50% of my HP because they simple have no idea how rogues work.

Why would i take that as offence, I played rogue as main through TBC and WOTLK. I gave it up in Cata because once they also got such an Unbalanced heal for a non-magic class they became such a cheap class (even moreso) I was just disgusted enough to change.

I know exactly how rogues Work, doesn't mean I can turn a blind-eye to obviously stupid mechanics they now have. Recuperate should never have been implemented, it basically brought about a whole new way for bad rogues and such to vanish and heal and be generally more annoying.

[Deleted]

Why would i take that as offence, I played rogue as main through TBC and WOTLK. I gave it up in Cata because once they also got such an Unbalanced heal for a non-magic class they became such a cheap class (even moreso) I was just disgusted enough to change.

Pro-tip: all meele have self-heal nowadays.

[Deleted]

Pala bubble is different but brings you out of combat, outside arena/bg you can heartstone to safety
DK has bubble against casters instant heal with goul sacrifice and chains of ice as root
warri can charge another target /intervene to a friend

A rouge can only vanish away if he has no bleeds on him and no magic dot or cloak is ready.
The grass is always greener on the other side as they say.

Bubble doesn't drop combat at all, and you can't HS with it up anymore it doesn't last as long.

No matter what excuses you guys make, Vanish is not justifiable. Rogues have as much or better damage, self healing and control as other classes, they do not need to flee.

---------- Post added 2011-11-16 at 01:11 PM ----------

Pro-tip: all meele have self-heal nowadays.

Ret Paladins need to sacrifice damage to self heal. DK's self heal is not as strong as it use to be, and they also need to sacrifice a pet and runic power. Warriors self healing is reactive, or on a very long cd and requires an enrage.

Rogues can pop Recuperate when in stealth, they can talent for it to be much stronger and also to restore Energy. It's also part of their rotation as Subtlely, they have no penalty for using it.

[Super Kami Dende]

Pro-tip: all meele have self-heal nowadays.

But not to the extent of Subs fire and forget massive passive healing from a 5 CP recup. There is definately something wrong when a rogue, a complete non-magic user, does more Healing than a Ret Paladin or Enhance shaman. whist still having all the Utility they do.

[Deleted]

Simple solution is to make spells/abilities like faerie fire drop off automatically when combat ends, this would have no impact on pve and would allow for an effective counter in pvp.

This would make it effectively useless, except as a Vanish counter (which is what shouldn't exist). You need to get out of combat to restealth anyway, so that's not a good solution.

If your healer have problem throwing one dispel on you in a whole 5mins, you've lost the game already stealth or no stealth.

Hmm, I know this can be hard to grasp, but what if there's no healer nearby? And what if you play a setup without a healer? Lastly, why should a spell be so strong just to be balanced around being dispelled? It makes no sense.

You don't get it do you? Those 3 classes you just listed do not have the ability to stealth out of combat and run away. Can't believe I'm saying this about faceroll DK's but those 3 classes require more than just annoy people then run off.

Decent Rogues should be able to 1v1 without running away, they have the tools for it.

Rogues are balanced around having Stealth and Vanish, just like Warriors and Druids are balanced around having Charge and being able to Shapeshift. ONE single ability without any significant CD (or no CD at all) preventing both is too strong.

And Blizzard does? : P *Could not resist*

Many times more than the average WoW player, yes.

But are rogues really in such a bad state in pvp that FF completely ruin it for them? Have never played pvp at high level as rogue, but aint it that why you have cloak of shadow?

Cloak of Shadows shares CD with Combat Readiness, using Cloak of Shadows vs a Feral Druid to be able to Stealth renders you unable to use Combat Readiness, which should be used versus melee. Cloak of Shadows will also be preferably used vs Resto and Balance Druids in other situations than to allow a Vanish to happen.

Lastly, I don't play a Rogue, my main was a Druid for quite some time (until recently, I'm currently playing Priest) - Faerie Fire *IS* too strong.

[Super Kami Dende]

I think If rogues couldn't use Recup in Vanish or Stealth, I would be Happy, as that is the main problem with them these days.

Vanishing and waiting in stealth with prep to just heal themselves to full every time you get them low on HP.

[Deleted]

No matter what excuses you guys make, Vanish is not justifiable. Rogues have as much or better damage, self healing and control as other classes, they do not need to flee.

I'm sorry (no I'm not), but this does nothing but prove how little you know about PvP. Vanish is a key ability, Rogues need it in actual PvP.

I think If rogues couldn't use Recup in Vanish or Stealth, I would be Happy, as that is the main problem with them these days.

Vanishing and waiting in stealth with prep to just heal themselves to full every time you get them low on HP.

Casting Recuperation taking you out of Stealth is justifiable, yes. I'd approve of that as well.

[ymirsson]

You don't get it do you? Those 3 classes you just listed do not have the ability to stealth out of combat and run away. Can't believe I'm saying this about faceroll DK's but those 3 classes require more than just annoy people then run off.

Decent Rogues should be able to 1v1 without running away, they have the tools for it.

decent rogues kill 1v1. your whining is unbearable. if vanishing is bad manners, self heal is out too? tell the DKs and Paladins please.
class abilities are designed to be used. don't hate people for using them.

[Deleted]

If you skill into recup to be stronger(combat) you sacrifice 20% crit for backstab. If you recup mid-combat to keep it up you just gave up a finisher for dps
Same case as pala. You either get dps or heal. Sure as sub it increases energy regen but its damage is mediocre even with it and bad without it. sub rogue damage only shoots trough the roof in shadowdance which needs to be set up to work out or you end up wasting it.

If rogue were so op we would have way more at the top

Casting Recuperation taking you out of Stealth is justifiable, yes. I'd approve of that as well.

Wouldn't change much as you would just go behind a pillar and use it, restealth.

[Deleted]

I'm sorry (no I'm not), but this does nothing but prove how little you know about PvP. Vanish is a key ability, Rogues need it in actual PvP.

It's a key ability for bad Rogues to run off, good Rogues would manage without it.