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  1. #1
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Surely Cataclysm can't be the be all and end all

    Its something to think about how blizzard intends to progress WOW after cataclysm has run its course.

    In the past, Azeroth has been our home in the game, from 1-60, it was the introduction to the lore and unlike outland and northrend, Azeorth wasn't set on one linear idea. You went from one area of azeroth to another, and discovered things very different and never overlapping each other, from the scourge in plaguelands, to the twilight cultists in silithus, or the elves in ashenvale or darkshore, to the trecks across the barrens. However you looked at it, azeroth was what brought us into wow, and it wasn't set on that linear pattern.

    With TBC and WOTLK, well these newer places were linear, and had you travel from the start to the end, these new places, outland and northrend, were set on a path to whatever the conclusion was, the black temple, the sunwell, icecrown citadel, and all the other places to travelled though was a path that lead to the end of it all.
    But, with this, there was also still azeroth, our none linear home, when the story in azeroth Wasn't based on one subject matter, such as the wotlk was the lich king, tbc was the legion or illidan/kil'jaeden. When our adventures in these new places were over, we returned home, leaving those troubles behind us and waiting for a new goal.

    With cata though, its something else, the place we called home is now that linear walk, like instead of azeroth being about all different things, it is now about one thing, Deathwing, and the world destruction. Instead of going to fight whatever evil would come, this has come to us, and changed the world from its none linear story to just another one.

    As the course of events have always run, to give something that can allow the story to progress, wow has, like say, had us go and fight these big evils elsewhere, and return home after, and that way it allows us to go to the next chapter.

    So the real question is, how are they intending to push the story forward after cataclysm, when azeroth itself is now just like another linear front like outland and northrend. Will they reinvent all the zones after cata? Will they move us onto another planet and leave azeroth as 'deathwings' expansion?
    Last edited by orcshaman24; 2010-11-24 at 03:07 AM.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  2. #2
    Never thought of it that way but you bring up a good point. I haven't been paying attention enough to beta and leaks on purpose to try and enjoy the full glory of the next expansion so I am not sure how linear this one will be, but you are right on the BC and WotLK.
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  3. #3
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Its an intresting thought when you consider. Unless something happens at the end of the expansion, the terms of the story (say into the next expan) where the world is being either repaired or completely collapses, azeroth will be just another linear zone like the other two.

    And neither of those two places (outland & northrend) will be changed as of cataclysm, so it makes you wonder what they intend to do.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  4. #4
    Wasnt that cataclysms intention, to hit our home to make us fell unsafe? really our cities are our homes and the zones we know which have really only seen threats from alien threats are now dieing and being harmed.
    As for after cataclysm i think we are going to end up going to places which see threats and harms like wotlk and BC but i think after progressing through the cataclysm expansions story its a wake up call to get us to save our home, so at the end i think to some degree we should fell like we have saved our world but other threats are there too so we have to get to them this time before they come at us like deathwing!

  5. #5
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    This is the thing though as the linear aspect worked with tbc and wotlk. when we travelled though those zones from the start and beat the big evil in it, we then moved on from those zone. We left outland and northrend, as if we had taken care of trouble there, and all was well and good so we returned home.
    With cata, this linear plot is going from where we begin our adventure, and the conclusion will be deathwing. but unless the zones change somehow in a later expansion, we would basicly still be living in the cataclysm expansion as a result.

    Ok, you could leave zones like the 5 new ones in place representing that, but like say, unless the zones effected by the cataclyms and deathwing change in the future, either good or bad, it doesn't leave much for the progressive plotline.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  6. #6
    Next expansion is the Emerald Dream/Nightmare. They said so without saying so at BlizzCon by saying the next Old God is Ni'zoth and he corrupted the Dream and is the one 'paying Deathwing's bills'.

    The Cata expansion includes the world changes, yes. But the expansion itself is actually the 80-85 content. The world changes were just something that had to be done sooner or later.

  7. #7
    Mechagnome Rifter's Avatar
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    Jesus Tap Dancing Christ.

    Seriously?

    Who cares what they do after cataclysm? That's two years away and I'm sure it'll all be sorted by then.

    It's a game - enjoy what you have in front of you and try not to give too much of a fuck about the future of it all.

  8. #8
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Well the changes to the old content in azeroth are as a result of the cataclysm. It all relates. So well yeah a change had to happen eventually, like I say, the linear point of the story would have us progress though the new content with a feeling that we saved things and it can begin to change. From a story pov, we did our part in northrend and it changed though all the zones we adventured though, and so we left northrend behind.
    We can't leave azeroth behind though, its still gonna be the same torn world when we get back from beating deathwing unless something progresses it beyond that.

    Intresting point though about the emerald dream. See the dream is what the world is meant to be like without corruption or if the world was flourished. Maybe if the dream is an expansion, it could play out what helps heal the world in the long run.

    ---------- Post added 2010-11-24 at 04:11 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
    Jesus Tap Dancing Christ.

    Seriously?

    Who cares what they do after cataclysm? That's two years away and I'm sure it'll all be sorted by then.

    It's a game - enjoy what you have in front of you and try not to give too much of a fuck about the future of it all.
    Game fans this way <
    Lore fans this way >

    Guess what, you can love the game AND be intrested in the lore too.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
    Jesus Tap Dancing Christ.

    Seriously?

    Who cares what they do after cataclysm? That's two years away and I'm sure it'll all be sorted by then.

    It's a game - enjoy what you have in front of you and try not to give too much of a fuck about the future of it all.
    Some like us enjoy the lore and these feelings inside the game. If you do not understand us, at least try to do less agressive posts.
    World PvP and how it stands/standed.
    World PvP isn't meant to be balanced, fair nor honorable. It's meant to be brutal, relentless, deadly.. and it's the survival of the fittest. It's a fight where everything goes and you use anything you can to survive and win. It's War.. a World of Warcraft where only the best survive!

  10. #10
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
    Jesus Tap Dancing Christ.

    Seriously?

    Who cares what they do after cataclysm? That's two years away and I'm sure it'll all be sorted by then.

    It's a game - enjoy what you have in front of you and try not to give too much of a fuck about the future of it all.
    Obvoiusly the OP and For one , I do.

    OP brings up a valid point which makes you think.

  11. #11
    Deleted
    I've purposely been avoiding the leaked news etc so until I see how the quests are affected by deathwing/cataclysm I don't really have much to say, but one possible theory I have is that the new quests in the lower zones aren't as linear as we might believe, meaning they could effectively return/rebuild the major cities so it would look like, hey we beat deathwing and we've rebuilt and grown stronger from it. If not, I'm not sure how they'll evolve the storyline after that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rifter View Post
    Jesus Tap Dancing Christ.

    Seriously?

    Who cares what they do after cataclysm? That's two years away and I'm sure it'll all be sorted by then.

    It's a game - enjoy what you have in front of you and try not to give too much of a fuck about the future of it all.
    Why don't you just relax? Some of us actually enjoy discussing topics like this, please don't spoil it for everyone else. The lore is one of the main reasons I play WoW.

  12. #12
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Well I won't drop any bombs on the news from higher lv areas, it is something if the quests in cata from 1-60 are all related to deathwing and the twilight cultists, and we're meant to beat them, there'd have to be something to move it along from just feeling like 'this is still cataclysm on azeroth' in the future.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  13. #13
    Its not linear at all....

    The Shattering has caused development of new area's. It's not all for the worse. Many zones are prospering from it, such as desolace, azshara, WPL/EPL...

  14. #14
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcangel14 View Post
    Its not linear at all....

    The Shattering has caused development of new area's. It's not all for the worse. Many zones are prospering from it, such as desolace, azshara, WPL/EPL...
    True. Ah, but again as a result of the cataclysm. Are there quests that have npcs saying 'the cataclysm caused this!' or something? places like the barrens, stranglethorn and badlands are directly effected looking at them. there are what I'd think of as damaged zones related to this expansion.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  15. #15
    imo its a "two parter"

    thats why there is 5 lvls and Azshara isn't in this episode (and that's official)

    the clock starts at 12 (stalemate between factions)
    this expansion will take us to 6
    the next will take us back to 12 (and the stalemate again)

    you can even start drawing up a theoretical list of stuff that could be in the next expansion atm if you were such inclined and how stuff happening in Cata will lead on to other developments in the next 5 levels.
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    gee thx Brox...

  16. #16
    Arcangel, linear in terms of history and goals. Basicly you now have


    1-60 -> (BEFORE) Free questing and a home. (AFTER) A linear story about defeating Deathwing and what he did to Azeroth.
    60-70 -> Story told towards the legion and Illidan.
    70-80 -> Story told towards the Lich King and invading Northrend.
    80-85 -> Linear story about Azeroth being under attack and we have to save it.

    see what he means? at least in our "home land", from 1-60 we always had that "you are free to do what you want" world. As of now we'll get a "quicky hero, go kill those 30 boars so we get meat for our reinforments against deathwing" or even a "Hero, you must gather 10 skins of Zebra so we can do our cloaks larger cuz hot fire burns"
    Last edited by Tedj; 2010-11-24 at 04:35 AM.
    World PvP and how it stands/standed.
    World PvP isn't meant to be balanced, fair nor honorable. It's meant to be brutal, relentless, deadly.. and it's the survival of the fittest. It's a fight where everything goes and you use anything you can to survive and win. It's War.. a World of Warcraft where only the best survive!

  17. #17
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    I got this image in my head of the orc, gnome and dwarf quest in the badlands 'punch that dragon in the face', just thinking if we were to beat deathwing, and the next big threat comes we need to face, we'd still have to travel though azeroth and punch deathwing in the face again.. despite him being defeated already.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  18. #18
    Bloodsail Admiral DerSenf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcangel14 View Post
    Its not linear at all....

    The Shattering has caused development of new area's. It's not all for the worse. Many zones are prospering from it, such as desolace, azshara, WPL/EPL...
    It is linear by Deathwing beeing our main villian.

    The OP made a very good point. When Deathwing is finally beaten after about 2 years, "lorewise" the Azeroth should recover from it's wounds. Technicaly, that would be stupid. Blizzard would have destroyed Azeroth for one expansion and then change it again for the upcoming? I don't think that would make sense.

    Options are, like OP said, send us to a new planet, or rather an other plane. I'm thinking about the Emerald Dream here. Perhaps ED could be as big as Outlands/Northrand to cover an entire expansion.

  19. #19
    Pit Lord orcshaman24's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tedj View Post
    Arcangel, linear in terms of history and goals. Basicly you now have

    ---------------------BEFORE-------------------------------------------------AFTER--------------------------------
    -1-60-----free questing and a home --||--a linear story about defeating Deathwing and what he did to Azeroth
    60-70---------------------story told towards the legion and Illidan--------------------------------------------------
    70-80------------story told towards the Lich King and invading Northrend------------------------------------------
    80-85-----linear story about Azeroth being under attack and we have to save it-------------------------------------

    see what he means? at least in our "home land", from 1-60 we always had that "you are free to do what you want" world. As of now we'll get a "quicky hero, go kill those 30 boars so we get meat for our reinforments against deathwing" or even a "Hero, you must gather 10 skins of Zebra so we can do our cloaks larger cuz hot fire burns"
    Exactly my point. The old world now changed to fit in with the events of cataclysm make it more focused on this, rather then it being a free roaming adventure, we're focused on helping fronts in the wake of deathwings assault, which is just like the kind of plot they have of working though places in northrend and preparing for and assault on the lich king.
    "The beginning of wisdom is the statement 'I do not know.' The person who cannot make that statement is one who will never learn anything. And I have prided myself on my ability to learn."

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by orcshaman24 View Post
    I got this image in my head of the orc, gnome and dwarf quest in the badlands 'punch that dragon in the face', just thinking if we were to beat deathwing, and the next big threat comes we need to face, we'd still have to travel though azeroth and punch deathwing in the face again.. despite him being defeated already.
    Exactly, and that really makes me sad. I really wish they do get a proper follow-up history or they will be screwing up our home, our "this brought us to wow".
    World PvP and how it stands/standed.
    World PvP isn't meant to be balanced, fair nor honorable. It's meant to be brutal, relentless, deadly.. and it's the survival of the fittest. It's a fight where everything goes and you use anything you can to survive and win. It's War.. a World of Warcraft where only the best survive!

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