How Much More Can We Take? (U.S Politics Thread)

[lawow74]

Unless you can stop the runaway escalation of buying influence with campaign donations, break the calcified stalemate both parties have become and alleviate the need to have so much money to even run a campaign for political office, I see nothing that can really be done to change the situation.

The simple fact is, most people don't give two shits as long as their day-to-day is comfortable. Politicians know that and they'll do whatever they need to in order to keep it that way. Short of an economic collapse, such as the world going off the US Dollar as the international trade standard, I don't see it turning around.

[Azrile]

I don't know what the answer is, but I really am fucking tired of this shit. I don't see why it should be too much to ask that politicians do their jobs (ie represent the interests of the people) and that we don't allow corporations to run the country at the expense of its citizens.

The problem is the House of Representatives ARE representing their districts. This is the whole secret of why we are dysfunctional now.. it is because of redistricting. Every 10 years, districts are redrawn and get crazier and crazier.. Most districts are like 90-10% as far as party split because they have been drawn to be that way. What does it mean? that if you are a Republican, your district is 90% Republican and the only way you can lose an election is during the primary if someone is even more to the right than you are. There is no reason for a politician to EVER move towards the middle once they are a representative. It is why the house is so polarized, because of the way districts are drawn. A Republican representative never worries about losing his seat to a democrate, his biggest fear is that the Tea Party puts someone in the primary against him that is further to the right than he is.

If they amended the constitution to force districts to have at least a reasonable geometry it would go a long way to help moderate the House, but the way it is now, they can draw these crazy maps.

It is the same reason why congress always has like a 15% approval rating, yet 90% of incumbents win...

[Annoroth]

In a nutshell, yes, that is exactly what the shutdown was for. The Senate wanted Obamacare to pass, the House didn’t. Why was it so hard to understand?

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Obamacare has been half assed the entire time. The Republicans weren’t exactly against it to begin with also. The House wanted to revise and rebuild onto Obamacare to better the plan going forward. All it needed was a year or two longer to hash out all the BS it had in it, but instead we hastily past it through to keep the shutdown from prolonging. It was piss poor leadership on everyone.

I'm legitimately concerned that this poster believes that the PPACA was passed following the shutdown.

[breadisfunny]

A better question is - how long will it take before the states decide "enough is enough" and separate.

If that happens.. I don't want to be around to see it.

the south would fall in less than a decade. they dont have the resources to support themselves.

[Sorrior]

It can't be fixed in a democratic system unless an extremely gifted individual with a force of will unlike anything we have seen in our lifetimes (you guys who are over 100 might have seen one) is propelled to power with such popularity that he can get essentially whatever he wants done despite operating within a democratic system (and even then it would only be "fixed" depending on his intentions, quite likely not truly fixed). I don't see a great chance of that happening at all in the near future much less it happening to an individual who would use the power given to him to truly fix the nation. All that is left is to wait for what is all but inevitable.

When the current order comes collapsing down around us due to the mass stupidity of those in power and those who put the ones in power into their place, we must be ready to pick up the pieces and reforge a new order. Once you realize this, a certain degree of peace with the current situation can be obtained as you know that you do potentially the most important job there is to do; you wait and watch, ready to serve when needed most for the good of all when others will not and when all is in peril. Be ready for when you can truely make a difference.

Happened before....FDR....But as I said the second coming of FDR is about our only hopem

[Palmz]

I'm legitimately concerned that this poster believes that the PPACA was passed following the shutdown.

No, but try again.

[mvaliz]

A better question is - how long will it take before the states decide "enough is enough" and separate.

If that happens.. I don't want to be around to see it.

They tried that once. It didn't go over to well...

I would say they won't do that if they studied history... but the problem is that requires reading a history book, and I honestly am not sure they have - or are only reading a modified specific version they like/approve of and skip over chapters like "The civil war".

[Rukentuts]

the south would fall in less than a decade. they dont have the resources to support themselves.

They'd blame the moochers obviously.

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They tried that once. It didn't go over to well...

I would say they won't do that if they studied history... but the problem is that requires reading a history book, and I honestly am not sure they have - or are only reading a modified specific version they like/approve of and skip over chapters like "The civil war".

The USA's mistake was not letting them leave, and letting them murder hundreds of thousands of our people over it to boot.

[mvaliz]

the south would fall in less than a decade. they dont have the resources to support themselves.

And yes... they totally would. I'd even go so far as to say they'd fall within 6 months...

Because we're a global economy now. If a Civil War happened, it wouldn't be just America's North vs America's South - it would be the American South vs the American North and their entire United Nations allies.

[Deleted]

Stop voting for the same 2 parties, vote for a third one out of protest, if enough people do it then they will get the hint.

I tried that.
We ended up with a ConDem Coalition, which is more conservative and Lib Dem, and I would not have voted for conservatives in any way shape or form.

[Pitkanen]

The problem is the House of Representatives ARE representing their districts. This is the whole secret of why we are dysfunctional now.. it is because of redistricting. Every 10 years, districts are redrawn and get crazier and crazier.. Most districts are like 90-10% as far as party split because they have been drawn to be that way. What does it mean? that if you are a Republican, your district is 90% Republican and the only way you can lose an election is during the primary if someone is even more to the right than you are. There is no reason for a politician to EVER move towards the middle once they are a representative. It is why the house is so polarized, because of the way districts are drawn. A Republican representative never worries about losing his seat to a democrate, his biggest fear is that the Tea Party puts someone in the primary against him that is further to the right than he is.

If they amended the constitution to force districts to have at least a reasonable geometry it would go a long way to help moderate the House, but the way it is now, they can draw these crazy maps.

It is the same reason why congress always has like a 15% approval rating, yet 90% of incumbents win...

Yup. And if you are house dem it's not really any different, your seat is just as safe. 85% of house votes were won by over a 10% margin! 66% by over a 20% margin. My biggest fear is that the republicans won't compromise on revenue at all for however long, the dems take the house at some point, then the house dems won't make big enough cuts to the big programs and we still don't end up solving the revenue and entitlements issues.

[mvaliz]

The USA's mistake was not letting them leave, and letting them murder hundreds of thousands of our people over it to boot.

I'm not sure I'd be sold on the idea of having them leave as a mistake...

It makes sense when you say "I don't want to be around a psychotic person in my life" and you push them way. It's a WHOLE other thing when you say "I don't like these psychotic people, and I'm going to put them all together in a house right next door to me and hope they play safe and stick to themselves..."

And lets not forget resource values as well... South is great food growing states, and the North has serious economic/travel/business abilities.

It's almost as if (Gasp!) we're, like, all connected somehow, and one is not mooching off the other - but are working in a system of playing to each other's strengths to compensate for each other's weaknesses!? :P

[Rukentuts]

I'm not sure I'd be sold on the idea of having them leave as a mistake...

It makes sense when you say "I don't want to be around a psychotic person in my life" and you push them way. It's a WHOLE other thing when you say "I don't like these psychotic people, and I'm going to put them all together in a house right next door to me and hope they play safe and stick to themselves..."

And lets not forget resource values as well... South is great food growing states, and the North has serious economic/travel/business abilities.

It's like (Gasp!) we're all connected somehow, and one is not mooching off the other - but are working in a system of playing to each other's strengths!? :P

From the very beginning these people have done nothing but hold us back. If they want to leave I say good riddance. We have more than enough to get by on our own.

[SirRobin]

the south would fall in less than a decade. they dont have the resources to support themselves.

If seceding states were allowed leave peacefully and remain independent? I think they would survive. Yes their standard of living and economy might retract, significantly. But not enough that they would actually want to come back.

I think it would actually do them good to cut their strings, so to speak. Pop that bubble, and let them have to deal with it on their own. Of course we would have to keep the border closed, or risk dealing with tons of new dixiecans flooding across.

[Vizardlorde]

Revolution isn't an option atm. It is very difficult to plan something big w/o being discovered by the NSA aside from targeting civilians which wouldnt help the cause. There exist little room for support of a revolution among the poor since they are split by their political views and only those that do not support either party zealously may be willing to support one. Simply calling a group conspirators or traitors would pretty much crush any support they would get from the public. Riot police would gas the crap out of angry mobs. People are comfortable enough and they have been raised to believe that it is how the system works.

[SirRobin]

Now I wouldn't consider the NSA all that threatening. They've shown themselves to be disturbingly inept a number of times. The greatest boundary to an actual uprising, in my opinion, is no matter how much bitching folks might do? In the back of their minds, most realize just how much they rely on the big government they loathe. Everyone complains until they need it. Then they keep complaining, naturally, but take everything they can get.

[Slant]

Revolution? Secession? They'd all starve to death for the idiocy involved in such an idea. Bloody warmongerers... oh wait, you want to kill each other? GREAT idea, go right ahead. Viva la (r)evolution! Long live the South! Overthrow the gouvernment!

[SirRobin]

We wouldn't get that lucky. New Dixie would just pull a Cuba and try to dump all the undesirables on the United States.

[Rukentuts]

We wouldn't get that lucky. New Dixie would just pull a Cuba and try to dump all the undesirables on the United States.

Or they'd just go Berlin Wall on it.

[Daelak]

We wouldn't get that lucky. New Dixie would just pull a Cuba and try to dump all the undesirables on the United States.

Yea and we would be forced to let them immigrate to the most productive states.