Prot: Our Mastery, does it suck?

[Deleted]

Does our Mastery, Critical Block, suck? I mean, mastery doesnt affect the block value but only the chance to block? So basically thats 30 % damage mitigation + if critically 60 %. If you consider parry, isnt that 100 % damage mitigation? Cant really figure it out tbh. Warrior tanks just seems outdated compared to DKs, Palas and Monks atm. Palas can even block magic -.- We got 0 self sustain or anything... Kinda meh... But atleast we are not Druids xD

To me, Crit just seems more attractive but I might be wrong...

Also, where did all the good warrior tank sites go ?

[Shelly]

Does our Mastery, Critical Block, suck? I mean, mastery doesnt affect the block value but only the chance to block? So basically thats 30 % damage mitigation + if critically 60 %. If you consider parry, isnt that 100 % damage mitigation? Cant really figure it out tbh. Warrior tanks just seems outdated compared to DKs, Palas and Monks atm. Palas can even block magic -.- We got 0 self sustain or anything... Kinda meh... But atleast we are not Druids xD

To me, Crit just seems more attractive but I might be wrong...

Also, where did all the good warrior tank sites go ?

Well you could always go haste/multistrike and hope to have a rolling HoT build.

Anyway, it's not too hard to build a crit set and a mastery set. Once you do you'll quickly figure out that our mastery is pretty darn good, we are amazing at removing tons of physical damage chance. Where it stinks is we get wrecked by too much magic damage, hopefully the boost to shield barrier is helping with this.

[Valech]

Comparing block and parry is not very helpful, since for warriors the passive mitigation is a two roll system. First the system checks if you dodge or parry a physical hit, and if you do not, it checks wheather you block it. Adding Mastery increases the chances for a third, warrior-only roll: IF you block, you may critically block.

In the end "attractiveness", "figuring out" and "feeling" is all without meaning, since it boils down to raw maths. If you go for crit, you will do little more damage, take little less damage and take little less damage over all. If you go Mastery, you will deal little less damage, take little more damage over all and take less spiky damage, which will make things smoother for your healers. If you cannot grasp the math behind that (like me) just roll with it and keep yourself informed and knowledgeable.

Btw, last time I checked there were two Protwarriors raiding highend and one picked the mastery route and the other the crit route. So arguments are strong on both sides.

Regarding the comparison between other classes: It is true, that we lack a potent self sustain in form of healing. Then again, we get flat out reduction of damage from ALL sources (including magic) through our defensive stance, just by standing there and doing nothing. People like to forget that. All our cooldowns are flat % and not either magic or physical. Warrior tanks are in a good spot atm.

[Deleted]

Well... Don't you look for both mastery AND crit on item anyway?

[Valech]

Well... Don't you look for both mastery AND crit on item anyway?

you cannot fill every slot with an item, that has both. But there are Items with crit for each slot and items with mastery for each slot. And you´ll have to decide what you aim for.

[Ealyssa]

Comparing block and parry is not very helpful, since for warriors the passive mitigation is a two roll system. First the system checks if you dodge or parry a physical hit, and if you do not, it checks wheather you block it.

What ???? Wasn't it a one roll system back at the unhitable era ? Was it changed ?

Pretty sure that whole hit system is a one roll with your avoid + block chance + normal hit, with a second roll if you block for crit block in the warrior's case.

[Valech]

What ???? Wasn't it a one roll system back at the unhitable era ? Was it changed ?

Pretty sure that whole hit system is a one roll with your avoid + block chance + normal hit, with a second roll if you block for crit block in the warrior's case.

pretty sure that isnt the case anymore since ages.

Perhaps someone could give a definite answer here, before I tell bullshit. Meanwhile, I will google it.

[Yaargh]

Was one roll during Cataclysm, changed to two roll for MoP.

[Deleted]

Remember, you're a warrior, you will have 100% block chance most of the time, so that critical block really will pay off.
As said previously, mastery is a better stat for smoothness so for things like high end progression. Otherwise you can go crit first.
I personally go crit > master > vers

[Gliff]

Does it suck? No.
Is Crit better? Probably.

[Deleted]

Remember, you're a warrior, you will have 100% block chance most of the time, so that critical block really will pay off.
As said previously, mastery is a better stat for smoothness so for things like high end progression. Otherwise you can go crit first.
I personally go crit > master > vers

having 100 % blockchance most of the time? Thats kinda overstated. Its more like, you will have 50 % uptime only in a lot of fight, since you tank something all fight long.

To say mastery is for smoother dmg ist kinda retarded. You choose a stat that will help you take less dmg in the phases where you allready take less anyway (while sblock is up), but have almost no use in the time between you sblocks, where ur most vulnerable. What the heck is smooth about gettin really low dmg for 12 sek and then get your ass kicked for the next 12 seconds??? Its not like krit will totally smooth out the dmg between sblocks, no way, but at least it helps a bit, and even overall dmg ist less.

So please stop saying mastery helps you to take smooth damage, because that is absolutely NOT true.

[Deleted]

You choose a stat that will help you take less dmg in the phases where you allready take less anyway (while sblock is up), but have almost no use in the time between you sblocks, where ur most vulnerable.

Speaking on things that are NOT true, why do people insist on repeating this nonsense? It is like people run around in binary mode where mastery only works if you have 100% block chance, and rest of the time it just stops working.

Mastery continues to increase your block / crit block and you will have more of a chance to block than parry. Yes it will mitigate less damage than parry but you will block more often, and thus it indeed smooths out the damage.

[Valech]

having 100 % blockchance most of the time? Thats kinda overstated. Its more like, you will have 50 % uptime only in a lot of fight, since you tank something all fight long.

To say mastery is for smoother dmg ist kinda retarded. You choose a stat that will help you take less dmg in the phases where you allready take less anyway (while sblock is up), but have almost no use in the time between you sblocks, where ur most vulnerable. What the heck is smooth about gettin really low dmg for 12 sek and then get your ass kicked for the next 12 seconds??? Its not like krit will totally smooth out the dmg between sblocks, no way, but at least it helps a bit, and even overall dmg ist less.

So please stop saying mastery helps you to take smooth damage, because that is absolutely NOT true.

Numbers do not lie. Look up Thock maloree index.

[Deleted]

Numbers do not lie. Look up Thock maloree index.

They dont. But TMI is not everything.

It does considers both, how often you drop in health, and how hard you drop.

So in theory, just for you to understand what im trying to say. If you would take 0 dmg while sblock is up 12sek, and then get 1 hit droping you to 1 % health while sblock is down 12sek. This would still be a better TMI then if you drop to 80 % every 3 second over the period of 24 seconds.

And now decide what would you rather want, take no dmg at all and suddenly randomly drop to 1 % several times of the fight, or take constantly 20 % every few seconds.....

So just because TMI says ist smoother, it will not necessarily grand you the best chances to survive.

Btw. i have not calculated this, you may need to change 20% every 3 seconds to 30 % every 2 seconds to make my statement true, but i think you see what i m trying to say.

[Valech]

I think practically it narrows down to what kind of damage your healers are able to manage. if you have some powerhouses in your back, they will barely care about spikes.

[Deleted]

Speaking on things that are NOT true, why do people insist on repeating this nonsense? It is like people run around in binary mode where mastery only works if you have 100% block chance, and rest of the time it just stops working.

Mastery continues to increase your block / crit block and you will have more of a chance to block than parry. Yes it will mitigate less damage than parry but you will block more often, and thus it indeed smooths out the damage.

Have you ever compared the amount of additional blockchance you get out of full mastery gear to the amount of parry you get from full krit gear? Not? Well do it and then comeback and tell me that my statement "mastery has almost no use between your sblocks" isn t true. But let me state it like this, in between sblocks, mastery has almost no value compared to krit.

[Shieldarm]

Personally, I'm a fan of Mastery in the crit v mastery debate. My reasoning, is because of smoothness. I've healed before, and one thing I took into account,is the damage my tank is taking. The crit will take less damage overall, while being slightly more spike prone. Mastery will take a bit more, but smoother. And even if it's a bit more damage, smooth damage is way easier to heal than spikes.

Also, for the guy saying Mastery is useless outside of shield block, learn how your class and abilities work, please. Crit will increase your parry chance, and rage gen. Mastery will increase your block chance, critical block chance, and attack power. There's a 6 second window between Block fading and when you can get it back up, not 12. Mastery though, will result in stronger and more reliable shield barriers during that window. Crit will have a chance to allow more barriers in that window. And even then, take into consideration what aerlins said. The difference between a crit build and mastery build, as far as crit/parry chance is definitely noteworthy, but it is not not huge. Because of that, a crit build cannot reliably have you take less damage, particularly against magic. It only has the chance to let you take less.

[Breccia]

Question: doesn't our Mastery boost our Attack Power, which in turn, boosts Shield Barrier?

[Deleted]

Personally, I'm a fan of Mastery in the crit v mastery debate. My reasoning, is because of smoothness. I've healed before, and one thing I took into account,is the damage my tank is taking

I don t think your able to notice a difference between mastery and krit warrior if your not totally into healing both, a mastery and a krit warrior at the exact same skilllevel, with the exact same healsetup. So no way you can argue this way.

There's a 6 second window between Block fading and when you can get it back up, not 12.

Dude, don t get me wrong, but stfu if you know shit. You can handle it 6 sek up 6 sek down or 12 sek up 12 sek down, but not 12 sek up 6 sek down in the long run.

Also, for the guy saying Mastery is useless outside of shield block, learn how your class and abilities work, please.

And even then, take into consideration what aerlins said.

Dude im aerlins, and i m the guy saying mastery is (almost) useless outside of shieldblock. So why the fuck are you arguing against me, and then tell me i should take in consideration what i have said?

[HockeyVG]

Question: doesn't our Mastery boost our Attack Power, which in turn, boosts Shield Barrier?

It's almost a non-factor since Sbar is so little in our overall mitigation. Consider it a tiny bonus, but it doesn't change much.