4.1 Enhancement hit nerf: Community comments?

[Imadraenei]

Anyone remember the days where Resto had the Spell+Melee hit talent, and we just got that with DW Spec and never bothered with any more hit than 9% melee and 3% spell? Granted, there was also WF/Grace twisting...

[Endus]

I'm personally particularly annoyed by this as well. Maybe it's just me, but of rets, DKs, and enhancement shaman, we're the ones who are actually casing "spells." DKs and rets just have abilities on the spell hit table.. yet we are the only ones without spell hit.

GG Blizzard logic

Ret paladins wield 2-handers, so they need much less hit for their non-spell attacks.

Maybe I'm missing it, but I think they removed the spell hit talent from DKs. There's a talent for 3% hit to one-handed weapons in Frost, but that's actually LESS hit than Enhancement gets.

There's a reason we don't get bonus spell hit. We double dip, since it affects both our spells AND our white hits, for all of the hit rating we get. This isn't a case of us being ignored or broken.

[Imadraenei]

Maybe I'm missing it, but I think they removed the spell hit talent from DKs. There's a talent for 3% hit to one-handed weapons in Frost, but that's actually LESS hit than Enhancement gets.

They did remove the spell hit talent from DKs. It's now passive as part of their "DK spells crit for 200% damage" ability. (Runic Focus). They still get the hit without any investment at all.

[Pope]

We just need a runic focus talent.
Spells critting for 200%, while nerfing mental quickness again would increase the worth of crit on our gear.
Giving us (enhancement shamans) 6, or 9% spell hit would decrease the worth of hit, so we could share more gear with hunters (I'm looking at you, Voltage Source Chestguard)
And we need a way to let haste affect our DPS more. Cooldown reduction of windfury from haste (gear-exclusive haste, not the percentages of our spells), or cooldown reduction on StormStrike, like ret Paladin's talent for crusader strike.

Scaling problem? Not anymore.

[Nitz]

We just need a runic focus talent.
Spells critting for 200%, while nerfing mental quickness again would increase the worth of crit on our gear.
Giving us (enhancement shamans) 6, or 9% spell hit would decrease the worth of hit, so we could share more gear with hunters (I'm looking at you, Voltage Source Chestguard)
And we need a way to let haste affect our DPS more. Cooldown reduction of windfury from haste (gear-exclusive haste, not the percentages of our spells), or cooldown reduction on StormStrike, like ret Paladin's talent for crusader strike.

Scaling problem? Not anymore.

We really scale poorly, yes it would increase Crit value but as much as mastery ? or even hit ? Haste beeing the last wanted stat still :P I wouldn't go for that chestpiece.

On topic: Disapointed with the new build, I was all excited when I saw shaman on the list just to get a tooltip update and a "nerf" to our new pvp ability.

Edit: Oh yeah forgot, 60 yard extend on that Fire Nova! /cheer !

[Tides]

Looking at Enhance from Blizzards PoV we shouldnt realy be expecting anything huge for 4.1 or 4.2 imo. The vast vast majority of enhance shamans aren't people in full 372 and as such they're not aware of the scaling issues, thus Blizzard wont realy be "yelled at" till a while after Firelands comes out and all the not so far progressed Enhance Shamans are in 372 or beyond and they all feel the scaling issues.

Then as usual, we'll get a bandaid that'll last us till the next content patch :P
Just dont get your hopes up

[Charge me Doctor]

missed 4 lava lashes and flame shocks in a row. yaw, i'm lucky. stupid theory crafters with "agi better than hit", we are not feral druids!

[gynshon]

missed 4 lava lashes and flame shocks in a row. yaw, i'm lucky. stupid theory crafters with "agi better than hit", we are not feral druids!

/sigh

Armory link?

[Fojos]

It doesn't matter if it sims a 1000 dps increase. What are you going to do if you miss multiple of lightening bolts / flame shocks / earthshocks etc.. In one given fight? You just lost quite a bit of damage not being spell hit capped.

I know how enh sim works and agility > everything, but only after your 17% spell hit / 26-26 expertise.

You do realise that simulations take those misses into account, right? Agi is always better than hit and expertise, always. The difference is that the simulation is a better player than you are, basically. The only time hit and expertise is actually better is in short fights, where RNG play a large part. In real fights (bosses) it evens out.

Then as usual, we'll get a bandaid that'll last us till the next content patch :P
Just dont get your hopes up

You still don't scale that poorly. You're actually in the middle of the pack in 372 gear.

[wordup]

You still don't scale that poorly. You're actually in the middle of the pack in 372 gear.

I think you'll find we are not, and from personal experience on every heroic fight whilst in pretty close to full 372, I can confirm it, whilst I still get ranked.

[Aertea]

I see the suggestion to drop/lower the Windfury cooldown a lot, while it would help it still wouldn't make haste a viable stat for us. Remember when we were running FT/FT? No 3 second CD there and haste was still our lowest valued stat.

There are ways to make haste viable, but I feel a cooldown reduction could cramp up our rotation a bit much. It would be better fitting to make Crit more viable (200% on spell crit?).

You still don't scale that poorly. You're actually in the middle of the pack in 372 gear.

1.) Going from the top of the pack, to the lower end in 1 tier of progression is really bad.

2.) Middle compared to what? Frost Mages? BM Hunters? Sub Rogues? Drop the specs no one uses and we're in the bottom.

[LyskaWF]

You still don't scale that poorly. You're actually in the middle of the pack in 372 gear.

Thank you for proving that we scale poorly. Where we end up has absolutely nothing to do, on its own, with how well we scale. The fact that we start at the top and move to the bottom proves that we scale quite poorly. Thanks for your post, but you are wrong.

[wordup]

I'd like to see a damage CD in place of seasoned winds, and then have windfury procs reduce the CD by X sec per proc, which could indirectly increase haste scaling, killing two birds with one stone.

Either that, or bring back elemental fury for enhancement, or an execute phase, like flame shock proccing instant lava bursts. So many opportunities to increase our scaling and DPS.

[HazardYo]

So, reading through the laltest (datamined) PTR changes, I noticed that our DW specialization is taking a blow. On live servers it increases all hit by 6%, whereas it no longer increases spell hit on that PTR build.

This was just a tooltip update.
Even on live, it just increased melee hit.

Check it out!

"Apply Aura: Mod Melee & Ranged Hit Chance %
Value: 6"


EDIT: Oh darn, I didn't notice there were 3 pages of this xD
Nevermind!

[Dirtyfist]

Dual wield never increased Spell Hit, only melee hit. It's just a tooltip update (and about time).

This is correct.

[LyskaWF]

I'd like to see a damage CD in place of seasoned winds, and then have windfury procs reduce the CD by X sec per proc, which could indirectly increase haste scaling, killing two birds with one stone.

Either that, or bring back elemental fury for enhancement, or an execute phase, like flame shock proccing instant lava bursts. So many opportunities to increase our scaling and DPS.

A talent that reduces SS/LL CD or allows it to scale with haste would be amazing. We get to hit as hard as warriors once every ten seconds and only if we can stack a totem-based DoT five times... it's pretty dumb IMO. The damage is mediocre in PvE but it's pretty dismal in PvP where burst is *still* king.

[Nitz]

I'd like to see a damage CD in place of seasoned winds, and then have windfury procs reduce the CD by X sec per proc, which could indirectly increase haste scaling, killing two birds with one stone.

I think it would be harder to balance a CD around a "Random" proc. Then again it would add another random factor to enh DPS.
On a side note, I'd love either a "SS increase Maelstrom Weapon to proc by x% for y sec" Which would make MW less random and "Almost" predictable SS > 2 Hits > MWx5 LB. Or make WF procs Nature base like a lot have said and help with the enh "scaling" problem ^_^

[Tides]

Or make WF procs Nature base like a lot have said and help with the enh "scaling" problem ^_^

That wouldnt realy help us with scaling that much. What we want is a reason to get Haste and Crit. Making WF Nature damage, would only drive us ever further into Mastery.

[Murderdoll]

You still don't scale that poorly. You're actually in the middle of the pack in 372 gear.

This is the FIRST TIER OF CONTENT. The scaling issues that Enhance suffers will not be as noticeable in the FIRST TIER OF CONTENT.

Wait 6 months. The Enhance Shamans that are currently high to middle of the pack will go from middle to bottom.

[Nitz]

That wouldnt realy help us with scaling that much. What we want is a reason to get Haste and Crit. Making WF Nature damage, would only drive us ever further into Mastery.

What would you suggest ? Re-Applying the Haste patch from Ulduar ? I tend to agree with you, we should WANT haste and/or crit on gear, right now we avoid it to get hit / Expertise / Mastery to be able to maximise the amount of Agi in our gems slots and enchant (if possible).

Maybe something like, each swing after after you land a critical spell will proc a MW stack or a WF to proc OFF-CD ? Something like that would make Crit much more valuable, I have no numbers, just thinking of possible ideas.