[Megathread] Wildstar - Now F2P

[mkultra55]

We used DKP and converted to EPGP in TBC. EPGP was the best system I've ever used.

Agreed. I was loot master in TBC and Wrath and EPGP is the best loot system I've come across. My only issue was trying to explain how it was fair for someone who had been on every run to have priority for a certain drop over someone who had only come a couple of times. Happened all the time.

[Nirawen]

We used DKP and converted to EPGP in TBC. EPGP was the best system I've ever used.

We used a stripped down version of EP to accumlate points, I think it was just something like 5 for being on time, 10 for each boss killed and 20 for staying til the end of the raid.

I remember when the pre-BC patch dropped at the end of Vanilla, I took a 2H sword from AQ on my hunter because noone wanted it and it looked cool (town loot ) but didn't realise we'd swapped to an ilvl-cost system for that raid and blew all my points .

[Tekkommo]

I find the loot council to be the best.

I know it can be abused, but I would never be part of an abused system.

[Nirawen]

I find the loot council to be the best.

I know it can be abused, but I would never be part of an abused system.

I only remember tales of corruption when a loot council was in place, but I guess that's how it goes.. no one mentions it until it goes wrong.

[mkultra55]

Well, I know I don't speak for everyone (in any way, shape, or form) but much of the reason I stopped playing WoW was because I couldn't commit to a set schedule, and therefore had a fairly difficult time finding groups to do raid content, which meant I couldn't really progress my character further than LFR.

I dont' see Wildstar 40 man raids addressing this type of problem, which is why I will most likely not be taking part in them, but as long as I get some sort of character progression from alternate means and can also experience the story I'm OK with it.

Based on the information I'm seeing in these forums, information from Blizzard tweets/ Blue discussions, sub numbers from other MMO's and friends/ family that also play MMO's (admittedly antecdotal for the most part, but still relevant, imo) the market is seeing more players like me than of the hardcore crowd that large "hardcore" raid content is aimed at. Blizzard made a brilliant business decision by creating one raid and tweaking the mechanics a bit so all players could see it rather than make completely separate pieces of content for the "hardcore" and the "casual" and everyone in between. It reduces costs and man hours needed to develop the content.

Unless they make the 20 and 40 man raids PUG'able and put them into a LFR type queue system, I don't see a large enough percentage of players actually experiencing the content to warrant the amount of time and money that was put into it..........

Interesting post because it brings up a number of interesting topics that have been debated since WOW started moving away from the Vanilla/TBC model.

One argument is that having certain content that seemed out of reach made the game world seem bigger and scarier which is a good thing. Think of BWL from the perspective of you average 5 man player in Vanilla or BT in TBC. On the other hand once players feel like they have nothing left to do they tend to quit.

Blizzard's answer is a double edged sword. It IS cheaper to develop one encounter with different difficulties rather than different encounters for each type of player but is that better for the game? Is making a copy of WOW the only way a game can succeed?

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I find the loot council to be the best.

I know it can be abused, but I would never be part of an abused system.

I tried Loot Council but in the end EPGP was better for us. Totally transparent and supported by an add-on that every player can download and use to see where they stand. I prefer systems that can never be accused of favoritism since no matter what someone will cause drama.

[Kelimbror]

I tried Loot Council but in the end EPGP was better for us. Totally transparent and supported by an add-on that every player can download and use to see where they stand. I prefer systems that can never be accused of favoritism since no matter what someone will cause drama.

The only problems we had were when bench warmers could come in and clear house when someone was absent, but fair is fair. We chose them to be a part of our raid roster and they were dedicatedly available even when we never brought them to the raid. It made perfect sense to let that person reap the rewards of their dedication when they had no self gratification prior to that point. Considering that you can point to a transparent system that is equal to every participant, it was pretty much perfect. If I ran a raid guild in Wildstar I would use EPGP even today. (see, this is totally W* relevant and not generic MMO convo)

[Chickat]

Any idea when next weekend beta is?

[Arlee]

I find the loot council to be the best.

I know it can be abused, but I would never be part of an abused system.

I've never seen loot council used fairly.

I tried Loot Council but in the end EPGP was better for us. Totally transparent and supported by an add-on that every player can download and use to see where they stand. I prefer systems that can never be accused of favoritism since no matter what someone will cause drama.

Pretty much that. Also I loved it because it was updated automatically during raiding so I didn't have to spend time after the raid inputing the changes into a website to update everything like I did when we used DKP. With that system I'd have a good hour of updating after every raid. And omg heaven forbid I went to sleep right after the raid and didn't update until the next morning. People acted like the sky was falling the few times I did that.

The only problems we had were when bench warmers could come in and clear house when someone was absent, but fair is fair. We chose them to be a part of our raid roster and they were dedicatedly available even when we never brought them to the raid. It made perfect sense to let that person reap the rewards of their dedication when they had no self gratification prior to that point. Considering that you can point to a transparent system that is equal to every participant, it was pretty much perfect. If I ran a raid guild in Wildstar I would use EPGP even today. (see, this is totally W* relevant and not generic MMO convo)

We addressed that issue by having a set rule that for everyone who was added in after most people were established they would get an automatic 100 GP added to their record. That put them near the top of the middle of the raid and generally things would workout so they always got something that raid, or they would be at the top the next raid.

[mkultra55]

Any idea when next weekend beta is?

Right now.

[Arlee]

Any idea when next weekend beta is?

I think they added in this weekend. Someone correct me if I failed at reading comprehension.

[mkultra55]

I think they added in this weekend. Someone correct me if I failed at reading comprehension.

Servers were supposed to go live this morning. I've been at work so I can't say for sure.

[Arlee]

yea ima at work too... silly work.

[Ham on Rye]

I only remember tales of corruption when a loot council was in place, but I guess that's how it goes.. no one mentions it until it goes wrong.

Loot council is only as good as the people on the council are honest. With a fair and honest council, loot council is the best loot system and it's not even close.

And with a dishonest and corrupt council... then you should be asking yourself why are you in that guild in the first place.

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Any idea when next weekend beta is?

It started about 5 hours ago

[Katchii]

One argument is that having certain content that seemed out of reach made the game world seem bigger and scarier which is a good thing. Think of BWL from the perspective of you average 5 man player in Vanilla or BT in TBC. On the other hand once players feel like they have nothing left to do they tend to quit.

I'll admit though, that having content in the game that I know I will never see because I'm "just not there yet" feels kind of good, because it makes the world feel big and bad and mysterious in some aspects. BWL, UBRS, MC, Black Temple, Sunwell, Naxx 1.0 were all Epic just because of what it took to get there. But it can be discouraging to people that will NEVER get there because of whatever reasons, but its an amazing feeling to work up to it and finally get inside the dungeon/ raid instance because it's an accomplishment and not just a forgone conclusion like it is now.

I know this is also a touchy subject, but I'd love for attunements to come back alongside the LFR mechaninc to where you couldn't queue for the raid until you'd completed the attunement quest. Because even then, getting into the raid would still feel like somewhat of an accomplishment and they could easily tell a great story during the attunement quest chain so you had more context for what you were doing and why you were doing it (or how you get into the dungeon...really, I just need to hit this UI button to get into the secret lair of the main boss? seems legit) rather than just doing it because it's the next thing available.

If I ran a raid guild in Wildstar I would use EPGP even today.

EPGP is the only completely fair, transparent, unbiased system I've ever used. All other systems I've seen were able to be abused and caused a whole lot more drama than I ever wanted to deal with. I sign on to play the game, kill stuff, get some loot, and hang out with friends not have a 10+ minute debate on why I think I should have this super upgrade over the next guy and have it just get tossed to him anyway and feel like I just wasted my time and now don't really want to play with these guys anymore because I can't trust them to be fair. (This is why I quit playing in TBC....guild loot drama).

[Chickat]

I actually meant a weekend beta for non preorder people. I figured it out though.

[mkultra55]

I actually meant a weekend beta for non preorder people. I figured it out though.

Doubtful I'd say. Unless they feel box sales aren't where they want to be or they feel the servers need more high capacity stress tests.

[Arlee]

I actually meant a weekend beta for non preorder people. I figured it out though.

Oh well in that case you'd have to wait for open beta. No word on when exactly that will be though.

[mkultra55]

I'll admit though, that having content in the game that I know I will never see because I'm "just not there yet" feels kind of good, because it makes the world feel big and bad and mysterious in some aspects. BWL, UBRS, MC, Black Temple, Sunwell, Naxx 1.0 were all Epic just because of what it took to get there. But it can be discouraging to people that will NEVER get there because of whatever reasons, but its an amazing feeling to work up to it and finally get inside the dungeon/ raid instance because it's an accomplishment and not just a forgone conclusion like it is now.
...........

So true and it was my first though then I started reading about Wildstar. I missed that feeling of awe i had when I first stepped into UBRS then MC and then in TBC with Kara after finally beating Black Morass. It's a feeling that's pretty much gone from WOW at this point since (as you say) seeing the content in one form or another is just a button press away.

That's one reason I hope the 40 mans are tuned to be a little more forgiving and wind up being more about developing relationships on your server. It would help keep the epic feeling but still allow more people to get into the content. I think that would be good for the game in the long run.

[Arlee]

Oh hey, they just sent out 100,000 weekend beta invites to some of the oldest beta apps who didn't get into beta.

https://forums.wildstar-online.com/f...dstar-weekend/

[Zemenar]

Raid Loot will be 3-4 Epics in 20m and ~6 Legendaries in 40m.

I know this is also a touchy subject, but I'd love for attunements to come back ...

They're being added in, Carbine said not all the raids will have em but there will be attunements. Genetic Archives (20m) had its attunement disabled in previous beta builds but I believe the current one (or maybe the April build) is adding it in game for testing. Initially its going to require 150 Elder Gems to start it, after that i have no idea - although popular belief is it'll require a Gold Medal in all the Veteran Dungeons *shrugs*.