The woes of dead realms, connected realms and the Paid Realm Transfer.

[wych]

A realm is dead or well populated for one reason, players migrated away from or to it.
Yes, it is a player problem.
That is a fact.
Blizzard did not move a player, they did.

If a realm community sucks so much that people move away from it, who else made it that way but the players in it.
Something makes players move away from a realm in the first place, something that does not happen on every realm.
Therefore it is players that start the ball rolling in the first place.

What would happen if transfers were not an option ? How many would simply stop playing if they had a substantial time investment in one or more character on a certain realm and had no option of getting out without starting again.

Transfers cost as it should not be a trivial decision.
But the fact that realms can be hit so substantially as to kill their population shows quite clearly that the cost is acceptable to enough of the playerbase.

You're falling into the trap of blaming individuals.

A casual player logs in 2-3 times a week, and over the years his realm completely dies, it's not his fault so why should he suffer?


No the cost was never "acceptable", it was just a hit you had to take because Blizzard are slow as f*ck and wanted to grind out every penny they could before realising it was causing players to just leave the game.

I was stuck on a dying realm, I couldn't find raid guilds, trade got about 2-3 messages per minute on it, the world was empty.

My choices either were:
-Sit on my dead realm and feel like i'm playing a single player game
-Reroll and leave my character i've been playing for over 7 years and grown attached to
-Quit
-Take the slap in the face and pay the money

I was incredibly close to permanently quitting the game but in the end I begrudgingly paid the money.

Now you can pretend to be Blizzard's financial adviser and say that's great business from Blizzard, but it's a horrible thing to experience as a player. I watched my friends quit, the top guilds move to the couple top realms were you could recruit heavily geared players and places like Goldshire eventually become barren.

[Normie]

A realm with 6k listings in the AH is not even close to dead. It's on the low side of "medium."

So I don't know what you're complaining about. You're certainly not complaining about what you think you're complaining about.

[Pann]

The irony is that the players are the ones who made the decision to stop paying.

I am honestly gobsmacked at your reply. Are you seriously suggesting that producing a product that causes you lose almost half of your customers is a good reason to charge those that remain extra to enjoy the product as they used to?

[rhorle]

-Take the slap in the face and pay the money

So why is it that creating a new character after a 7 year investment isn't a slap in the face as well? Why does a character transfer have to be free?

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I am honestly gobsmacked at your reply. Are you seriously suggesting that producing a product that causes you lose almost half of your customers is a good reason to charge those that remain extra to enjoy the product as they used to?

Those that remain are not being charged extra, as paid character services existed prior to Cataclysm and are not required to enjoy the product.

[wych]

So why is it that creating a new character after a 7 year investment isn't a slap in the face as well? Why does a character transfer have to be free?

They're both slaps in the face, I never suggested otherwise. Being forced to leave my character behind or pay money is like picking a kick in the bollocks or a punch to the chin.

Blizzard should never have let it go on for so long as they did

[Pann]

Those that remain are not being charged extra, as paid character services existed prior to Cataclysm and are not required to enjoy the product.

That is mighty twisted logic you are using there! If your realm dies, which many have, you are faced with the choice of having a worse experience than before or paying extra to transfer.

[rhorle]

That is mighty twisted logic you are using there! If your realm dies, which many have, you are faced with the choice of having a worse experience than before or paying extra to transfer.

But why should you get to transfer for free? It is an extra service.

[MrHappy]

WoD cross realm normal and heroic content
OQ /open raid today for flex

[eschatological]

I think connected realms are the solution, they're just not doing them quick enough.

My main is on a medium-low PvE server, after transferring there from a low population PvP server. I have like 5 90s on this PvE population, but when I stopped raiding, I realized the realm is really dead and it's pointless to do anything on it.

Meanwhile, my old PvP server was connected to 4 other servers. A realm which was so dead that you could log in in Org all night and never hear a word (on a Horde-dominated server) is suddenly a much better place to be, and the 7 85s I had languishing there are now all on their way to 90.

[Pann]

But why should you get to transfer for free? It is an extra service.

Why should Blizzard get my money, let alone more of it, when my gaming experience, through no fault of my own, has got worse?

[rhorle]

Why should Blizzard get my money, let alone more of it, when my gaming experience, through no fault of my own, has got worse?

That doesn't answer my question. Why should you get a service for free? You picked your server when you began. You continue to pay to play. Why should you get to transfer for free just because you no longer like your server for what ever reason?

They are taking steps to consolidate servers which means you have no basis for free server transfers because Blizzard is doing something about dead realms. They just are not doing what you want, the ability to transfer to a high popularity realm for free.

[Pann]

That doesn't answer my question. Why should you get a service for free? You picked your server when you began. You continue to pay to play. Why should you get to transfer for free just because you no longer like your server for what ever reason?

They are taking steps to consolidate servers which means you have no basis for free server transfers because Blizzard is doing something about dead realms. They just are not doing what you want, the ability to transfer to a high popularity realm for free.

It does answer your question you just don't want to accept the answer.

[rhorle]

It does answer your question you just don't want to accept the answer.

So you deserve a free transfer because other players decided, of their own free will, to stop playing? How can Blizzard force people to stay subscribed? Where does that sense of entitlement end? Players stopped playing so I can't pug like I used to, I should get Free epics to make up for my loss of enjoyment. And so on and so on...

[Pann]

So you deserve a free transfer because other players decided, of their own free will, to stop playing? How can Blizzard force people to stay subscribed? Where does that sense of entitlement end? Players stopped playing so I can't pug like I used to, I should get Free epics to make up for my loss of enjoyment. And so on and so on...

Why does Blizzard deserve more of my money when they have produced a product that has caused other players to decide to leave? Where does their sense of entitlement end? Players stopped playing and they can't earn money like they used, therefore they should get free money to make up for the loss of their money. And so on and so on...

[rhorle]

Why does Blizzard deserve more of my money when they have produced a product that has caused other players to decide to leave? Where does their sense of entitlement end? Players stopped playing and they can't earn money like they used, therefore they should get free money to make up for the loss of their money. And so on and so on...

You would have a point if Blizzard created paid account services after the loss of subscribers. They existed since 2006 (when paid characters transfers launched) and charge for such a service is not to make up for the loss of revenue from subscribers. Players also leave all the time. The reason why Blizzard subscription numbers kept climbing was that their new subscribers was greater then the amount of people that quit. So that argument also doesn't work because players have always been quitting the game even when the game was at peak subscribers.

Blizzard is taking action for solutions that don't require you to use a paid service. Things don't happen instantly however unless you pay. And what is wrong with paying for convenience? You can pay to transfer now to a higher population realm or you can wait for the connections to be completed or any of the other ways Blizzard has of enticing players to certain servers.

[Pann]

You would have a point if Blizzard created paid account services after the loss of subscribers. They existed since 2006 (when paid characters transfers launched) and charge for such a service is not to make up for the loss of revenue from subscribers. Players also leave all the time. The reason why Blizzard subscription numbers kept climbing was that their new subscribers was greater then the amount of people that quit. So that argument also doesn't work because players have always been quitting the game even when the game was at peak subscribers.

Blizzard is taking action for solutions that don't require you to use a paid service. Things don't happen instantly however unless you pay. And what is wrong with paying for convenience? You can pay to transfer now to a higher population realm or you can wait for the connections to be completed or any of the other ways Blizzard has of enticing players to certain servers.

When the service was introduced is irrelevant. The fact is that many players have had their gaming experience negatively effected through no fault of their own due to falling realm populations and it is Blizzard's responsibility to ensure they provide their customers with an enjoyable experience if they want to continue receiving money from their customers.

Whether connected realms is a solution to the problem remains to be seen but this does not change that they are being slowly rolled out and that for many this is several years too late.

[rhorle]

When the service was introduced is irrelevant.

It is not irrelevant. Why should Blizzard stop charging for the service just because people stopped liking their product? Blizzard is ensuring that their customers are provided with an enjoyable experience, which is why they are merging servers.

If an airline fails to sell all the tickets for a flight, should they stop charging for meals on that flight? If a gas station doesn't get enough customers in a day should they give gas away for free? If you get all your work done should boss make you work for free?

[Tharkkun]

It wasn't the players that drove almost half the player base away in two expansions.

The volatile player base plays a big part in people quitting.

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They're both slaps in the face, I never suggested otherwise. Being forced to leave my character behind or pay money is like picking a kick in the bollocks or a punch to the chin.

Blizzard should never have let it go on for so long as they did

It wasn't a huge problem until Cataclysm. So Blizzard created the tech through CRZ and tested it throughout MOP. Now they expanded the functionality and called it connected realms. You know many people liked low pop realms and still do. As they say watch what you wish for...there's downsides as well to medium/high pop realms.

[blackblade]

It's not blizzard fault your realm is dead, it's 100% yours.

You did nothing when it was active, you sit back and just watched everyone else play and interact with people.

You did nothing to get invovled and form a community.

Now everyone has left to other realms where there is more people doing what they want to do and you now complain it's "dead".

The issue is you.. not blizzard.

This reminded me of a little story.

Near the end of wrath, our server's raiding progress was dwindling for some server-transfer-drama reasons I won't get into.

Anyway, A guy in my guild and I got into discussions, and he eventually confessed that he was planning to transfer off server. He was a good player, so naturally, I tried to talk him out of it, arguing that the server's going through a lull due to the next expansion coming up, and that a large volume of players may return for the xpac, as they normally do.

He agreed that my line of thinking was sound, and I felt like I had managed to save myself at least one more raider coming out of the conversation.

Not even a week later he transferred anyway.

Involvement or in the community or not, people who have the means to jump off a ship they perceive to be sinking, will almost certainly do so instead of waiting it out to see if things stabilize. Unless IRL friends are involved, and in some cases even that isn't enough, people will generally serve themselves instead of heeding some guy on the internet trying to be a bro.

[Pann]

It is not irrelevant. Why should Blizzard stop charging for the service just because people stopped liking their product? Blizzard is ensuring that their customers are provided with an enjoyable experience, which is why they are merging servers.

If an airline fails to sell all the tickets for a flight, should they stop charging for meals on that flight? If a gas station doesn't get enough customers in a day should they give gas away for free? If you get all your work done should boss make you work for free?

No-one is saying that they should stop charging for the service however they should not charge those that find themselves on realms that were previously populated but are now empty to move to more populated realms.

People have been complaining about low or unbalanced populations for years if Blizzard wanted to ensure that they provided their customers with an enjoyable experience they would not have waited so long to address the problem and they would not have allowed realms like EU-Sporaggar to get into such a sorry state.

If an airline fails to sell all the tickets for a flight that is the airline's problem I don't know about you but whenever I have taken a flight reaching my destination has been my priority rather than having someone to sit next to. Again, this would be the gas station's issue to deal with when visit a gas station I am going to fill my car up not socialise with other drivers in fact I would prefer there to be less customers when I visit so I do not have to queue. These analogies are getting silly now, if I finished all my work why would my boss want me to work for free? I have exceeded his expectations, surely he would want to reward me rather than punish me, and by the nature of finishing all my work I would have no work left to do.