Their answer on LFR necessity was very weak.

[Thenuge]

Their argument is pretty weak.

They're lumping all players who don't like cheapening their experience in LFR as "Hardcore World First" guilds.

As if they're the only ones who will do anything they can to help their guild on progression.
Everyone who's everyone will see an opportunity to get better loot for little to no effort.

It can all be resolved by sharing the lock out. It would make more people happy than upset (which was why LFR was made, I believe?)

I highly doubt it would make more people happy than upset.

[Orbitus]

Even that argument is weak.

I mean it could go "If you are not hard core then why care if you complete normal at all"?

I mean come on, that argument simplifies the world into 'hard cores' and 'nabs' that don't care. Most people care, it's just that some are too extreme about it.

My question is why do you care how someone spends their time they paid for? If they like LFR how does it effect you? Here's a hint: IT DOESN'T! Get over yourself and your slanted view.

[HeedmySpeed]

I think it is being talked about because some of the younger players are not quite over the real life situation where they want something and know if they whine at their mummy and have tantrums, mummy will give in and they get what they want. What they have not realised is that Blizz is NOT their mummy and no amount of whining and no tantrums are going to make them change their mind. Blizz does not love them like their mummy does, Blizz is actually treating them as adults. LFR is too popular with too many players for the sulks and tears of a few special snowflakes to change things

That's hilarious because I that's what Blizzard usually does

How do I know this? "Heroics were too hard and I don't want to get better, nerf plox!"

[Deleted]

That's hilarious because I that's what Blizzard usually does

How do I know this? "Heroics were too hard and I don't want to get better, nerf plox!"

They have only implemented the same system as they did in Wrath. Didn't see any QQ when it happend back then.
only because they now reach a much more wider public doesn't mean the system is bad.
Yes this comes from someone who has had the privilege of seeing all content pre-nerf.
Pretty sure if the day would be there where you can't manage to pull off 1 heroic, you'd be the one at the other end, crying for help.

All they want is for people to see content, which they pay for. Seems logical doesn't it?

[Deleted]

Yeah, cuz LFR *totally* drops the best possible gear in the game.

Yeah it does. Best possible gear for progressing, obviously. Set Items + Trinkets was a huge upgrade even though owning full t12h bis gear back then. Epic fail imo.

[Deleted]

People keep changing the subject in this thread to satisfy their notion that Blizzard is always right.

This is not about the ability to not run LFR. You can not run the game at all too.

This is about their weak claim that LFR is some kind of optional thing for regular gamers and it's mainly a world first thing. This is humorous. Even the most casual raiding guilds run LFR.

The main OPness of it is that it drops _TIER_ bonuses.

[Jeleh]

I honestly don't see how those answers are weak.

Because they don't agree with his opinion.

[Deleted]

Because they don't agree with his opinion.

It's an oxymoron you'd be sarcastic about that since it shows without providing any arguments whatsover, you imply that Blizzard is right and me someone that must be made fun of.

Who could be made fun of is someone that provides 0 arguments and then mocks people for disagreeing with something they automatically think is right.

[Dundebuns]

If they just made LFR drop iLvl stuff on par with the previous tier, then this would never have been a problem. It should make harder modes accessible, and not give anything that might be even vaguely competitive with the current ilvl gear.

[Deleted]

If they just made LFR drop iLvl stuff on par with the previous tier, then this would never have been a problem. It should make harder modes accessible, and not give anything that might be even vaguely competitive with the current ilvl gear.

The main OPness is the tier bonuses IMO.

[Asmekiel]

The main OPness is the tier bonuses IMO.

Not every new tier has new OP set bonusses though.

[Franzy]

They can keep LFR as long as it looks like level 30 dungeon gear and has no tier set bonuses,lol.

[Deleted]

Not every new tier has new OP set bonusses though.

Even in those cases, when they get the heroic or normal versions and they miss one piece, then LFR is OP.

[Maleric]

I understand your point and your frustrations, though Maleric makes a good point as well. Running 10 mans had a far greater commitment to it than LFR has. You can get into shitty LFR groups and wipe a lot, or only need the first boss of a segment and see the awesome "3/8" pop up when your queue finally pops, but there's no guild drama associated with it and you don't have to commit a day where you tell your boss you can't work that night for "something", or plan your week around two different sets of raid groups, because you can do LFR whenever, any day, all week.

I said it before though, and I still think it would make sense, to make LFR gear on par with or worse than heroic 5man gear. Maybe still keep the tier pieces in there to make getting a set bonus still a really useful stroke of luck, but if LFR's gear wasn't better than 5man heroic gear, then you'd either have to give up on your argument here or start also saying that blizzard forces us to run 5man heroics to gear up for raids... and when you think about it, LFR is just a longer heroic with more people and more complex/more interesting/more bosses. You queue up for both, you get into both with randoms, and you get gear from them to prepare you for real raids. If you aren't getting your gear from 5mans, which are a commitment and something you would feel obligated to do to gear up for and prepare for your raids, and you don't want to have to get your gear from LFR, then you aren't getting it anywhere except for in your raid... which you've entered in quest greens and blues, apparently.

If LFR gear was only as good as gear from heroic five mans, then there would be little gear progression for non-raiders. Their gear progression options would effectively end at heroic five mans, just like they used to. Even if you do raid, hopefully you see that having content for non-raiders is generally a good thing. It gives them a reason to play their mains, and since the content in question piggybacks on raid content it helps to justify the development time spent on raid content.

Also, the fact remains that the problem that LFR causes for raiders just is not a big deal. You have to run it once a week for the first month or two of a tier. That's the same time and scheduling commitment as running a few heroics. Any remedy for this supposed problem shouldn't have a big impact on non-raiders, because the impact that the current situation has on raiders isn't big. And removing their gear progression post-heroic five mans would be a big deal.

[Deleted]

If LFR gear was only as good as gear from heroic five mans, then there would be little gear progression for non-raiders. Their gear progression options would effectively end at heroic five mans, just like they used to.

Not if they were 384 with no tier bonuses.

[Maleric]

Not if they were 384 with no tier bonuses.

But, again, what's the benefit? Raiders saving a few hours a week for the first month or two of each tier? Is that really a big deal? Does it really justify taking interesting gear progression away from non-raiders?

[Soulstrike]

*Cata Patch hits the server*

"Hey guys, you don't need anymore running 10- and 25 man for better gear ..."


*DS Patch hits the server*

"Here you go guys. And again you have to run twice the same raid in one lockout to get the best possible gear."


LfR sucks. Give back separated 10 / 25 man IDs.

i didnt know LFR offered BEST POSSIBLE GEAR

and no i dont think people who do heroic content will do lfr "for gear" unless its like op trinket

[Melkandor]

Didn't they change 10/25 lockouts so it made players feel as if they didnt have to do an instance twice a week?

[Jalek]

I never fealt like I had to run LFR to be competitive, saying that I was in pretty much BIS from Heroic FL prior to it coming out. I think I ran it once per character then gave up as I was sick of carrying bads and normal DS was easy enough let alone a dumbed down version that you could ignore 90% of the mechanics.

I really hated when I inspected people and they had terrible gear with no gems and enchants and did <10k dps. Part of raiding is making an effort to maximise your gear. Making zero effort is just punishing on the people you are grouped with.

[Nerraw]

Didn't they change 10/25 lockouts so it made players feel as if they didnt have to do an instance twice a week?

That was part of the reasoning, yes.