Affliction nerf transperancy

[whackit]

Hi Affliction Warlocks. Thanks for the posts and feedback so far. I'd like to talk a bit about the change to Malefic Grasp. In general, we agree that communication is warranted since we changed/nerfed a widely taken talent.

Malefic Grasp is very powerful on live. With the current state of Affliction, the talent is taken on virtually every situation in Nighthold, from single-target to sustained multi-target boss fights. There are things about Affliction that we’re not entirely happy with, many of which the community has echoed, and the current feel of Affliction being a single-target spec that focuses its damage into one target rather than spreads its damage out over many targets more evenly, is generally one of them. Malefic Grasp at a high tuning value is a heavy contributor to that. It’s not ideal that even on a sustained multi-target fight right now, Malefic Grasp wins out over Writhe in Agony on the same row, when at first glance Writhe in Agony looks like it should be the go-to talent for sustained multi-target since its benefit scales up uniformly per additional target whereas Malefic Grasp reads as a single-target talent.

Separately, we want to allow Haunt to be a viable Soul Shard spender talent. We’ve heard this from players and also want a Soul Shard spender other than Unstable Affliction in single-target situations. Ways to make Haunt as a Soul Shard spender competitive with a Malefic Grasp at the live value of 70% include dramatically increasing its instant nuke damage, drastically increasing its damage bonus %, or reducing its cooldown further – none of which would feel right on Affliction for a variety of reasons.

Lastly, Affliction’s first talent tier is a really high-power talent tier compared to most talent tiers we have, with Malefic Grasp being over a 20% DPS increase as a single talent. Generally, we aim for talent tiers to be more in the 5-10% range. Very high values can both have distortive effects on the spec and make it hard to balance other talents on the same tier.

That all said, in the next PTR patch, changes you should see are:
All Affliction damage done increased by 15%
Malefic Grasp will go down to a +25% damage increase (down from +70% on live)
Writhe in Agony will be reduced to increase Agony’s max stacks by +5 (down from +10 on live)
Haunt will stay as it currently is on PTR

Based on our numbers, 1) this 15% damage buff negates the 70%->25% reduction to Malefic Grasp, coming out as neutral change DPS-wise for Affliction Warlocks using Malefic Grasp going from 7.2->7.2.5 and 2) brings the relative balance of the Level 15 talent tier much closer to each other. As usual, the numbers may change during PTR according to further playtesting and feedback.

As a footnote, the most recent PTR patch with the current reduction to Malefic Grasp from 70%->40% that came with no other explanation or indication that further changes (compensatory buffs to the baseline spec, further relevant talent adjustments) were coming wasn’t ideal and we’ll try to be more mindful of that in future PTR cycles.


UPDATE on soul effigy;

We hear you all on Soul Effigy. We’re going to remove it in the next PTR patch. It’s concerning when the community sentiment towards a talent isn’t that it’s overpowered or underpowered, but that everyone is terrified they’re going to have to play that way if it becomes strong.

It should be understandable how the original concept of Soul Effigy would seem fun in theory, despite it clearly not working out in practice. As an Affliction Warlock, I'm very happy to walk into a 2-target boss fight. At a basic level, you know you're going to get double value out of your DoTs. Walking into a 1-target fight with Soul Effigy just doesn't feel nearly the same. Mechanically, the gameplay of the two situations is very similar, but in the end Soul Effigy doesn't play out well. Could be any of a number of actors - the reduced damage transfer, feeling like the effigy is just there for increased soul shard generation, the usability issues, or the unnaturalness of it as a concept.

Anyways, it’s gone. Replacement talent to come.


UPDATE on tier20;

The Tier 20 set bonus for Affliction is changing soon. It won’t be so focused on Drain Soul.

[Sunlighthell]

All posts from this thread is gone? Brilliant.

[Deleted]

Holy shit, destruction changes are not near enough so far to make me wanna stay destruction when affliction basically is getting way more than destruction. And with MG and soul effegy nerfed and removed - it might actually turn out to be an enjoyable spec!

[whackit]

All posts from this thread is gone? Brilliant.

Tried to update the post, ended up being deleted due to unknown reasons.

[Deleted]

T20 being changed? Soul Effigy removed? 15% buff across the board? Hype.

[Daeth]

So this means that coming back as demo/destro would be a bad idea and I need to continue to farm affi?

[skitzin]

I must say I like that they have responded to some concerns regarding the upcoming changes.

I still feel like Haunt might need further tweaking to really make it a choice. Additionally, I would like to know does WiA change mean that it's the same damage as 20 stacks over 15 stacks now? Or is then an overall reduction in WiA?

[Demonidze]

wow be the sounds of it they actually want to fix affli ! #hype

[Deleted]

So this means that coming back as demo/destro would be a bad idea and I need to continue to farm affi?

Sure looks this way atm, ofc its hard to predict the future, but the destro changes are nothing compared to what Affliction got so far. Destro still have horrible horrible bad shitty talents that make no sense, where as affliction basicly got quality of life updates and shitty talents reworked & removed.

Meanwhile destruction gets eradication increase 3% and 1 second more uptime and reverse entropy 35% mana back and 5% increase.... So lackluster I could cry. Meanwhile maintenenence talents still rule supreme on destro even though everyone _HATES_ ELT. And I havent even begun talking about Fire and brimstone which should be toggleable and shadowburn should be baseline...

There are so many things wrong with destro I can't see how they will fix them all. Even though they claimed 7.2.5 especially would take a look at destruction, affliction got way way more attention.

[Ooshraxa]

Looking good, especially the reasoning behind the removal of Soul Effigy. Keep up the communication, it's really great to see.

[farza]

This is the first time i see some answers from blizz.
Glad to see they are moving in right direction.

[Darsey]

Soul Effigy is fun and give us a way to not entierly lose dps when moving cause we can add dots on it that otherwis won't be casted.
The only problem I have with SE is that it basicly eat up my focus bar because it always has to be in focus so I could recast agony on it.
I think that people who did not like it, tried to keep more then agony on the effigy and this is actually a dps lose or a wash compared to just using it as a soul generator that does some damage as a bonus.

[Deleted]

Soul Effigy is fun

That's, like, your opinion, man. Honestly I had more fun than Effigy that one day when I broke my dick and had to go to ER.

[Zaroch]

You forgot to add that Soul Conduit isn't getting nerfed to 12%
He said: "Soul Conduit should be unchanged for Affliction. Latest patch notes should reflect that."

[Gnomognomo]

Hi Affliction Warlocks. Thanks for the posts and feedback so far. I'd like to talk a bit about the change to Malefic Grasp. In general, we agree that communication is warranted since we changed/nerfed a widely taken talent.

Malefic Grasp is very powerful on live. With the current state of Affliction, the talent is taken on virtually every situation in Nighthold, from single-target to sustained multi-target boss fights. There are things about Affliction that we’re not entirely happy with, many of which the community has echoed, and the current feel of Affliction being a single-target spec that focuses its damage into one target rather than spreads its damage out over many targets more evenly, is generally one of them. Malefic Grasp at a high tuning value is a heavy contributor to that. It’s not ideal that even on a sustained multi-target fight right now, Malefic Grasp wins out over Writhe in Agony on the same row, when at first glance Writhe in Agony looks like it should be the go-to talent for sustained multi-target since its benefit scales up uniformly per additional target whereas Malefic Grasp reads as a single-target talent.

Separately, we want to allow Haunt to be a viable Soul Shard spender talent. We’ve heard this from players and also want a Soul Shard spender other than Unstable Affliction in single-target situations. Ways to make Haunt as a Soul Shard spender competitive with a Malefic Grasp at the live value of 70% include dramatically increasing its instant nuke damage, drastically increasing its damage bonus %, or reducing its cooldown further – none of which would feel right on Affliction for a variety of reasons.

Lastly, Affliction’s first talent tier is a really high-power talent tier compared to most talent tiers we have, with Malefic Grasp being over a 20% DPS increase as a single talent. Generally, we aim for talent tiers to be more in the 5-10% range. Very high values can both have distortive effects on the spec and make it hard to balance other talents on the same tier.

That all said, in the next PTR patch, changes you should see are:
All Affliction damage done increased by 15%
Malefic Grasp will go down to a +25% damage increase (down from +70% on live)
Writhe in Agony will be reduced to increase Agony’s max stacks by +5 (down from +10 on live)
Haunt will stay as it currently is on PTR

Based on our numbers, 1) this 15% damage buff negates the 70%->25% reduction to Malefic Grasp, coming out as neutral change DPS-wise for Affliction Warlocks using Malefic Grasp going from 7.2->7.2.5 and 2) brings the relative balance of the Level 15 talent tier much closer to each other. As usual, the numbers may change during PTR according to further playtesting and feedback.

As a footnote, the most recent PTR patch with the current reduction to Malefic Grasp from 70%->40% that came with no other explanation or indication that further changes (compensatory buffs to the baseline spec, further relevant talent adjustments) were coming wasn’t ideal and we’ll try to be more mindful of that in future PTR cycles.


UPDATE on soul effigy;

We hear you all on Soul Effigy. We’re going to remove it in the next PTR patch. It’s concerning when the community sentiment towards a talent isn’t that it’s overpowered or underpowered, but that everyone is terrified they’re going to have to play that way if it becomes strong.

It should be understandable how the original concept of Soul Effigy would seem fun in theory, despite it clearly not working out in practice. As an Affliction Warlock, I'm very happy to walk into a 2-target boss fight. At a basic level, you know you're going to get double value out of your DoTs. Walking into a 1-target fight with Soul Effigy just doesn't feel nearly the same. Mechanically, the gameplay of the two situations is very similar, but in the end Soul Effigy doesn't play out well. Could be any of a number of actors - the reduced damage transfer, feeling like the effigy is just there for increased soul shard generation, the usability issues, or the unnaturalness of it as a concept.

Anyways, it’s gone. Replacement talent to come.


UPDATE on tier20;

The Tier 20 set bonus for Affliction is changing soon. It won’t be so focused on Drain Soul.

From where does this info of SE and the tier bonus come from? I haven't seen any blizz post talking about this. Could someone share the links of the posts, please?

[whackit]

From where does this info of SE and the tier bonus come from? I haven't seen any blizz post talking about this. Could someone share the links of the posts, please?

http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/1...-transparency/

[Lime]

15% Affliction buff?
Soul Effigy being removed?

Please, Blizzard, don't play with my emotions like this. I will gladly trade MG for this.

[Isadora]

What the fuck is going on. Seriously. I'm not saying I don't like it, but this much change to a class that's actually working (might not be balanced, but it's clearly working) is very unusual: Change to the set bonus; MG being nerfed; everything else being buffed; soul effigy being removed entirely, meaning we get a new level 100 talent (what the heck?!); soul conduit being nerfed - it's fucking weird.

[Deleted]

What the fuck is going on. Seriously. I'm not saying I don't like it, but this much change to a class that's actually working (might not be balanced, but it's clearly working) is very unusual: Change to the set bonus; MG being nerfed; everything else being buffed; soul effigy being removed entirely, meaning we get a new level 100 talent (what the heck?!); soul conduit being nerfed - it's fucking weird.

Soul conduit is NOT being nerfed.

And tbh its about fuckin time that warlocks got some real love this expansion.

[Isadora]

Soul conduit is NOT being nerfed.

And tbh its about fuckin time that warlocks got some real love this expansion.

Did they change that back? Or what did I miss? I'm not saying it's a big deal necessarily, but the numbers going from 20 % to 12 % is still a nerf, is it not?