[Diseasless blood] Confused. Need pro help!

[Sethlol]

Hello.

I have posted almost exactly this same post on deathknight.info but didn't actually get the answers I was looking for - especially on question 2.

I've been diseasless blood for a while now but just lately got 4 pieces t7.25 (for the 4set bonus) and Betrayer of Humanity. I know that the build is dying in 3.1, but I still want some answers from pro peeps to at least clear up my confusion.

1.
I've read elitistjerk.com A LOT and watching those WWS reports with people pulling off almost 7k dps on Patchwerk blow my mind. I've been on approx 5k on Patch without a warrior sundering armor and without a "perfect" group setup. Our guild has some shitty dps'ers here and there and that's why that kill took 3+ mins. Fine enough. But 5k and 7k is still such a big difference!

I have 4054 ap, 32,8% crit, I'm hit capped and expertise capped and got the Sigil of Awareness from Heigan. My rotation is 2x Obliterate -> 2x Heart Strike -> RP dump. From the information I've gained this is the best rotation available. Is that correct?

When heroism is about to be used, I get to full RP, pop Hysteria, pop Dancing Rune Weap, use my trinket, potion of speed, and I do 2x Obliterate -> 2x Heart Strike and then I use Empower Runic Weapon so I can do the rotation from start again since Obliterate is our "main" ability in this build. I'm in Blood Presence all the time. Is this correct? Do you all do it this way? Or is there some better way to use the CD's?

2.
Something I've noticed with a lot of the WWS reports I've been looking at where the diseasless blood dk is doing massive dps, is that their nr. 1 damage ability is melee weapon swings while mine come from Obliterate. I've got two screenshots where you can compare me and a DK that posted on elitistjerk. Again, he is not the only DK that I've noticed that has melee weapon hits as main damage ability but I've picked him for you to compare. I noticed it on the Sartharion 3D 10 man zerg kill too. There the blood dk, which has approx same gear and stats as me, has also melee swings as main damage ability. I've done the zerg kill too, but again Obliterate was MY main damage ability while another blood DK in the raid who did more dps had melee swings as main damage ability.

Me:
http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/w...mai/Instru.jpg

Other DK (as an example):
http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/w...409_211913.jpg

Can anyone give a logical answer to this? It's been bugging me for I don't know how long now, and I am confused if I'm doing anything wrong.

Thanks in advance.

[Mothhive]

You do realise this will be the lowest DPS rotation in a few days, right? Why would you want to perfect something that will only be viable for 1 raid at most?

[Deleted]

The answer to both questions is pretty much the same. It's about how fast your entire guild kills the stuff, not just you.

Aside from the fact you say you're missing some raid buffs (no sunder? do you not raid with warriors or do they all suck?) which will obviously reduce your damage, if your guild takes 3 minutes and another guild takes 1 minute 30 seconds, that will mean the other guild spent twice as long under the effect of bloodlust. For personal DPS too, whether your kill took 90 seconds or 180 seconds you're still going to get to raise dead once, you're still only getting 1 army of the dead, you're still getting 1 ERW. If you link the full WWS I can help more though. Your crit chance on both white and obliterate seem low. If you have 33% crit unbuffed, you should be seeing at least 40% of your swings critting in a raid. I suspect sunder isn't the only raid buff you're missing.

As for 2, bloodlust's only meaningful effect on a DK's DPS is to white damage. Although if you're doing significantly less white damage than another DK on a fight that lasts pretty much the same time (ie 3D zerg) I'd like to see that :P

[SolaronTich]

I am not a pro, but I will say that as for your rotation, isn't

Obliterate x2, Heart Strike x2, dump, Heart Strike x6, dump

the optimal rotation, getting the most out of your runes?

[Deleted]

I am not a pro, but I will say that as for your rotation, isn't

Obliterate x2, Heart Strike x2, dump, Heart Strike x6, dump

the optimal rotation, getting the most out of your runes?

No, obliterate does more than twice as much damage as HS, and you dont have enough GCDS for 6xHS anyway.

[Sethlol]

You do realise this will be the lowest DPS rotation in a few days, right?

I know that the build is dying in 3.1, but I still want some answers from pro peeps to at least clear up my confusion.

It has basically just been bugging me for some time now and I need to clear up before I can move on to a "normal" blood spec in 3.1.

As for 2, bloodlust's only meaningful effect on a DK's DPS is to white damage. Although if you're doing significantly less white damage than another DK on a fight that lasts pretty much the same time (ie 3D zerg) I'd like to see that :P

We don't have a WWS report from the fight, unfortunately. But I saw it myself on Recount. And it was like that every single try..

[AbandonHope]

Lolz... Im missing the sigil and the back piece off KT. I do at least 5.9k on patch, thats doing patch around 3 min. I use the same rotation as you. I just rape face. If the god damn sigil dropped off Heigan one of these weeks I would be doing at least 6k. Ah well. Maybe 18th time is a charm... Unless 3.1 is out tues... Imma buy the sigil!

[Sethlol]

The answer to both questions is pretty much the same. It's about how fast your entire guild kills the stuff, not just you.

Aside from the fact you say you're missing some raid buffs (no sunder? do you not raid with warriors or do they all suck?) which will obviously reduce your damage, if your guild takes 3 minutes and another guild takes 1 minute 30 seconds, that will mean the other guild spent twice as long under the effect of bloodlust. For personal DPS too, whether your kill took 90 seconds or 180 seconds you're still going to get to raise dead once, you're still only getting 1 army of the dead, you're still getting 1 ERW. If you link the full WWS I can help more though. Your crit chance on both white and obliterate seem low. If you have 33% crit unbuffed, you should be seeing at least 40% of your swings critting in a raid. I suspect sunder isn't the only raid buff you're missing.

As for 2, bloodlust's only meaningful effect on a DK's DPS is to white damage. Although if you're doing significantly less white damage than another DK on a fight that lasts pretty much the same time (ie 3D zerg) I'd like to see that :P

I have PM'ed you the link for the full WWS report. Thanks!

[Lorkanus]

As far as I had read(some time ago, stopped reading blood posts) the rotation for diseaseless blood was

2x Ob 2x HS-rp dump- 6xHS

in unholy presence. Unholy presence could be the point, why they do more white damage than you....oh, and less obliterates but more heartstrikes also means your ob will be at less damage.

[Knuffelbert]

Well, sunder armor is a lot, especially diseaseless. 10-15% or so. Than it's not that far of the mark you are shooting for.
Also, the shorter the fight, the higher the DPS from you as heroism uptime in total is higher, this also includes other CDs.

[wildmandooby]

As far as I had read(some time ago, stopped reading blood posts) the rotation for diseaseless blood was

2x Ob 2x HS-rp dump- 6xHS

in unholy presence. Unholy presence could be the point, why they do more white damage than you....oh, and less obliterates but more heartstrikes also means your ob will be at less damage.

Absolutely do not listen to this guy, he has no idea what he is talking about. Unholy presence is fail. With 4pc t7.5, you do 2x ob, 2x hs, dc dump, another option is 1ob, hs, 1ob, 1hs, using DC when Sudden Doom procs so you don't miss any procs. You should be popping your cooldown's before you pop DrW, your Hystera, Trinket, Potion of Speed, etc. Your biggest problem is guild lacks in DPS, longer kill less DPS, blood has insane burst, but once you use your CD's your dps just gets lower and lower. Also, no sunder's? LOL?

[Jaydee]

So as you can see Batmack didnt even use Sudden Doom procs. 2xHS / 2xOb / 2xDC... THATS IT! Post your Armory so we can take a look at your spec/gear. Also you should be using Hysteria on yourself if you want higher dps >_< and post the actual WWS so we can look through buff uptimes etc. I did 5.8k with Jawbone so I'm not sure what your doing wrong.

[Aragaarn]

I also have a question.... I have ineivitable defeat, over 3.7k AP, hit cap, expertise capped, and 26% crit. However, I only manage 4k dps on 25man patch using 2OB, 2Hs, RP, 6Hs

If someone could clarify the BEST rotation for my spec right now ,that would be great. Also any more advice

Here's my armory http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...her&n=Aragaarn

Also, @AbandonHope

You said your doing 5.9k on patch..... so if you could tell me something I could do different for more dps that would be great too

[Schlip]

I also have a question.... I have ineivitable defeat, over 3.7k AP, hit cap, expertise capped, and 26% crit. However, I only manage 4k dps on 25man patch using 2OB, 2Hs, RP, 6Hs

If someone could clarify the BEST rotation for my spec right now ,that would be great. Also any more advice

Here's my armory http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...her&n=Aragaarn

Also, @AbandonHope

You said your doing 5.9k on patch..... so if you could tell me something I could do different for more dps that would be great too

Just read the other posting: 2x OB, 2xHS, Dump, 6xHS, again

BTW: Too much +hit, too much +expt, too less +crit.

[Sethlol]

Also you should be using Hysteria on yourself if you want higher dps >_< and post the actual WWS so we can look through buff uptimes etc. I did 5.8k with Jawbone so I'm not sure what your doing wrong.

HYSTERIA ON MYSELF? Oh my, really? Of course I use it on myself. I have a macro where I use Hysteria, trinket and Potion of Speed. Then after that I use DRW.

Armory: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...n=Instrumental

I know I'm under hit cap, but I'm alway in a group with draenei so technically I am capped.

WWS: http://wowwebstats.com/ju4ownk4orzoi

As you see, we had no warrior, therefore no sunders. And I didn't use flask nor Potion of Speed on this run. The reason why we were wiping all the time on Patch was that we were trying to do the achievement (but failed multiple times because of bad dps from a lot of peeps.). On try 4 I did manage to get 5,7k dps yet still Obliterate is my main damage ability. Very confusing when I use the same the rotation as Skeletonjack on that picture and a few other DK's, but Recount and WWS still show something different.

[Bullshifter]

Just read the other posting: 2x OB, 2xHS, Dump, 6xHS, again

BTW: Too much +hit, too much +expt, too less +crit.

@Aragaarn

To add to this, get the 21 crit / +3% crit damage meta. Lose every single +AP gem and replace it with a +str gem. To activate the 2 blue gem requirement the meta has, use a +8str/+12 stam purple gem in your shoulders to activate the +4str socket bonus. You don't have any other +str socket bonuses available, so I'd probably put the other +8str/+12stam purple in your helm for the +8crit socket bonus. Also, it's pretty accepted by the folks over at EJ, that the starting sigil is better for Blood than the sigil of haunted dreams. You could stand the +50AP enchant for bracers. You could get at least a +8 stats enchant for your chest. Lose the icewalker enchant on your boots and replace with +AP.

Hard to do much else about the wasted itemization on hit and expertise, since it really just is a gear thing, but with your current gear, those are my suggestions as a starting point.

[Aragaarn]

Thanks for the advice, but would a few gem/enchant changes really make a difference of over 1.5k dps?

[Bullshifter]

Probably not, but it's more significant than you think. Generally speaking, that person doing 1.5k dps is probably geared a bit differently than you as well. For instance, your chest could stand upgrading (it's not "terrible"- at least there's not really any "waste" of its stats)- your bracers have a stat that is completely wasted (expertise- I say wasted, because you are way over cap). The legs, which are tremendously good if you need hit, are actually pretty crappy with 80 points of its itemization being mostly wasted being that far over cap. Your 2nd trinket could really stand to be upgraded. These are the types of things that are holding you back.

[Jaydee]

HYSTERIA ON MYSELF? Oh my, really? Of course I use it on myself. I have a macro where I use Hysteria, trinket and Potion of Speed. Then after that I use DRW.

Armory: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...n=Instrumental

I know I'm under hit cap, but I'm alway in a group with draenei so technically I am capped.

WWS: http://wowwebstats.com/ju4ownk4orzoi

As you see, we had no warrior, therefore no sunders. And I didn't use flask nor Potion of Speed on this run. The reason why we were wiping all the time on Patch was that we were trying to do the achievement (but failed multiple times because of bad dps from a lot of peeps.). On try 4 I did manage to get 5,7k dps yet still Obliterate is my main damage ability. Very confusing when I use the same the rotation as Skeletonjack on that picture and a few other DK's, but Recount and WWS still show something different.

Sorry, under DMG IN I didn't realize that hysteria was classified as physical damage. Your rotation is obviously wrong because you should have almost equal # of HB, OB and a couple less DC (DRW = a full RP wipe) yours are WAY off.

[Sethlol]

Well, I do the 2x Obli 2x HS RP Dump (where I use DC's until all runic power are down, even though Obli is back from CD).

I can't really see what I'm doing wrong.