Tenton Hammer names Guild Wars 2 best MMO of 2013

[zed zebes]

tentonhammer has been covering MMOs for awhile

[Valeron]

god forbid a site chooses something that you don't like, geez

[Fencers]

Best MMO of the year goes to the game with little character progression and an extremely homogenized class/combat system? Nice.

Character progression and non homogenized class & combat systems are not necessarily better than their opposite in design. That is to say a game isn't just better for having character progression or unique classes and combat.

It may be that to you character progression is an important aspect. Therefore you may view it as subjectively better state than the inverse. However, it is very possible [& likely] that Ten Ton Hammer don't share your view!

There is no hard fact in design. Design is a subjective process- it is at the artist's or artists' discretion how to implement [or leave out] any aspect of a game. Only gameplay is an objective truth in video games. And that is the exact operation of game mechanics divorced of one's own feelings about anything, really.

[Lane]

you can make easily 10g an hr by just having some dedication to it :P

There hasn't been anything I've wanted to do since repeated nerfs to farming. I don't enjoy dungeons and I can't stand the champion trains. If there's something else people have been doing then, please, let me know.

[LilSaihah]

There hasn't been anything I've wanted to do since repeated nerfs to farming. I don't enjoy dungeons and I can't stand the champion trains. If there's something else people have been doing then, please, let me know.

If you want to drop a bit of gold on a long-term investment, crafting Bolts of Damask is pretty profitable. Not really 10g/hr, as you can only make them once a day, but still fairly easy money.

[Deleted]

I think you missed the part where I pointed out that WoW charges for a sub and still has a cash shop that rivals that of a f2p/b2p game like GW2, so if GW2 did have a sub it would probably have both the gem store and the sub fee just like WoW does. They would probably stop charging for bank, inventory, and character slots though, but keep everything else that the gem store currently offers.

WoWs cash shop is not even remotely comparable to GW2. I dont like WoWs but its all cosmetic stuff i have no interest in whatsoever. (I did kinda like the bat mount but given that i have >150 other mounts its not something i am even remotely tempted with.) GW2 has stuff i'd consider almost mandatory and adds temporary stuff all the time too.

you can make easily 10g an hr by just having some dedication to it :P

If your playing GW2 regularly enough to want to spend that much on gems chances are you are working towards either 1 or more legendary weapons or full ascended armor weapon kits, both of which cost huge amounts of gold. Pretty stupid if you then spend all that gold on gems.

[Deleted]

The thing that gets me is the price of some things, not so much their availability for cash. Char slot for $10, meh, but bank slots? Name Change is $10? Same with WoW, the paid services are just outrageous pricing, IMO, and the mounts being $25 just seems silly to me. The helmets cost as much as a GW2 armor set.

I would prefer greatly if GW2 do would do the armor sets by piece, say 200 gems per piece, 800 for the whole set or similar, but oh well.

I`d never thought of that before, the price of new character slots.
Just realised you`re paying around half the price of the game for one (assuming you bought the cheapest version), that definitely is too much. Just checked my old receipts, it was also £6.99 in Guild Wars, but they also did regular sales for those, Xunlei & skins etc.

Guild Wars did the clothing perfectly, any skin you bought went to an npc in game. You just perambulated there any time you want, on *any* character you wanted & ta-da, there it was, permanently, for every character account wide.
These also weren`t (what I think are..) pointless town clothes. I just don`t get why they went this way, when players obviously want to fight in their Grenth etc outfits. £4.99 for those right now.

As for warcraft store, I don`t know anywhere near enough about it, not played since late Crapalysm, but the mounts, pets etc that are paid for items I`m flat out against. The game has a sub, nothing should cost extra for in game items, ever. They should just be stuck in game as achievement toys etc.

[Arlee]

I see this said a lot, but nothing about GW2 artistically stands out to me. Then again, I tend to not appreciate art without emotion. It could be because overall the game has failed to impress me as having any depth, so any given area kind of feels generic to me. I mean, a forest in GW2 is no different than a forest in Tera, or Rift, or WoW, it's just a forest. Maybe it has a few extra polygons, or higher resolution, or whatever, but at the core it's still just an uninspired forest. I actually probably have the least amount of 'landscape' screenshots of GW2 than I've taken in any game.

Just wanted to comment on this real quick. I had a similar opinion about GW2's graphics and never really understood why people would say it's gorgeous. Then I built myself a new computer and loaded it up on all highest settings and literally for a week I was constantly remark how amazing various things looked (I think I drove my guildies a bit crazy with it). For me it's a lot of the little touches, like how fire effects are done (most notably on the fiery book backpiece) or how amazing things look in the distance, and the water in this game looks really neat. There also seems to be a huge difference between highest setting and not quite highest, which is sort of surprising. I don't think I have played any MMO with such a drastic difference in graphics quality.

Obviously since beauty is in the eye the beholder, all of this is imo

[draykorinee]

I had the same effect going from my old laptop running wow at minimum and low res to near full at high res just made me appreciate every little nuance, I do think Gw2 looks good and it is well optomised compared to some, I ran it at higher settings than some older games with no issues.

[Zephyr Storm]

You used this quote in another thread. Maybe it's time you listen to your own advice?

Or maybe you should listen to it as well.

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you can make easily 10g an hr by just having some dedication to it :P

*cough cough* Bullshit *cough cough*

Unless of course you are talking about playing the TP, which not everyone knows how to do effectively. Otherwise, you're lying through your teeth.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Or maybe you should listen to it as well.

Well done, it only took a day for you to come up with a version of "I know you are, but what am I?"

It is fine to disagree with someones opinion, I believe. But ranting at someones opinion in one thread, while posting in another suggesting that someone shouldn't argue against a view that (presumably) you support because "it's just an opinion" is rank hypocracy. At least it is in my opinion.

As for the 10g figure, I have seen verified examples of people making 7g an hour. So 10g isn't beyond the bounds of possibility. I wouldn't personally describe it as "easy", because I suspect it requires a level of skill that most people don't have. But I am willing to be educated if someone knows better.

[draykorinee]

I suppose that IS the primary skill required for playing MMOs, though.[/FONT]

Ha yes, that is pretty apt.

[Dilbon]

Best MMO of 2013: none. Well ok I guess FFXIV but I didn't play that.

[Zephyr Storm]

Well done, it only took a day for you to come up with a version of "I know you are, but what am I?"

It is fine to disagree with someones opinion, I believe. But ranting at someones opinion in one thread, while posting in another suggesting that someone shouldn't argue against a view that (presumably) you support because "it's just an opinion" is rank hypocracy. At least it is in my opinion.

As for the 10g figure, I have seen verified examples of people making 7g an hour. So 10g isn't beyond the bounds of possibility. I wouldn't personally describe it as "easy", because I suspect it requires a level of skill that most people don't have. But I am willing to be educated if someone knows better.

It took me a day to respond because, you know, I have a job and life outside of these forums (something a lot of people on here seem to lack). I don't sit in front of a computer 24/7, clicking refresh repeatedly, waiting to see if some random person on the Internet replied to my post....like I'm sure you undoubtedly were doing.

And I do so appreciate you taking the time to hunt me down, single me out, and then continue to come after me when I post. Yes I am guilty of hypocrisy, just like every other human being alive. But I do believe I gave my opinion on the game and the award, something I am entitled to. And if you are butt hurt (no pun intended) over the comment I made in the thread about gays, then I'm sorry, but get over it. I could care less. Now, if we can move on and discuss the actual topic in this thread, that would be great. Otherwise, shut up.

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And by "skill" you mean, "The ability to tolerate boredom and tedium of the most extreme kind" because it probably means you're chain-running instances or something horrible.

I suppose that IS the primary skill required for playing MMOs, though.[/FONT]

Agreed. Or sitting in front of the TP for hours on end. Some people probably do find that fun. Most normal people, however, don't.

[Smitzelplix]

WoWs cash shop is not even remotely comparable to GW2. I dont like WoWs but its all cosmetic stuff i have no interest in whatsoever. (I did kinda like the bat mount but given that i have >150 other mounts its not something i am even remotely tempted with.) GW2 has stuff i'd consider almost mandatory and adds temporary stuff all the time too.

They're actually almost the exact same. The only thing WoW doesn't charge extra for currently is bank, inventory space, and character slots. I wish GW2 would fix up some of their cash shop stuff like giving more bank space for the current price and making the inventory expansions account bound.

Everything else that GW2 charges for though is something WoW also charges for; server transfers, name changes, appearance/gender changes, pets (which GW2 sells packs and WoW charges per pet), cosmetic armor. Then there's things like faction, race changes, and mounts which only WoW charges for because GW2 doesn't have factions or mounts; and GW2 doesn't charge for race changes because they don't want people changing their race yet, probably because of their personal story.

So yeah they are very comparable actually.

[Deleted]

They're actually almost the exact same. The only thing WoW doesn't charge extra for currently is bank, inventory space, and character slots. I wish GW2 would fix up some of their cash shop stuff like giving more bank space for the current price and making the inventory expansions account bound.

Everything else that GW2 charges for though is something WoW also charges for; server transfers, name changes, appearance/gender changes, pets (which GW2 sells packs and WoW charges per pet), cosmetic armor. Then there's things like faction, race changes, and mounts which only WoW charges for because GW2 doesn't have factions or mounts; and GW2 doesn't charge for race changes because they don't want people changing their race yet, probably because of their personal story.

So yeah they are very comparable actually.

My mistake your right. If you ignore all the differences they are almost identical.

[Smitzelplix]

My mistake your right. If you ignore all the differences they are almost identical.

So there's 3 things that WoW doesn't charge for but GW2 does and that means that they're not remotely comparable? How much do you think they actually differ? I pointed out plenty of things that they both do the same, so perhaps tell me more ways in which they differ.

[Lane]

Guild Wars did the clothing perfectly, any skin you bought went to an npc in game. You just perambulated there any time you want, on *any* character you wanted & ta-da, there it was, permanently, for every character account wide.

GW2's cosmetic system is one of the worst I've encountered. I don't know when people decided that ~$10 for a single character, one time use vanity item was okay, but apparently it's happened. (Tera's cash shop is the only one I've seen that was worse.) Coming from WoW it seems like a huge ripoff since literally every vanity item is account wide.

As for warcraft store, I don`t know anywhere near enough about it, not played since late Crapalysm, but the mounts, pets etc that are paid for items I`m flat out against. The game has a sub, nothing should cost extra for in game items, ever. They should just be stuck in game as achievement toys etc.

When Blizzard first debuted the store with the sparkle pony $25 sadly seemed like a deal. Given the amount of grinding and/or RNG involved in getting nice mounts in WoW to get one assuredly, that had the bonus of being account wide (before mounts were account wide by default), and served a double function of being both a land and air mount (before Azeroth flying), kind of sounded too good to be true. Things are different now, but no MMO has ever adjusted their prices to be lower. Hell, WoW is still considered the standard pricing model for just about everything.

Regardless, I completely agree with you. I am adamantly against a game having a subscription and a cash shop, but unfortunately enough gamers with enough disposable income are making it 'okay' for companies to have both.

So there's 3 things that WoW doesn't charge for but GW2 does and that means that they're not remotely comparable? How much do you think they actually differ? I pointed out plenty of things that they both do the same, so perhaps tell me more ways in which they differ.

WoW selling costumes is new to me so I took a look at their site. Currently they have 3 helmets for sale (that's the extent of their "costumes") and they are all account wide. There's Big Difference #1.

They currently have 6 mounts for sale and as far as I know that's been the extent of it since WotLK (Celestial Steed), so they've added 5 additional mounts over the past 4 years (almost one mount a year). I could be mistaken, but I don't believe any of them have ever been removed from the store since they were added, so none of this limited/one-time-only BS. Compared to GW2 which has a new series of temporary items every 2 weeks.

The pets are a little different since WoW added pet battles, they serve a function beyond being a companion. Also, while this may be subjective, I never notice pets in GW2 but I noticed them all the time in WoW. Once again, the pets are account bound. I suppose you could argue they are for GW2 as well, but considering you have to keep the pet in an individual character's inventory to use it kind of defeats the purpose.

There are currently 11 pets, I easily recognize 5 of them from WotLK, 5 of them from Cata, and 1 for MoP. Assuming each WoW expansion lasts ~2 years then that's almost one pet every 5 months. Course, you could argue that WoW isn't having to survive solely on box sales + store purchases and therefore doesn't need to introduce new items every 2 weeks, that's fine, I'm just pointing out the differences.

Additionally, something that GW2 does that drives me nuts (and makes me really glad I did not try to be a mini collector) are the forge pets. So you have to buy the mini pack off the store TWICE: once for the pets to keep and once to combine them all into the forge pet. That is completely insane. The fact that anyone is okay with that is a sad commentary.

[zed zebes]

GW2's gem shop is one of the least offensive in-game stores that I've seen. Also, while expensive at this point, there is a gold to gem conversion option. Eventually, there will probably be a wardrobe system when they have time to program it.

[Svifnymr]

I`d never thought of that before, the price of new character slots.
Just realised you`re paying around half the price of the game for one (assuming you bought the cheapest version), that definitely is too much. Just checked my old receipts, it was also £6.99 in Guild Wars, but they also did regular sales for those, Xunlei & skins etc.

They do have sales on stuff, I've gotten the character slots at 600 gems before.

Guild Wars did the clothing perfectly, any skin you bought went to an npc in game. You just perambulated there any time you want, on *any* character you wanted & ta-da, there it was, permanently, for every character account wide.

The achievement system works perfectly for that, porting out for heritage armor is irksome. I do agree that it should be an unlock though, but I mean, obviously as a consumer I agree we should get more value from our purchases.

These also weren`t (what I think are..) pointless town clothes. I just don`t get why they went this way, when players obviously want to fight in their Grenth etc outfits. £4.99 for those right now.

I think they've pulled back somewhat from town clothes, taking out a bunch of stuff to "trim the store" or whatever bunk. I wouldn't doubt if it's just going to be a costume brawl thing, but haven't seen anything official.

As for warcraft store, I don`t know anywhere near enough about it, not played since late Crapalysm, but the mounts, pets etc that are paid for items I`m flat out against. The game has a sub, nothing should cost extra for in game items, ever. They should just be stuck in game as achievement toys etc.

Pets for $10, Mounts for $25, helmets for $10. The account fees also seem very high to me (server transfer, renames, race change, faction change), but oh well.
Other than 1 pet that can be purchased for cash and sold for gold, I do not believe any of them have a method for obtaining via any in game activity.