Putin puts troops in western Russia on alert in drill 1.1

[fumblz]

US ground troops to train in Ukraine


Not sure how this is going to interact with the nascent ceasefire. Could be an attempt to scuttle it, or reassurance / negotiating support for the Kiev government in what will hopefully be the talks happening soon.

My guess is that the US no longer cares about any agreement, save MAD. Russia burned most of their bridges with this Ukraine and crimea incident, and if they wont adhere to any agreement made in the past... I doubt washington will do the same.

[Uzkin]

Yeah, the Mistral announcement by France is probably just something to appease the US/NATO. Russia would be the winner in France breaking the deal.

[fumblz]

I think this is a reaction to the impending ceasefire that can be read multiple ways. Note that the French are carefully not cancelling the deal, at least not yet, just delaying it for a month. On the one hand, it can be seen as a carrot for the Russians, "stick to the ceasefire and you get your ships". On the other hand, it can also be seen as France trying to jump on the 'anti-Russia' bandwagon at the absolute last minute. Setting things up so that, a year or five down the road, the French government can say, "Oh, yeah, we were totally willing to lose billions to keep Russia in line". (All while confident they won't have to actually pay that particular piper.) Or maybe it's something else, or both.

ehh, it seems like the carrot on the stick to me. Not to mention that if Russia wont fall for it, they can most likely cover any losses by selling to EU/NATO (there was talks about have the EU pay the fines as well). That way they have a win win scenario, they get to have their cake and eat it too.

[Ulmita]

No one in Russia gives a flack about the mistrals. That deal was singed on a different administration and lets say the truth, they are nothing wow. Russia would benefit more with aircraft carriers than helicopter carriers.

[Deleted]

I live in Romania, a former communist state which neighbors Ukraine. I don't know shit about politics but do you think this conflict could affect my country? I really don't care about Ukraine or who is right or wrong in all this but I don't want my country and therefore also myself to be dragged to a pointless conflict from which I have nothing to gain. The only way see them provoking us is if they attack Moldova for Transnistria...

[Cybran]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...oscow-ilovaysk

Bloodied, dirty and stinking, the Ukrainian soldiers who passed through the town of Komsomolske on Saturday morning made for a sorry sight. But they were the lucky ones, who had managed to escape alive from an assault they say involved regular units of the Russian army.

Having fled from encirclement in the town of Ilovaysk, their column of 70 armoured vehicles and hundreds of Ukrainian soldiers had been trapped in an ambush and shelled, according to one soldier. "Our vehicles were colliding with one another and our tracks were running over our own fighters," said Taras Samchuk, 28, whose 51st brigade was one of the units surrounded in Ilovaysk.

Many died, some were captured, and around 100 soldiers had managed to survive, often "with legs broken or smashed, with shrapnel in our hands, legs, bodies, with smashed teeth and broken noses", he said.

[Deleted]

Anyone remember this? http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/12/op...anted=all&_r=0

[Crispin]

lol, ISIS deinately got some balls, while the west and Russia are checking eachother out, they go ahead and declare war on both.

[Kjalar]

The politicians are afraid of Russia enacting economical sanctions on Finland, which would affect our economy, which in turn would be blamed on the politicians. Seriously, don't you have the faintest of idea on how politics work? I'm not typing this all out in all of my posts since frankly, I expect people to have some actual insight on the subjects they engage in arguments about. Maybe I shouldn't expect such high standards from online conversation.

First of all, you shouldn't expect anything good or even remotely okay from online conversations. Regular standards don't apply to these.

Now, after we've storted this out, let's talk about geopolitics: don't you think that what you've said goes both ways?

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lol, ISIS deinately got some balls, while the west and Russia are checking eachother out, they go ahead and declare war on both.

I actually like that. Those fuckers can become something that will make Russia, EU and US remember we can still be partners and work together to achieve some common goals.

[Cybran]

Those fuckers can become something that will make Russia, EU and US remember we can still be partners and work together to achieve some common goals.

The USA and EU are the ones that armed and funded them via Saudi Arabia and Qatar.

[Crispin]

I agree Kjalar, but I'm afraid that they arent enough of a threat to move focus away from Ukraine.

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The USA and EU are the ones that armed and funded them via Saudi Arabia and Qatar.

I'd love to see some solid evidence of this.

[ringpriest]

A referendum is generally asking the opinion of the ENTIRE population with the right to vote, not just that of a minority in a specific territory. I doubt the majority of the Ukrainian population would vote for independence of the Eastern Ukraine. This is beyond retarded and has nothing to do with the international laws.

Um, Scottish independence referendum, 2014,

Under the terms of the 2010 Draft Bill, the following people would be entitled to vote in the referendum:[19]

British citizens who are resident in Scotland;
citizens of the 52 other Commonwealth countries who are resident in Scotland;
citizens of the 27 other European Union countries who are resident in Scotland;
members of the House of Lords who are resident in Scotland;
Service/Crown personnel serving in the UK or overseas in the British Armed Forces or with Her Majesty's Government who are registered to vote in Scotland.

[Jackmoves]

Furthermore, the referendum took place in a time when Ukraine didn't have legitimate central leadership from the Crimean point of view. Their democratically chosen president had been overthrown in a coup. Since the power structure referred to in the constitution didn't exist any more the constitution, strictly speaking, was no longer valid either. As an autonomic republic Crimea was then free to act on its own. Once the new president got elected, they also established a new constitution. The time between the coup and the election of the new president was, again strictly speaking, a time of anarchy without valid constitution. Coups can and do split countries, it is the price one may have to pay.

Doesn't matter at all if it was consititutional or not, it was unconsititutional but even if you disregard that it's not a legit referendum.

Why?

Simple, Russias annexation of Crimea is a violation of Ukraines territorial integrity, thats against international law, and that was declared in the 1970 principles of international law. Within that context the referendum is nullified, there is a reason for why Putin refused to admit that the little green men were Russian troops until after the annexation(referendum) was done and over with.

Anything that comes after russia putting boots on the ground means zero, nada, nill.

As it stands right now, in the eyes of internanational law, Crimea is under occupation by Russia.

[Shalcker]

As it stands right now, in the eyes of internanational law, Crimea is under occupation by Russia.

And Kosovo is under occupation by NATO, yeah, yeah.

[Ulmita]

lol, ISIS deinately got some balls, while the west and Russia are checking eachother out, they go ahead and declare war on both.

The usage of the word "west" in your sentence is very generic and full of fallacy as it assumes that every western country has a problem with Russia. Besides the ones that are barking (aka US/UK and Baltic) i think most don't have an issue with them =)

[Marcellus1986]

And Kosovo is under occupation by NATO, yeah, yeah.

So you'd rather have them be victims of genocide at the hands of the Serbs?

[Tierbook]

So you'd rather have them be victims of genocide at the hands of the Serbs?

Well the pro-Putin fact was blaming America for breaking up the Koreas by helping out the South so it seems logical that they think that way.

[Deleted]

And Kosovo is under occupation by NATO, yeah, yeah.

You are missing the genocide part, it makes all difference as the 1948 un convention. Cppcg happens to have prevention in its name saying that you have to act to prevent it if possible. So yeah apples and pears if you follow international law and its one of the strongest points that came out from ww2.

[Cybran]

So you'd rather have them be victims of genocide at the hands of the Serbs?

There was no genocide in kosovo. The UN court decided that there was no targeted ethnic cleansing. All of the reported mass graves were empty. More civilians died in Ukraine in the last 3 months due to kiev shells than in over 2 years in kosovo.

The genocide claim was a lie just like the WMDs in Iraq.

[Morry]

lol, ISIS deinately got some balls, while the west and Russia are checking eachother out, they go ahead and declare war on both.

Leader of Chechnya already made a very unhappy statement about this. Apparantly he don't want his republic to be "liberated".

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Not to mention that if Russia wont fall for it, they can most likely cover any losses by selling to EU/NATO (there was talks about have the EU pay the fines as well). That way they have a win win scenario, they get to have their cake and eat it too.

As far as I know half of the ship was produced in St. Petersburg so France would need to get it somehow.