Rise of The Hutt Cartel: First Digital Expansion

[Deleted]

As far as the level cap, then why even have levels? We all might as well start out the same, with absolutely no level or anything.

Levels are there to create a sense of progression, how is this question relevant to you claiming a level cap somehow has a highly intricate part in making something an expansion no matter how little actual content it has?

Would you consider the addition of a house behind some gates in a town with one quest line with 3 quests about housekeeping an expansion as long as it came with a new level cap? We keep the gates closed to anyone who hasn't purchased the "expansion" of course.

[Argroth]

He's not paying half as much as you.

You pay $20 for the expanion.

A subscriber pays $10 for the expansion and $13 to $15 for the month (they haven't stated a free month comes with this), this mean a subscriber pays $23 to $25 for full access.

You pay between $3 and $5 less for limited access, but you still get full access to the story of this expansion.

Stop playing with logical fallacies.

I don't think that is quite right....

[Repefe]

See, opinions. Personally, I don't care about F2P, I like the Cartel Market, and it didn't bother me at all that they put Life Day items in the Cartel Market instead of making them available in game somehow. It also doesn't bother me that the expansion costs $10, WoW expansions cost $45 so it was way cheaper by comparison.

Yep. If you are a subscriber and don't mind throwing extra money at BW every other month ... you have nothing to complain about.

[papajohn4]

See, opinions. Personally, I don't care about F2P, I like the Cartel Market, and it didn't bother me at all that they put Life Day items in the Cartel Market instead of making them available in game somehow. It also doesn't bother me that the expansion costs $10, WoW expansions cost $45 so it was way cheaper by comparison.

what we discuss from the start til now is not about the price of an expansion, but if the "Rise of The Hutt Cartel" can considered as expansion or not. Their problem is not that they do not want to pay for "expansion" but they do not believe this is worth the label "expansion". We discuss value for money here, and some people may seem its ok some people seem to not feel it worthy. You seem to play with the "words" rather than actual discussion of the Rise of The Hutt Cartel content.

As for me, said it earlier some pages before, I don't bother too much and don't know if I buy it either. If the current time I am playing star wars and have fun I will buy it. Although I consider it as DLC and in no way as a proper expansion like Rift, WOW and Lotro...

[Kuja]

Digital expansion.. sounds like things are not going so well.

[Arlee]

Digital expansion.. sounds like things are not going so well.

Actually boxed versions of things is quickly going the way of the dinosaur. There are plenty of other things that are real indicators of possible issues though so grabbing onto one that is probably actually going to be the future in MMO's is probably not the best choice.

[Armourboy]

I'm sure the price for the Hutt Cartel will come down at some point in the future. WoW would never offer a new expansion for less than their usual price for the first few months.

MoP has been out roughly 2-3 months, they are offering it right now for $30, thats $10 less. Also right now you can buy everything up to MoP for $15 bucks for a combined initial cost of $45. Thats all of revamped Vanilla, Outlands, Northrend, Cata, and MoP with zero restrictions. Honestly, Jade Forest alone had as much content as Hoth, Voss, or any other planet and there are 5 more just like it + the daily grind area in the Vale. I'm sorry but looking at the total cost and figuring out the value, I can come up with which one is the better value fairly easily.

---------- Post added 2012-12-21 at 09:39 PM ----------

Actually boxed versions of things is quickly going the way of the dinosaur. There are plenty of other things that are real indicators of possible issues though so grabbing onto one that is probably actually going to be the future in MMO's is probably not the best choice.

Yeah, I think even MoP for WoW had most of it sales come from the Digital version. The only people that still buy the box are people who just really gotta have a box for whatever reason or are buying collector editions.

[notorious98]

I wonder if they thought that if they didn't increase the level cap then people might not go experience the new planet's quest line... and it was also probably a bit of "getting new levels is exciting" thought process going on.

I can definitely understand the "new levels" mindset, but (in my opinion), it's a little too early for a level increase. There are still so many things that need to be worked out in this game. But I believe you're wrong as far as experiencing it. To be honest, they could have gated the endgame content revolving around that planet until you had finished the storylines. Unfortunately, that would likely necessitate a better achievement system. Ultimately, though, I believe most of the people who are currently still subscribed would have definitely gone to experience the continuation of the story.

---------- Post added 2012-12-21 at 04:58 PM ----------

Yeah, I think even MoP for WoW had most of it sales come from the Digital version. The only people that still buy the box are people who just really gotta have a box for whatever reason or are buying collector editions.

I bought the box version of MoP (the wife was like "I miss WoW"). The reason behind it was that I bought it in November and didn't want to have to wait for it to download. But I agree. Box sales are going the way of the Commodore 64.

[zeropeorth]

I'd like to know, if you pre-order this, do you get access to the pre-order vendor, or a new pre-order vendor might pop up with different color crystals.

I'd be interested in paying the $10 and pre-ordering if so, just-in-case I come back. Just had a baby and she is more important than the game, but would like cheap crystal access at low levels if/when I do come back (though not liking their pay model, nothing really for subs for the holiday, just cartel crap).

Is a planet worth $10? Should they have given this for free to subs? The first part, we'll have to see, the second part, I think so.

As others have said, it isn't about the $10, as much as it is 'here is content in good faith, for those who've been dedicated and continued their subscription through the rough times and our F2P transition that took away from content we would've otherwise provided'
To keep people from abusing (subbing and cancelling after they get the 'xpac') ... if you drop your sub, you lose access to most things, just like F2P model currently is without unlocks from cartel market, that could be available on GTN (subbers or non-subbers buying it doesn't matter, income is income).

I'm disappointed in both BW and Blizz, I think they both could be doing better, and I think they both have a big brother pulling strings ... just one big brother is a bigger douche and has more control than the other.

I was all for the cartel market at first, but, all the life day shit on the market made me lose my faith. I expected an event like the Rakghouls with some silly item like 'Use: make snow fall around you for 3 mins - 5 min cooldown' ... In fact, the Rakghoul event, is something I expected to see similar things to regularly ... it made the world feel more dynamic, going to fleet and hearing warning messages ... this is something games need to do more of, it makes you feel you get your sub's worth ... I like Rift, but invasions are too common to truly feel 'dynamic' ... regular world events (non-holiday, but plagues, invasions, war efforts (opp faction invading your fleet), world bosses stomping your capital city) makes you excited, and it is a hell of a lot better than the old '/camp SW/Org' WoW boringness ... an example for cata, they could've had Ultraxion hitting the capitals, wiping out a random section, and having twilight drakes swarming the other sections. To make it interesting, throw a slight recolor and have a special drake drop, to get people involved in clearing the trash city. To hell with the AH/mailbox campers, they can do that the other 95% of the time.

Instead, we have Blizz that nearly sat on their asses for cata, and EA thinking they could capitalize minimal effort, max profits in a similar way ... while Trion is doing the playerbase an actual service. I wish EA emulated Rift; though they are too lazy and profit hungry for that.

I hope they come out of their coma, SWtOR IS a great game, but it could be -so- much better. If I was a billionaire, I'd buy the damn game off of them overpriced, and make it work. I hate seeing something that has such great potential being ruined by suits looking at how to run lean, that doesn't work in this industry, and doesn't really work well (for quality, longevity) in other industries either. Maybe their sports series, but not for MMOs. (Blizz is lazy, but only compared to their past standards, and the content push of Trion)

I think people bicker too much on semantics and take opinions too seriously, winning an argument on technicality or telling people they are wrong is poor sport; understanding, relating, expression, and discussion works so much better ... don't be mad at each other, it is EA doing the snow job ... even if you are mostly happy, you should be able to understand why others aren't so much.

[RoninaThorstone]

Keep in mind that some games increase level caps every few months. But I don't think swtor is designed to do this.
For one, the game I am think about doesn't charge you and the game is centered around grouping up constantly. Its basically a dungeon crawler game so they can pump out tons of content and increase the caps constantly.

Just... too much wrong with all of this.

[Crimsonfiend76]

I find it disturbing and I'm sure I heard/read that there was at least 2 years worth of continued player story VO. It seems there is continual and blatant BS at every corner that I no longer take anything they say at face value. I was considering coming back and some point and "might" at some point I've set a 6 month marker from f2p launch as my target to see what direction the game is headed. I'm sure not warm and fuzzy at this point for a return.

yeah, im in the same boat here. already planned since this past august to come back to swtor after i eventually got burned out/bored with pandaria...aka dailycraft, and there was new content in the form of an extension to the character storylines. now im not completely sure why im still subbed?

as for why so many negative posts? i think it has less to do with the info available on this glorified content patch and are more a result from the broken promises and bad will over the course of the last 12 months imo.

[Valeron]

Digital expansion.. sounds like things are not going so well.

EA has been doing digital DLC for their games for quite a while now. This is pretty much par for the course for them.

[Kelimbror]

Keep in mind that some games increase level caps every few months. But I don't think swtor is designed to do this

This is the exact reason I said they don't have a long term plan for this game. Might as well burn through 100 levels and get everyone's money now, instead of drawing the process out and actually creating content for those levels out over 5 years.

Box sales are going the way of the Commodore 64.

My first computer *sniff* I was in diapers, but I still remember it.

[Edge-]

This is the exact reason I said they don't have a long term plan for this game. Might as well burn through 100 levels and get everyone's money now, instead of drawing the process out and actually creating content for those levels out over 5 years.

Don't worry bro, they've got a 15 year plan.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/g...Year-Plan.html

[Valeron]

Don't worry bro, they've got a 15 year plan.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/g...Year-Plan.html

Was that before they fired everyone?

[Draknalor186]

btw just a question.. what would happen to my 8 toons if i went f2p? would they just delete everyone but 2 or what =P?

[Alvito]

Keep in mind that some games increase level caps every few months. But I don't think swtor is designed to do this.
For one, the game I am think about doesn't charge you and the game is centered around grouping up constantly. Its basically a dungeon crawler game so they can pump out tons of content and increase the caps constantly.

Just... too much wrong with all of this.

They seem to be completely missing the fact that they are offering far too little content at the price of making all previous content obsolete. The new planet and story line could be huge and amazing, it will not be enough to make of for the rather large loss of the current lvl 50 content on top of splitting the realms into different sects. We already have a divide of f2p, preferred and sub players, now we will see them split between 2 versions of the game. The end result long queue times and unhappy ppl. SWTOR is becoming more and more like that absentee junkie parent you hope is actually clean this time, then they crap all over your hopes.

---------- Post added 2012-12-21 at 04:19 PM ----------

Don't worry bro, they've got a 15 year plan.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/g...Year-Plan.html

They had to have meant minutes and that has passed.

[Kelimbror]

Don't worry bro, they've got a 15 year plan.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/g...Year-Plan.html

Can't see that article right now for some reason, but I saw another site that summarized where they said 17 world (planets) at launch and possibly 500 by 2025. That's the best joke I've heard this year.

In other news, Southern Methodist University has a game development program called 'Guildhall'. This video is like...an anti advertisement for going to that school. It's awesome how he says he's hired tons of graduates from there and that Star Wars would have been in big trouble without those designers. We now have more breadcrumbs as to why this went so wrong.

Don't blame BiowarEA, blame SMU.

[zerocarbs]

They should have got rid of subs all together and fully converted to F2P. Now it's just a big mess. This is not an expansion. Where are the new game mechanics? Where's the advancement of the class stories? I would not be surprised if they had this content in the works before the game launched. Then when things started not going well they sat on it. Because they figured they could add 5 levels, a few spells, and then charge for it. I know they are trying to run a business but it's like they have no more love for their product anymore. They are just trying to squeeze as much money out of it as possible.

[Deleted]

Can't see that article right now for some reason, but I saw another site that summarized where they said 17 world (planets) at launch and possibly 500 by 2025. That's the best joke I've heard this year.

That was James Ohlen at a panel show pre-launch saying the quote about 500 planets. It was possibly the most sarcastic tone i've ever heard. The whole audience laughed as most got the intended joke...some didn't and wrote articles showing to the world how much can fly over ones head if one is bad enough a journalist.

That's the problem with misinformed online articles...people at the time laugh it off but as the articles never get 'fixed'...15 months pass and someone innocent (Kitty) reads said article and believes it.

The biggest joke for me in 2011 was reading how many people actually took James Ohlen's joke seriously. It was one of those cases where a /facepalm is woefully inadequate.

The math was simple 500 planets by 2025 would equate to 1 new planet every 10 days...for 15 years. Now try and picture the faces of those who honestly believed that was what Ohlen literally meant. 1 Planet every 10 days for 15 years.

This has nothing against Kitty as I'm guessing he never saw the E3 panel of 2011. He found an article and believed it. Just reminds me of how that very article made many of us laugh out loud in 2011 but for a very different reason.

To quote myself and others from the official forums: It was a joke, the devs even said it was a joke not long after. Plenty of reasons to blame BW for this and that. No need to get annoyed over something that was declared a joke at the time.

EDIT: It was Comic con 2011 July 2011...ah, the hope I had for the game back then.