Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[Grimskull22]

I don't see the problem, care to enlighten?

<-- fan of Isle of Thunder.

A more appropraite example would be the timeless isle, which is what THE ENITRE WORLD is based around in WoD.

The timeless isle is a lazy way to design content because they toss in nothing by grinds and RNG and slap the label "COMPELLING AND INTERESTING" on it despite the fact that a good chunk of people wouldn't have touched it if there wasn't catchup gear/ toys there after finishing their cloaks.

[Barkloud]

A more appropraite example would be the timeless isle, which is what THE ENITRE WORLD is based around in WoD.

The timeless isle is a lazy way to design content because they toss in nothing by grinds and RNG and slap the label "COMPELLING AND INTERESTING" on it despite the fact that a good chunk of people wouldn't have touched it if there wasn't catchup gear/ toys there after finishing their cloaks.

I am hoping it is like leveling in GW2, which I found pretty fun.

[Rabblexthree]

You cannot really Blame people for being confused.

Alex A says likely flying is gone

Bashiok explains why it is a good thing

Bashiok comes back and states flying will most likely be back after 6.1

Tom Chilton says flying is most likely gone

That leads us to today. Where we still do not know. I think a change of this magnitude warrants a dev speak.

The only definitive thing I remember seeing about flying was not until 6.1. Every other thing I saw about it was torn apart and misconstrued based on who was using it for their side of the argument.

[Anzaman]

A more appropraite example would be the timeless isle, which is what THE ENITRE WORLD is based around in WoD.

I don't see any other aspects of Timeless Isle in Draenor expect rare mobs and "puzzles".

The rest seems like well... normal zones, with max level content spots.

[Grimskull22]

I am hoping it is like leveling in GW2, which I found pretty fun.

But it's not! in no way!

The only similarities I've gathered from beta are the bonus objectives, and that's it!

Outside of that, it's the same kill x collect y WITHOUT quest-text or any real reason to do it.

At max level, it's a straight grind, the archaeology involves jumping puzzles, and professions are weirdly over-complicated now. Dailies have a 24hour reset timer (*IE : I do my dailies at 5pm tuesday, they don't reset until 5pm Wednesday for reasons.)

The entire basis of my, and MANY other peoples arguements are for garunteed flight in 6.1 AFTER a few months have passed which will be AMPLE time for people to see a lot of the 6.0 content. Have it disabled in the rest of tanaan and say "anti air guns did it" and that'll make perfect sense because that's the main iron horde stronghold!

We do not want flight at launch or while leveling, but do want it at SOME POINT BEFORE 6.4!


That is all.

[Anzaman]

I am hoping it is like leveling in GW2, which I found pretty fun.

Only thing, which I hated about Guild Wars II leveling, is the fact that it felt mandatory to progress professions to keep up with the zone levels. Not sure if this has changed since release, tho.

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We do not want flight at launch or while leveling, but do want it at SOME POINT BEFORE 6.4!

And even as a anti-flier, you've my support for returning flying at some point of the expansion.

[Nayaga]

I don't see the problem, care to enlighten?

<-- fan of Isle of Thunder.

It's a complete ghost town on my server

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The only definitive thing I remember seeing about flying was not until 6.1. Every other thing I saw about it was torn apart and misconstrued based on who was using it for their side of the argument.

Can't agree with you on that. Tim Chilton was very clear on no flying

[Anzaman]

It's a complete ghost town on my server

Two major patches old content, not really surprising.

[Barkloud]

Only thing, which I hated about Guild Wars II leveling, is the fact that it felt mandatory to progress professions to keep up with the zone levels. Not sure if this has changed since release, tho.

I forgot about that. i did not care for their crafting system. The xp bonuses were so huge you kind of had to craft.

[quras]

I don't see the problem, care to enlighten?

<-- fan of Isle of Thunder.

My problem with those areas were they held interest for about a week, then they we're finished. IT's just not lasting content and what was there for me wasn't all that good.

TI-IoT were not all that great when we got them for free, much less being asked to give up flying for some undetermined amount of time and pay $50 for it.

From beta it's just not worth it. Removing flying at max level does not help the content.

You still have to get to those quest areas and unless I'm mistaken, every single gamer in wow is on the ground when they are completing quests.

If I were to debate for change in wow it would be create better quests with bonuses to them. TBC and WoTLK did well and had flying but they also had much better questing. blizzard seems to be slacking off at that these days as beta really is just more of the same old same old we have been getting since cataclysm. It's not all that interesting and simply will not hold you at max level with no flying so you can run through the same worthless mobs again and again.

There is nothing wrong with getting to the quest area faster. Simply design quests where flying is simply not the advantage of quest bombing everything. No boss, end quest objective should be just waiting to be grabbed and not have to do something first.

blizzard poor questing design the past 2 expansions is the problem, not flying at max level. I doubt there is a single quest in game that couldn't be tweaked to allow flying at max level and still hold it's original intent. Even jumping puzzle can be created and not require the removal of flying from the whole world.

I'm telling you, flying is the scapegoat for blizzard lack of drive to anything but extending content beyond it's normal life cycle. Slow content consumption by any means no matter how much it screws over the gamer.

[Rabblexthree]

It's a complete ghost town on my server

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Can't agree with you on that. Tim Chilton was very clear on no flying

I don't think he did. I am pretty sure what he said was one of the things debated like what the meaning of "is" is.

[pankind]

Right, because Blizzard is going to volunteer that information, right? Because Blizzard is your friend and they tell you everything right? Blizzard wouldn't mislead you. Why would the developers of a game that grosses over a billion dollars annually not want to be fully honest with everybody?

Its not like they have been losing 8,800 subscribers a day for the entire 2nd quarter of 2014, oh wait.... whoops..... They did lose 8,800 subs a day.... They have abandoned their latest expansion and stopped providing new content 50% through the expansion...... They have removed many of the features for the new expansion they bragged about at Blizzcon.... They have made changes to the game such as removing flying that have turned player against player in a vicious rage forum war.....

I guess there are those reasons they do not share information about why people are leaving this game by the hundreds of thousands.

If sub loss was due to no-fly, they wouldn't have designed an entire continent with tier content that only works as no-fly. They'd just go back to the tier islands format.

The real fact you're glossing over is that WoW is still profitable. Nobody, especially not anyone at blizzard, cares about these "doom and gloom, wow is dying" posts.

They don't give a crap about 8,800 subs a day.

Sorry.

[Teetster]

Yeah I bet they do. That's $100K in monthly revenue being lost per day, give or take. Yeah, maybe it seems small, but do that for 90 days straight and that's a huge amount of lost revenue.

Lots of people have quit over this already. Just wait til it hits live. The 2nd quarter after WoD is released will show a huge drop from the launch of WoD subs. The hardcode 10% who wouldn't quit ever will love the "hardcoreness" of no flying. The vast majority who are time limited or casual will hate it and some will leave until Blizzard fixes it. If that doesn't do it, going back to Cataclysm healing and harder heroics will do it. We already know what happens when Blizzard unleashes that upon the game - millions of people quit.

WoD is going to be a disaster. I've been watching this thing unfold in slow motion for almost a year now. It is clear as day to me, and it must be to Blizzard as well. They have a lot better metrics on this and they must read the fan sites and forums. Someone with real pull in the company is forcing this turd through and will lose his or her career over it.

[dimmuwow]

Maybe only at the final of the xpac, until they have content to offer i don't think so

[Perkunas]

Why has this guy (Barkloud) not been infracted yet?

This entire thread is filled with fighting and trolling. There's very little discussion and the mods would be better served to just lock it up because nobody wants to be civil.

[rebecca191]

Yeah I bet they do. That's $100K in monthly revenue being lost per day, give or take. Yeah, maybe it seems small, but do that for 90 days straight and that's a huge amount of lost revenue.

Lots of people have quit over this already. Just wait til it hits live. The 2nd quarter after WoD is released will show a huge drop from the launch of WoD subs. The hardcode 10% who wouldn't quit ever will love the "hardcoreness" of no flying. The vast majority who are time limited or casual will hate it and some will leave until Blizzard fixes it. If that doesn't do it, going back to Cataclysm healing and harder heroics will do it. We already know what happens when Blizzard unleashes that upon the game - millions of people quit.

WoD is going to be a disaster. I've been watching this thing unfold in slow motion for almost a year now. It is clear as day to me, and it must be to Blizzard as well. They have a lot better metrics on this and they must read the fan sites and forums. Someone with real pull in the company is forcing this turd through and will lose his or her career over it.

I feel like the numbers at launch will be decent but drop pretty fast.... if I were made of money I'd level to 100, do the anniversary stuff (only thing that interests me, sadly...) then quit but $65 would be a waste since I am not made of money.

[Maneo]

I feel like the numbers at launch will be decent but drop pretty fast.... if I were made of money I'd level to 100, do the anniversary stuff (only thing that interests me, sadly...) then quit but $65 would be a waste since I am not made of money.

Personally I think what will happen is we will have a slight spike at WoD release. Then come a month or so after 6.1 is released w/out flight WoW will be down to less then 5 million subs.

I have kinda been thinking about doing what you would do if you have the money, but I don't find it very likely.

Just if flight did return and I came back I would hate to not have the anniversary stuff and Blizzcon stuff etc etc.

[rebecca191]

Personally I think what will happen is we will have a slight spike at WoD release. Then come a month or so after 6.1 is released w/out flight WoW will be down to less then 5 million subs.

I have kinda been thinking about doing what you would do if you have the money, but I don't find it very likely.

Yeah, the only way I see myself doing it is if I had enough reward points/gift cards earned at some store to grab the game for basically free. I'd basically never go to Draenor though, LFD and pet battles all the way. So, probably not. I am nostalgic about MC since it was my first raid and 40 people from LFR would be a pretty good replica of what the original MC felt like, lol. I really wish it were a lv 90 event so I could just resub for one month.

[Mafic]

Yeah I bet they do. That's $100K in monthly revenue being lost per day, give or take. Yeah, maybe it seems small, but do that for 90 days straight and that's a huge amount of lost revenue.

Lots of people have quit over this already. Just wait til it hits live. The 2nd quarter after WoD is released will show a huge drop from the launch of WoD subs. The hardcode 10% who wouldn't quit ever will love the "hardcoreness" of no flying. The vast majority who are time limited or casual will hate it and some will leave until Blizzard fixes it. If that doesn't do it, going back to Cataclysm healing and harder heroics will do it. We already know what happens when Blizzard unleashes that upon the game - millions of people quit.

WoD is going to be a disaster. I've been watching this thing unfold in slow motion for almost a year now. It is clear as day to me, and it must be to Blizzard as well. They have a lot better metrics on this and they must read the fan sites and forums. Someone with real pull in the company is forcing this turd through and will lose his or her career over it.

WoD is way too hardcore. The no flying stance reinforces this. Good post.

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It's easy for him to say. He wasn't even around at that point. He sure likes to bash Vanilla and TBC.

GC had nothing to do with Vanilla, BC or WotLk design. He was hired long after the wheels were in motion.

I am glad GC is gone.

[Barkloud]

Why has this guy (Barkloud) not been infracted yet?

For what???