"Americans have no freedoms"

[Bolson13]

... Is the "13" in your name indicative of your age when you joined the forums? Because to talk about 9/11 the way you do is only possible if you were not a conscious human at that time. 9/11 was not just one explosion. It was a series of the most brutal type of terrorist attacks the world had ever seen. Not just all of the USA froze in fear; the whole world did - except for the countries that rejoiced and danced in the streets as burning people were jumping to their death.

Again: you dont understand what terrorism is.

I was actually an adult at the time already thank you. And I am sure you crapped your pants when it happened and felt "terrorised" but any sane being would be wise enough not to compare himself with the same term as the ones actually in those towers/planes etc.

And looking back it is safe to say that most of these fears from average joes were irrational. That doesn't mean that we should be carefull and try to defend ourselves from such attacks. But some things went too far and weren't even usefull even if it was needed. Too much of our liberties were given away (and some in the US say they still are being taken) because of that one day.

[wilbbailey]

What the hell does that have to do with anything ive said? Please dont include me in your attempt to control other peoples persuit of happiness.

Yeah keep telling yourself violent video games, popcultures that promote whores & pimps, extreme graphical brutality on television/internet/billboards/..., media focussed entirely on brutality & violence, is IN NO WAY RELATED to the degradation of morality among youth. Must be completely unrelated.

---------- Post added 2012-01-20 at 01:54 PM ----------



And if i had said people in europe were not free, this has actually had some relevance. Since all i said was that americans have MORE of it, it doesn't.

[markos82]

All valid but the point is knowing of an attack and doing nothing is not the same thing as initiating an attack against your own people. I know there is a possibility that if carry a gun I have a higher possibility of shooting myself on accident but it's hardly pointing the gun at my foot and blowing it off.

---------- Post added 2012-01-20 at 12:43 PM ----------


it's not relevant at all, he just wanted to show he knew what percentages were.

Not the same as in 100% but it shows how high is country capable to go in reaching goals. 3000+ ppl died i think same number as in 09/11 attack, america lost almost entire Pacific fleet and they know it will happen and chose to ignore it just to enter war and make profits. You dont see the pattern? Bin Laden attacks, they go to "his" country destroys everything but during that time take over Oil wells and again make profit. No one is saying that attack didn't happen.

[Clevername]

so, OPs argument is "we have comparatively huge freedom, so it´s ok if it get taken away bit by bit".
I can´t disagree more with this.

Agreed, you do have to constantly fight to protect your rights, I think it was just more of a knee jerk reaction to the other thread that popped up by one of your EU brothers bashing the the US... I know it's pretty much expected on these forums that any and every one will comment and criticize the US government but after awhile we get tired of hearing it, you don't see a post every two days about how fucked Germany is and what you should do as a country, see what I mean?

[Deleted]

So you're saying Europeans are not allowed to form a union?

No, i'm saying that in the USA you are allowed to form armed militia and patroll/defend your own neighbourhood while carrying fire-arms, which in Europe would get you gunned down by special forces.

How is it that me saying "americans have MORE freedom than europeans" gets turned into "europeans dont have freedom" by several people?

[Deleted]

Comparing America with those countries is stupid. It's like comparing WoW to Runescape.

If these bills pass, they take away a piece of their freedom, and more freedom = good, less freedom = bad.
If no one would say stuff like that, the government could pass any bill they wanted, its democracy, and is also how America works.

[Clevername]

Not the same as in 100% but it shows how high is country capable to go in reaching goals. 3000+ ppl died i think same number as in 09/11 attack, america lost almost entire Pacific fleet and they know it will happen and chose to ignore it just to enter war and make profits. You dont see the pattern? Bin Laden attacks, they go to "his" country destroys everything but during that time take over Oil wells and again make profit. No one is saying that attack didn't happen.

Had this oil profit discussion about 15000 times now and tired of it, not even getting into it.

[Bolson13]

Yeah keep telling yourself violent video games, popcultures that promote whores & pimps, extreme graphical brutality on television/internet/billboards/..., media focussed entirely on brutality & violence, is IN NO WAY RELATED to the degradation of morality among youth. Must be completely unrelated.

---------- Post added 2012-01-20 at 01:54 PM ----------



And if i had said people in europe were not free, this would actually have had some relevance. Since all i said was that americans have MORE of it, it doesn't.

Since 1994 youth crime in the US has steadily dropped.

Also, please give me these statistics where Americans have more freedom.

[shise]

And btw, all this going on with Iran.. i can see that they are already doing the duty in USA aren't they? (So are they in Europe aswell)

Washing your mind in the tv telling you how "bad bad bad Iran"* is and why USA must go there to "democratize"* them.






*"Bad bad bad Iran": Iran has nuclear weapons, just as Europe and USA.
Iran is not using them against anyone, USA and Europe, on the other had,are going there to STEAL their oil and positioning on the map.

*"Democratize" them: Yep, because more than 1500000 people dead in about 10 years is democratize.






(I have nothing against USA people and i definitely dislike Iran's model, but i can't stand lies and people being cheatted, and even less i can't stand people who talk crap they have no clue about.)

[Geni]

Americans have the illusion of freedom (My opinion).

Americans have the right to carry a gun and is backed up by the constitution!

But it is illegal to carry a pair of wire-cutters in your back pocket?
And it's illigal to fish while sitting on a horse in the state of Utah..?


How can it be called freedom when there's a law for everything?

[markos82]

I think the thing that bothers me the most is people think they are entitled to downloading music/movies for free. Where are the artists rights to not have his/her shit pirated. It's like going out to eat and then dine and dashing and claiming its your right to eat so you shouldn't have to pay for it.

Hm you do realize that American justice system decided to shutdown megaupload, company based in China, arrest ppl who are not American citizens and all under US justice rules?

[Jurwi]

Anyone else get really pissed off when you hear someone say this?

With all this SOPA/PIPA crap going on, more and more idiots on facebook/etc keep on saying "I thought we had freedom in America..." or "The Gov't takes away all our freedom", and my only response is always:


If you think Americans have no freedom, go to Iran, go to Syria, China or North Korea. You'll be begging for American freedom in a day.



Anyone else have opinions on this?

You clearly have no idea what SOPA/PIPA can really REALLY do to the internet.

[markos82]

Had this oil profit discussion about 15000 times now and tired of it, not even getting into it.

Tired of it doesn't make it not true. Same in Libya, had friends who worked there for 5+ years.

[Clevername]

And btw, all this going on with Iran.. i can see that they are already doing the duty in USA aren't they? (So are they in Europe aswell)

Washing your mind in the tv telling you how "bad bad bad Iran"* is and why USA must go there to "democratize"* them.







*"Bad bad bad Iran": Iran has nuclear weapons, just as Europe and USA.
Iran is not using them against anyone, USA and Europe, on the other had,are going there to STEAL their oil and positioning on the map.

*"Democratize" them: Yep, because more than 1500000 people dead in about 10 years is democratize.






(I have nothign against USA people and i definitely dislike Iran's model, but i can't stand lies and people being cheatted, and even less i can't stand people who talk crap they have no clue about.)

You're right, I have no idea where we get the idea that Iran doesn't like us. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92myDzAFgU4 someone posted that little beauty the other day, think it sums things up. We don't want to democratize them, we just don't want them to attack us or our allies, pretty simple really.

[Deleted]

it is because hollywood, big music companies and others were used to oligopoly and they could dictate prices which are still SOO DAMN HIGH! free internet completely f*cked this status quo and they are freaking out - they are losing tons of money, power and influence.

You mean in the past they HAD THE NERVE to sell the product THEY MADE and that can by no definition be considered an essential AT THE PRICES THEY WANTED FOR IT??? HOW DARE THEY!!??!? Offcourse it makes perfect sence to go steal products you can afford to buy but dont because you have the option to steal it. Somehow we are all entitled to copies of any software or music developed worldwide, without any cost. It should be made a law ffs!!!!

it is time to move on and forget this "business model" and btw you can still earn solid money as a musician on tours and concerts, as actor in the theatre and even by paid downloads .

Yeah, if you're U2, or madonna, you really dont need the money from selling cd's. But if you're in a newly formed band, and you've spent a year writing & recording an album, hoping to make some earnings from it, it's really frustrating to see illegal versions online getting downloaded ten times more than you're actually selling it. Stealing is stealing, just because you can get away with it doesn't make it any less of a theft.

[Clevername]

Tired of it doesn't make it not true. Same in Libya, had friends who worked there for 5+ years.

Sweet, I have worked in Iraq for 4 years but I'm sure you know more about what goes on here than I do.

[Sorrior]

Well we DO have less than we did and we ARE losing more and more every one to two years. However we still have more than alot of places and thatincludes europe and other first world nations. However that's not saying much considering how pretty much all first world nations are going nanny state. America however is going BOTH nanny and police state. Probably why we got the slow descent into madness. Well that and our constitution is still in effect. At least for now.

[shise]

You're right, I have no idea where we get the idea that Iran doesn't like us. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92myDzAFgU4 someone posted that little beauty the other day, think it sums things up. We don't want to democratize them, we just don't want them to attack us or our allies, pretty simple really.

Iran didn't have anything against USA untill USA decided that they had to steal their oil.

If Iran suddenly decides to do that against USA i would definitely understand the incoming reaction.

But now tell me, who started out all this conflict? because it's nothing new and this has nothing to do with the "S11", this comes from a past date.

; ) ...

[Deleted]

Since 1994 youth crime in the US has steadily dropped.

I said MORALITY. Not CRIMINALITY. Please look up the difference and stop replying to posts you can't read or understand.

Also, please give me these statistics where Americans have more freedom.

As i said before, they're based of my knowledge of the american and european laws, not on statistics. Statistics comparing "freedom in europe" with "freedom in america", right.

[achaeon]

this sopa/pipa thing would have never passed even with all the hype it has gotten. its just another one of those bullshit laws that where proposed and would have gotten shot down.

You obviously weren't following it very closely. For a long time it looked certain to pass. Only recent has that changed.