Curious on gearing

[sosleapy]

Wtf ever happened to progression guilds and gearing tanks out first? Since this exp it has been that way but my guild leader and raid leader said no not happening! Like wtf?!?!? Did I miss something?

[Aviditas]

Welcome to current raiding. You can take a crap ton of damage with the meta since 5.2. Tanks arent as gear desperate as most dps. And since alot of fights can be easily dealt with by just zerging it all, dps goes first. Thats my opinion. Id gear the raid towards dps/tanks=healers

[Mirri]

So your raid leader is god and whatever he says is the absolute truth. Also you are assuming that if it happens to your guild, it happens to every single progression guild - which is patently false

Your RL is probably right though - vengeance changes have made it such that tank dps is not as insane as it was in 5.2 progression and raid dps is better increased by giving loot to actual dps rather than tanks if survivability is not an issue (it shouldn't be an issue on normal mode unless you are severely under geared for some reason)

[Moshots]

So your raid leader is god and whatever he says is the absolute truth. Also you are assuming that if it happens to your guild, it happens to every single progression guild - which is patently false

Your RL is probably right though - vengeance changes have made it such that tank dps is not as insane as it was in 5.2 progression and raid dps is better increased by giving loot to actual dps rather than tanks if survivability is not an issue (it shouldn't be an issue on normal mode unless you are severely under geared for some reason)

heroic raiding MOP style.
#1 do tanks get 2 shot by bosses without gear. Answer on 95% of fights NO
#2 do dps/healer checks cause the raid to whipe more than the 5% of fights that have a chance to get unlucky 2 shot on a tank. YES

[sosleapy]

Well my ilevel is 528 while about 75% of the rest of the raid is 530+. And the other 25% is at my level. And we do 25 man normals only. I ain't trying to be greedy just when I stopped in cata it was tanks first. Guess ill just go with the flow

[Rucati]

I've never been in a group that geared tanks first, gear doesn't really help any one role more than others. You could say that a tank can take an extra attack with extra gear, but a healer could heal him up faster with more gear or the DPS could stop an extra attack from happening. So really, there's no reason to gear any one role first while ignoring others.

[sosleapy]

Then I guess u haven't played long as in cata and expansions before that was the golden rule to gear tanks first.

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I'm just wondering does 10 man gearing different than 25 man as bosses do hit harder in 25 man

[Deleted]

You play 25m? What class? I'd imagine enough plate parry/dodge gear so you won't drop behind? Only tier bonuses may be harder to get prio from I suppose.

[Dracodraco]

Tanks have not been prioritised since the WOTLK days. It's been DPS>Healers=Tanks for years. Only if the tank literally gets 1 shot does he need more gear.

[Totaltotemic]

Tanks have not been prioritised since the WOTLK days. It's been DPS>Healers=Tanks for years. Only if the tank literally gets 1 shot does he need more gear.

Basically this. In DS tank tier was important because it gave raid-wide cooldowns, but that was an exception to the rule. Tank gear has been pretty irrelevant to the progression of a raid for a long time.

[Tehterokkar]

We've just been going with whoever rolls highest so far and then when EPGP standings normalize, whoever has highest EPGP ratio wins the loot. No special treatment for healers/tanks/DPS.

The only ones I'd give priority are probably Holy Priests on Tier. The Tier bonuses are absolutely amazing for Holy.

[sosleapy]

You play 25m? What class? I'd imagine enough plate parry/dodge gear so you won't drop behind? Only tier bonuses may be harder to get prio from I suppose.

I play brewmaster and yes we do 25 man normally

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Tanks have not been prioritised since the WOTLK days. It's been DPS>Healers=Tanks for years. Only if the tank literally gets 1 shot does he need more gear.

guilds on my servers where gearing tanks up till I stopped in cata. Just I was used to it come back and it changed from my expierince is all.

[ThrashMetalFtw]

Top guilds haven't been gearing up Tanks first since TBC/early WotLK.

[sosleapy]

Top guilds haven't been gearing up Tanks first since TBC/early WotLK.

I was in top guild on my server up till end of wotlk and we geared tanks first then. But off that now I just wanna know if doing 25 man if it is different. I know on 10 man it ain't as big a diff

[sourmonkey]

Wtf ever happened to progression guilds and gearing tanks out first? Since this exp it has been that way but my guild leader and raid leader said no not happening! Like wtf?!?!? Did I miss something?

Tanks got gear in the past for survival , HP and TPS
With changes to how aggro works , defensive stances , auras or form allow you to survive and do higher TPS without the need to be "as" gear dependent . Most fights now have you basically doing three main mechanics

1) don't stand in stuff
2) tank swap on certain mechanics
3) have the dps to kill the boss before enrage

I use to tank in tbc raids up to black temple when I decided to go fury .
Have yet to go back to tanking to many idiots that don't wait or pulls before the tank is ready

But there are so many other "ways" of gettin gear , any 90 I mean from super casual to hardcore should "now" have no issue getting gear . The only problem i see with the super easy obtain-able gear is bad players getting into places they should not.

IE. grandma Jane plays wow in her spare time gets to timeless isle and her 420 ilvl chipMONK now has 496 gear score one night she decides to tank a SoO without any experience in raids and wastes other people's time by wiping the group non Stop how fair is that to those of us that is there who knows our class?

[Leblue]

Tanks have not been prioritised since the WOTLK days. It's been DPS>Healers=Tanks for years. Only if the tank literally gets 1 shot does he need more gear.

Its pretty much this. Currently as it stands we do DPS > Healers > Tanks as far as gearing goes. The faster the boss dies, the less healing that needs to be done, the less damage the tank takes. Gearing reverse of that invites slower encounters which leads to more room for error and possibly hitting soft/hard enrages.

Would you rather do Iron Juggernaut in basically one assault phase or a couple assault and siege phases?
How long would you like Protector's desperate measure phases to last?
How long until you reach 30% on Sha of Pride for the Pride reset?

These are just a few reasons why gearing up your dps is just so much more advantageous than gearing up your tanks, even your healers to an extent. This is also why coin rolls can be great, you can gear without slowing down the gearing of your dps.

[Mammoon]

Blizzard switched mentality after WotLK and made boss damage much, much, much less spiky (and overall lower) and made bosses have tighter enrages.

As a results, most progression guilds have been gearing DPS over everything else. Generally you won't be struggling on progression because tanks can't stay alive, it is almost always due to lack of dps.

[Sunnydruid]

Most top guilds gear up tanks and healers first because of the way they push progression. In the end, it can be more effective, but it could also leave voids that need to be filled ASAP with overall raid damage vs boss timers. It's how the game is changing honestly, they have definitely evened out boss damage a TON compared to wotlk and before expansions. So the need to gear out the heals/tanks are less of a priority also because the newer fights, when it comes down to it, are dps races. I like the state that raiding is in, it's a shame I can't really raid anymore. No morning guilds

[Weightlifter]

Well my ilevel is 528 while about 75% of the rest of the raid is 530+. And the other 25% is at my level. And we do 25 man normals only. I ain't trying to be greedy just when I stopped in cata it was tanks first. Guess ill just go with the flow

That means you are probably casual and should gear whoever /rolls the highest. Priorizing loot is something that's only done in hardcore guilds and usually causes very much butthurt unless everyone has the same "progress > all, no matter what cost" mindset.

[Rucati]

Then I guess u haven't played long as in cata and expansions before that was the golden rule to gear tanks first.

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I'm just wondering does 10 man gearing different than 25 man as bosses do hit harder in 25 man

Actually I full cleared every BC raid while it was current content, including Sunwell pre nerf. So... Yeah, you're wrong.