41.5% crit or 5% more healing!? talent choices

[thompgun]

sorry for the obsecure title.

i am going to change the enchant on my pve boots to boar's speed so i can pvp with them.
for this i dont need pursuit of justice in my pve specc anymore.

soo the real question is:
i have 41.45% crit (38.45 without the talent)

This is in regards to 3 talent points.

Should i drop Sanctity of Battle (3% crit , 4th tier ret tree)
for
Divinity ( increases all healing by 3% , 1st tier prot tree)
-------------------
High crit build -> http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...00000000000000


Divinity Build -> http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc...00000000000000

[Flameenix]

If it's more healing output you want you'd be better off with 5% more healing, the extra crit won't bolster your HPS(e) too much and the regen from it isn't what it used to be.

However I'd really suggest looking at your gear, if you're in blues/naxx epics with a small mana pool, the crit might genuinely help you get through the fight. On the other hand, if you're geared in like ToC25/ToGC10 or higher gear, I'd certainly suggest speccing deeper into your prot tree for Divine Sacrifice and Guardian Sacrifice and abandoning the Retribution tree entirely.

[Azyoulike]

For PvE? You should drop your entire Ret subtree and go 51/20/0 - not because of divinity though, but because of Divine Sac and the longer SS duration.

51/5/15 is generally considered a bad compromise spec.

[grimmhammer]

PoJ provides a greater movement speed increase than Boar's speed. I'd hang on to it.

[Dantrag]

3% healing is constantly 0.03 bonus to your healing.

3% crit is 0.03 chance to have +0.5 bonus healing (crit), it gives us 0.015 bonus to healing (2 times worse), but crit also provides mana regeneration and 0.015 difference in healing is not much.

summary, i would choose crit. 0.015 healing coefficient is cool only if you are FoL-caster with sp gems.

[Sushimaster]

Drop your ret point, plain and simple, the extra crit worth nothing when the whole raid take intense damage, go Divine Sacrifice's built, u will be a more valuable healer for your raid.
Even tho they nerf it in patch 3,3, I still think its better than those crits cuz its possible to Use Divine Sacrifice with Buble then Divine Sacrifice with Divine Protection, double use, thats 12 secs of 20% less damage for the whole raid. u will also less likely to die cuz D.S cancel as soon as your hp drop down below 20%.
http://www.wow.com/2009/10/29/the-li...ine-sacrifice/
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-t...master&group=2

Also, if u go Improved Devotion aura, then u will get 111% healing each time u heal, with glyph of seal of light, thats 116% healing each time, and i think pally crit alot with holy shock, like 40%+ already, u will be good with 30% crit chance since with raid s buffs u should go up to 35% and i think its more than enuff.

[Riek]

Yea I'd drop all pts from ret tree and go 51/20/0 too, but remember to drop 3 pts from dev aura if you have resto druid in the raid... as the healing buff effects do not stack from my knowledge.


Also important to put pt into aura mastery and 3/3 conc aura if theres more than 1 holy pally in the raid (get the other one to get improved wisdom or vice versa!)

[thoukaia]

@Riek

whats the point in picking up 3/3 imp Conc aura? all casters these days have a talent that reduces casting time lost by 70% and it does not stack with conc aura, and the reduction of interrupt delays is not nearly useful enough to justify 3 talents points

[Sushimaster]

Yea I'd drop all pts from ret tree and go 51/20/0 too, but remember to drop 3 pts from dev aura if you have resto druid in the raid... as the healing buff effects do not stack from my knowledge.


Also important to put pt into aura mastery and 3/3 conc aura if theres more than 1 holy pally in the raid (get the other one to get improved wisdom or vice versa!)

Yea but in 10 man there more chance u wont heal with druid than 25 man, but overall, give extra armor and 6% extra healing wherever u heal is nice.

[Ronark]

@Riek

whats the point in picking up 3/3 imp Conc aura? all casters these days have a talent that reduces casting time lost by 70% and it does not stack with conc aura, and the reduction of interrupt delays is not nearly useful enough to justify 3 talents points

It DOES stack with Cons. aura.

[Riek]

@Riek

whats the point in picking up 3/3 imp Conc aura? all casters these days have a talent that reduces casting time lost by 70% and it does not stack with conc aura, and the reduction of interrupt delays is not nearly useful enough to justify 3 talents points

I dont have any pts in dev aura since my guild almost always has resto druids (@sushimaster: my guild usually has resto druid healing both 10 and 25's so I didn't put any pts... I guess it can be personal/guild preference then), and figured there isn't much places to spend 3 pts into other than conc aura after maxing out improved wisdom and lay on hands. Where else would you put the remaining pts other than improved conc aura? The only viable option that I can see is benediction but I'm not sure if 6% decrease in instant casts will be a bigger benefit (or 4% for my spec as I had 2 pts left over after I took all the necessary talents for raids)

Where else would you put those remaining talent points then?

[Simca]

I dont have any pts in dev aura since my guild almost always has resto druids (@sushimaster: my guild usually has resto druid healing both 10 and 25's so I didn't put any pts... I guess it can be personal/guild preference then), and figured there isn't much places to spend 3 pts into other than conc aura after maxing out improved wisdom and lay on hands. Where else would you put the remaining pts other than improved conc aura? The only viable option that I can see is benediction but I'm not sure if 6% decrease in instant casts will be a bigger benefit (or 4% for my spec as I had 2 pts left over after I took all the necessary talents for raids)

Where else would you put those remaining talent points then?

In imp Conc Aura.

It is EXTREMELY useful on fights with silences, especially long ones like the infamous 8-second silence on Lord Jaraxxus heroic. Also since nearly every spec has Aura Mastery, you're likely already using Conc Aura on that fight to prevent yourself from getting silenced all together every 2 minutes.

[thompgun]

after reading all the responses, i thank you all for your input.

but most of you give horrible advice.

divine sac while be very nice for raids is very situational.
and the points you pick up to get to it are worthless.

stoicism for raids? Improved righteous fury? (this is from a build that was linked in the thread)


i will write some more when i have a few more minutes, iam workin atm

[Deleted]

You ask for advice, then call it horrible when it's pretty much spot on? While the usefulness of Divine Sac might be debatable in 3.3, you're asking for advice on live, where Divine Sac is incredibly useful. There's no way that anything you can get in the ret tree outweighs the mana saved on Sacred Shield and the sheer usefulness Divine Sacrifice offers. Anything we take on the way to those are just the fillers that best serve our role.

[Rígr]

after reading all the responses, i thank you all for your input.

but most of you give horrible advice.

divine sac while be very nice for raids is very situational.
and the points you pick up to get to it are worthless.

stoicism for raids? Improved righteous fury? (this is from a build that was linked in the thread)


i will write some more when i have a few more minutes, iam workin atm

the 51/20/0 is the best spec... you are delutional to think otherwise, read up on you own spec
Imp RF = 6% less dmg taken from any source -> less healing required
divine sac is nice (gets buffed in 3.3 - as i understand, less damage taken only. not transfer of damage), but what you really want is the Divine Guardian for better shield, which require divine sac. as for worhtless points to get it.. better "worthless" points that can benefit you in some fights and in BG pvp than points that are totally wasted.

in conclution, read up on current specs before you bash the people trying to explain the mechanics behind the spec to you :P

[Riek]

after reading all the responses, i thank you all for your input.

but most of you give horrible advice.

divine sac while be very nice for raids is very situational.
and the points you pick up to get to it are worthless.

stoicism for raids? Improved righteous fury? (this is from a build that was linked in the thread)


i will write some more when i have a few more minutes, iam workin atm

Whats wrong with righteous fury? Situationlly turning it on for 6% reduced dmg is a nice buff


GL going 51/0/20 then, afterall all we can give from the forums is advice only. Taking the advice is optional in your perspective.

edit
And as for Dsac, I believe it still does absorb dmg from party only (not the entire raid), but only 5X (40% of max player health), -- So roughly around 50~60k dmg? Also it will automatically turn off if player's hp reaches 20% (nice!) With Divine Guardian talents it absorbs 20% dmg for all raid members..... and also adds buff to SS as before which is real nice =)

And I put stoicism b/c there isnt really place to put 3 pts in for prot spec... also why would you put 2/2 for unyielding faith for raids? at least invest a point in aura mastery as it can be useful in different fights

[Ronark]

For PvE? You should drop your entire Ret subtree and go 51/20/0 - not because of divinity though, but because of Divine Sac and the longer SS duration.

51/5/15 is generally considered a bad compromise spec.

This is the best advice.

Cookie-cutter spec w/glyphs is as follows (For HL spam):

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#sxAzg...gdxGzub:IdwMcV

For FoL spam, exchange Glyphs of Holy Light and Seal of Wisdom for Glyphs of Flash of Light and Seal of Light.

[Riek]

This is the best advice.

Cookie-cutter spec w/glyphs is as follows (For HL spam):

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#sxAzg...gdxGzub:IdwMcV

For FoL spam, exchange Glyphs of Holy Light and Seal of Wisdom for Glyphs of Flash of Light and Seal of Light.

hey.. that's exactly what I posted.....!!!

I've seen some pallies go straight FoL spam with SP/CRIT enchants... I wonder how that will turn out (they also did well in togc25 too it seems)

[Raptorg]

Question, couldn't you get away with Righteous Fury active all the time?
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but don't paladin healing spells have -50% threat by default?(So per 1 healing done you get 0.25 threat)

So with Righteous Fury active, your heals would generate 0.45 threat per point healed(Correct me if my math is wrong) which is nearly the same as any other healer, so you can "enjoy" a passive 6% damage reduction, rather than just activating it when a high damage situation is coming?

[Riek]

Question, couldn't you get away with Righteous Fury active all the time?
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but don't paladin healing spells have -50% threat by default?(So per 1 healing done you get 0.25 threat)

So with Righteous Fury active, your heals would generate 0.45 threat per point healed(Correct me if my math is wrong) which is nearly the same as any other healer, so you can "enjoy" a passive 6% damage reduction, rather than just activating it when a high damage situation is coming?

Ideally yes, but I use it "situationally" to help the tanks grab better aggros. At least it has happened to me couple times; I guess if your tanks have no problem with your righteous fury turned on, then by all means have it on all the time =)