"540+ have 14/14 Normal Experience" for Flex, seriously.

[Axelond]

there is plenty of people who meet the requirement that still needs flex

[Zwergerl]

My alt is 540 and I have 14/14N experience on my main. 540 really isn't that hard to get, although it is rather high for flex... A lot of people on open raid are terrible though. I had a rogue in my group this week doing 60k dps on immersius at the start with timewarp. I know I can just kick people, but I prefer making 10 man groups and not needing to replace right after the first boss.

I had a DK with 25k avg. dps per boss this wednesday...no sockets / enchants , and my favorite - lichbane rune (that yellow one, always outstanding on a dk). Really horrible. i swear it, really bad players always choose lichbane!

my warrior and the rest of the group averaged at 120-200k, depending on boss (armswarri @ sha - omnomnom bladestorm), so everything went smooth nevertheless.

[Deleted]

Not having to deal with such nonsense is exactly the reason why LFR should never be removed in favor of flex. It's just as ridiculous as PUGing ICC was.

[h4rr0d]

My alt is 540 and I have 14/14N experience on my main. 540 really isn't that hard to get, although it is rather high for flex... A lot of people on open raid are terrible though. I had a rogue in my group this week doing 60k dps on immersius at the start with timewarp. I know I can just kick people, but I prefer making 10 man groups and not needing to replace right after the first boss.

For flex raiders, 540 isn't that hard to get if they got the legendary cloak or they got lucky on flex drops. I'm at ~20% drop rate - 7 items from 33 kills + coins, but I got double gloves and helmets, pushing me to staggering 5 items out of 33 loot possibilities (I haven't done LFR this reset yet). I also got 496 pants, but to outweight that, I got lucky in an alt normal raid and got normal shoulders. All in all, I'm at 534 equipped ilvl month into SoO. Sure, I'm getting timeless pants today (gonna hit honored with shaoao), so that will probably bump me over 540, but that's only because I got lucky and received normal difficulty item (and bought the crafted belt)

[Illiterate]

I would rather join a 540 pug than a 510 one full of scrubs.

[Deleted]

Some people (such as myself) want to do Flex for gear on alts or odd pieces their mains are missing. Setting high requirements for the group means I don't have to put up with idiots who don't know how to play the game.

Pretty much this, although I'd imagine it's actually a bit hard to find qualified people for that. Dunno but on my own server, I think it would be hard to set those requirements, if we want to find a pug or 2 that is.

We normally ask for 530 and at least LFR experience and pref. Flex experience and then we require people to log on TS. Don't want to risk getting some turd we have to carry and should we end up with one, we just kick them asap.

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Simple answer: Don't join pugs with ridiculous requirements. There have always been the people who set crazy requirements because they're just running it to hope that extra piece of loot drops and aren't interested in actually treating it like a progression run. Make a note to avoid runs done by those people and move on. It's clearly not the run for you.

Personally I hate the attitude that it's okay to set ridiculous requirements because "their raid, their rules". Outright idiocy can and should be dealt with, not swept under the carpet with a blanket statement excusing that behavior. Unless for some reason this is the only pug available to you, then the best course of action is to ignore it and move on and find a group that's suited to what you are looking for.

If you don't meet the requirements, then no, don't join. But if you do meet the requirements, you can be guaranteed a smooth and fast run. That's why people set the requirements so high, cause nobody with that ilvl and experience wants to carry random people who may or may not be completely durp.

[willemh]

I recently resubbed, so I'm behind gear-wise and joined a guild the other day and their main tank offered to set up some Flex runs to bring me up to speed gear-wise. I'm currenlty 507, I was #2 on the meters through every run (against all the other dps who were 540+ baddies), not one wipe, not one issue.

People (especially pugs) like to use gear as a crutch for stupidity.

Then again, I suppose if it takes pugs to have 540+ gear to pull near the same damage as I can in just over 500, I can understand...

You underestimate the difference gear makes. A 540 geared baddie can outdps a 500 geared pro with his eyes closed. I would like to see the logs of your run because I find it hard to believe you any dps in gear 40 ilvls lower would be outperformed unless they have an activity below 50% (meaning they were afk half the fight)

[mikencarly]

This is why i say fuck the heirlooms ill just stick to my l looking for raids mode instead atleast until i max out on gear from there then open my own flex runs.

[Dangg]

When someone is 14/14 normal +540 ilvl themselves and needs just 1 item out of the whole flex is perfectly reasonable have high requirements for a fast run.
No need to waste time.

[Archimand]

my runs are for 535 ilvl ppl they always fast and smooth and full of ppl that are there either to get certian pieces for main/alt or just for valor/testing stuff

its perfectly reasonable to ask for certain ilvl to make the run

[kamuimac]

the first or 2nd openraid group i have seen after this reset consisted off people with 555+ gear and group filled up in less then minute - suppply&demand - if there weren't a ton of geared people there already waiting to get in the requirements wouldnt be so high.
have seen plenty of >560 people looking for groups there on wedensday so why take a 520 itlv when u can get 550 one ? -_-

and its not only about those 1 or 2 last pieces which coul be possible upgrades for MS plenty of people try to keep up with OS too to stay competitive in guild and not sit out progress.

time is not made out of rubber if i spend 8-9 hours weekly on normal/hc progress i cba to spend more then 3 when flex will be full open while famring it for OS gear. and i love how its divided into wing once i get all i need from certain wing - never gonna do it again to save some time unless im gonna use this time to run one of alts through it.

[Louis CK]

And you are also one of those people whining next month "there's nothing more to do!"...

1) I've never once complained about having nothing to do in the game. I don't even do most of what is offered. I raid, a couple other things and that's it.

2) It's not about getting through the content as fast as possible, it's about not extending the time it takes due to being in a group of people who don't really know what they're doing. I just choose not to spend 4-5 hours doing something that realistically takes 2 (times are just placeholders for example purposes).

And as I said in my previous post if they, as a group, decide that that is the pace at which they want to run, and every one is okay with it, more power to them. I'm not sure why an opinion posted along with an encouragement to the poster from me warrants a sarcastic, rude response from you, but that's fine

Best of luck to you. I'm sure you're a joy to play with.

- - - Updated - - -

You underestimate the difference gear makes. A 540 geared baddie can outdps a 500 geared pro with his eyes closed. I would like to see the logs of your run because I find it hard to believe you any dps in gear 40 ilvls lower would be outperformed unless they have an activity below 50% (meaning they were afk half the fight)

I'm not sure who logs Flex pugs, but I'll ask next time just for you. But you are incorrect, because this is a common occurrance in pugs. Baddies get gear all the time and have no clue what to do with it.

[arel00]

I would rather join a 540 pug than a 510 one full of scrubs.

510 vs 540 |= scrubs vs good players.
I've played with plenty of undergeared people that perform better than others with an higher ilevel. Believe it or not, there's always the scrub that gets his ass carried through normal mode while being incompetent, with the result that you'll get an idiot with 550 and a competent player with 500. And that is without counting alts.

You underestimate the difference gear makes. A 540 geared baddie can outdps a 500 geared pro with his eyes closed. I would like to see the logs of your run because I find it hard to believe you any dps in gear 40 ilvls lower would be outperformed unless they have an activity below 50% (meaning they were afk half the fight)

You have no idea what you're talking about. Seriously.
Put a good (for real) player against the average retard and you'll see wonders despite 40 ilevels gear difference. High class players mop the floor with everyone else on a regular basis.

[Hyve]

Flex & Normal Mode are almost identical, the only difference is a small drop in difficulty. Unlike Looking for Raid, Flex hasn't got any fewer mechanics, and doesn't go any easier on the team, it simply doesn't do as much damage.

Asking for a smooth run in Flex will mean people need to know how the raid operates, and if you've done 14 / 14 within Normal Mode, you'll have a breeze in Flex!

[Airwaves]

Flex & Normal Mode are almost identical, the only difference is a small drop in difficulty. Unlike Looking for Raid, Flex hasn't got any fewer mechanics, and doesn't go any easier on the team, it simply doesn't do as much damage.

Asking for a smooth run in Flex will mean people need to know how the raid operates, and if you've done 14 / 14 within Normal Mode, you'll have a breeze in Flex!

Small drop? What? FLEXI is bloody easier then lfr.

[arel00]

Small drop? What? FLEXI is boody easier then lfr.

Easier than LFR? Get your facts straight. Did you see Thock LFR? His blood frenzy phase doesn't even oneshot people, contrary to any other difficulty. SoO LFR is a complete joke, at least Flex requires people to get the mechanics right.

As for comparing it to normal mode it is a -big- drop ihmo, not just a small one. On that I agree.

[nehunter]

The sad thing that nobody is seeing apparently is this:
- These requirements are the only reason LFR was added in the first place. If you let humans do the groups they will just ask for higher and higher iLvl this happend in ICC ( remember gearscore addon?). Lets face it everyone wants a fast run in a pug. You don't do progression with random people.

The problems was always that this blocks new players and community seems happy about this. Eventually you will find a group that asks less and still clears it, try befriending that group and join their guild as casual.

[barackohmama]

What's wrong with wanting an easy run?

Then again, it's Open Raid... do you really expect much?

The logic is tho that they are basically asking to get carried by much higher ilvl players. if everyone had 540 ilvl most would proably just need a few pieces as upgrades. Its silly if everyone would only have like one need piece in the entire instance dont you think? running with lower ilvl is actually better use of time since you have chance on more items. It might take a little bit longer yes, but the reward is greater aswell, so it evens out. The actual requirement to do SoO flex if you're not retarded is much lower. ilvl 510 is probably fine.

[rzzr]

The one thing I have noticed is people are a lot more polite in flex raids compared to LFR, much less moaning. I suspect this is due to the system used by Openraid where you can down mark a player who is being a pain. Being down marked enough probably means you will never get invited on any Openraid again.

[barackohmama]

What makes this system sad is it actually filters really good players and players alts just because of gear. I would take a ilvl 510-520 char with excellent skills(yes there are many of these actually) over a ilvl 550 with sloppy reactions and fucked up rotation any time. But now these players never get a chance. But thats why I also try to make my own groups for flex. I usually search for ilvl 520 chars that are skilled. Often It surprises me that gear is just a small part of the equation that makes a good player. And yep ive done runs where we oneshotted pretty much everything in part 1-3.