Casual guild, looking for advice on regular omnitron

[Monteverdi]

Thanks for all the advice (and thanks for keeping it positive.) I'm hoping tonight's raid will go better based on this feedback!

[smashzu]

I disagree with EVERYONE needing to pull 10k dps. 6-10k is just fine.

1) For this fight, the raid leader needs to get chatty! have them call the adds and who they are on (these people run away to avoid dying) it also tells everyone to switch to adds.
2) The beam thing (my name references are bad) from magmatron is up to your raid style, my group avoids the marked person (heroic they can't move) but if you have no interest in heroic modes, you can have the marked player move. RL needs to call out who it is
3) Scatter on toxitron AND ELECTRON, stack on everyone else (esp. with arcanatrons pools) makes healing easier
4) Arcanatron is up, your shaman does absolutely nothing but wind shear the arcane missle thingy.
5) three healers is good
6) The heavy damage from magmatron, as long as your heals are paying attention your good, we found 1 tank heals, 1 raid heals and 1 support heals for both works well.
7) Shields! RL Calls out switches! no one dps's below 50% energy-the yellow bar (switch occurs here due to shild activation) the only person who doesnt switch is the shaman, who is interupting when arcanatron is up.
8) Practice! hit those white pools, avoid toxic gas, no dps over 50% energy, avoid the line thing, and kill the slimes.

Over all, LOTS of TALKING for RL. this way people know what is coming and when it is coming. We had a few people calling out warnings as there are a lot fo stuff going on in this fight.

Fixed 4 u bro.

[mookashookah]

if your dps sucks most likely u should focus them 1v1 have chat about how much they suck and get them all up to par with EJ standards and if they still suck u have to replace them or ur never gunna down anything more

[Jaerin]

I disagree with EVERYONE needing to pull 10k dps. 6-10k is just fine.

I didn't say need...I said they should. There isn't really a reason that they can't be pulling that dps unless they aren't playing their class correctly or they aren't able to focus on their targets the way they should be able too.

It wasn't meant to be a snide comment at all. It was just a fact that his dps should be able to pull much better numbers.

[FallenSystm]

Monte,

Honestly looking at your attempts, you are not focusing on the primary abilities of this fight. As people have already mentioned you NEED to interrupt Arcane Annihilator every time it goes off, leave two interrupters on it if you are struggle. The tank NEEDS to keep Arcanotron as close to his buff puddle as possible to allow melee to DPS from it as well as range, as healers should be standing in this. (The only time this becomes a problem is when Toxitron is up and dumps chemical bomb on top of everyone.) Also when Toxitron dumps chemical bomb tanking the current non shielded target in this allows for another DPS boost, much like Arcanotron's puddle. Other than that introducing your guild to Elitist Jerks and askmrrobot.com will greatly help them. Just looking at your logs it seems that every player within your guild is using the wrong DPS spec (mages) or not using the right rotation (DK / Hunter) this was just a super fast glance, I could be wrong. Changes these small things should easily get you guys the kill. As always, don't break the shields. Make sure the mage is spell stealing Arcanotrons shield for AMAZING DPS and don't let Arcane Annihilator, Flamethrower, Lighting Conductor, or Poison Adds do there nasty things and you will succeed.

[Laughriot]

We had a little trouble on this fight in my guild as well. We're super-casual and finally got past it though, so what we do will probably work for anyone.

First of all, as has been said, make sure that you are target-switching the second a new golem becomes active, to avoid breaking the previous golem's shield. If the golem being switched AWAY FROM is Arcanotron, the tank holding him needs to call for spellsteal/purge/dispell if the boss takes any damage while his shield is active. It can be very hard to interrupt his nuke if he has stacks of his shield buff. For Arcanotron himself, we have the tank and one DPS (usually a Fury Warrior with Rude Interruption) alternate on the nuke, until time to switch off. Once that switch occurs... we generally just heal through every other nuke, unless we have a pally tanking who gets lucky Avenger's Shield procs and can interrupt multiple times that way. Honestly, as long as he doesn't get one off while standing in the power generator... it isn't a big deal.

The other key trick is to take the golems to opposite sides of the room, and make sure the entire ranged group is on the opposite side from wherever Toxotron is. We have not yet had Toxotron's slimes fixate on someone who is in melee range, and we've only ever had them hit melee if the melee switched off to kill the slimes too quickly. The slimes spawn, our Fury warrior catches them with Piercing Howl, and then the melee and ranged both destroy them before they get halfway across the room. Very easy stuff. When the next golem becomes active, our feral druid and our fury warrior stay on Toxotron (careful not to DPS him while Poison-Soaked Shell is active!) and continue murdering the slimes as they spawn.

We did have a fair bit of trouble with this fight, until we got a good system worked out for dealing with the slimes. Virtually everything else is trivial, though. That being said, it is always possible to have wipes based on RNG. We've lost tanks recently to an Arcanotron/Magmatron combo wherein everyone switched off of Arc and the one nuke that went off (remember, we tend to eat every other nuke because they aren't that big a deal) hit the Arcanotron tank at the exact same time Magmatron's Flamethrower went off on him. Healable to be sure, but a nasty spike none the less.

[Velkeri]

>_> if you guys are running with the same people that you downed magmaw halfus and the twin drakes with you should all have no problem pulling 10k. And no, you dont "NEED" to pull 10k. If though you pull under 8k you need to 1 look at your gear or 2 check that you are playing your class correctly. Not bashing on the OP's guild just saying for you guys that say pulling 6k dps is ok. LOL @ u

[Drakkmur]

My guild has had this on farm for a while and we don't even worry about interrupts on regular mode. While interrupting them certainly helps, I don't think it will make or break the encounter.

The big things imo are not DPSing shields below 50, making sure the flamethrower target is moving to a location where it doesn't hit other raid members, killing adds quickly (and obviously have the people being fixated kite them if they get close), and getting lightning conductor out of the group. Make sure ranged dps and healers are getting in the white puddles (this is when I would bloodlust btw or during an add phase if you are having issues with them) dropped by arcanotron.

Have your tanks help communicate key things in vent (this is not a particularly taxing fight for tanks). Make sure they are calling out target switches, white puddles, adds, flamethrower targets, etc. If your dps are having issues avoiding adds, make sure they have dbm installed...it yells at you if you are a fixate target. Communication is key this fight. One person tunnelling on a boss can be bad. Make sure any classes with pets are aware they can't leave their pets on the prior target...they should switch targets with you.

As others have said, your dps is very low. Here is my guild's logs from two weeks ago:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=1310&e=1602

As you can see, my guild is probably doing about twice the raid dps as your guild and the fight still lasted 5 minutes. With your dps, you are looking at probably a 10 minute kill, which really puts a strain on your healers' mana and increases the probability someone screws up a mechanic.

Good luck!

[Monteverdi]

>_> if you guys are running with the same people that you downed magmaw halfus and the twin drakes with you should all have no problem pulling 10k. And no, you dont "NEED" to pull 10k. If though you pull under 8k you need to 1 look at your gear or 2 check that you are playing your class correctly. Not bashing on the OP's guild just saying for you guys that say pulling 6k dps is ok. LOL @ u

You're right. And it is odd that our numbers are so low, considering on Magmaw/Halfus/Twin Drakes most everyone is right at 11k or above. It's something we need to work on. True, it may not be the limiting factor on this encounter, but increasing our DPS makes the encounter shorter (meaning less time for silly mistakes) and also makes us better for future encounters. I don't take offense to people saying our DPS it too low... it's just a simple fact that we need to work on (and will)

[Mendorin]

heh, opps. sorry OP. forgot to add him in there...

[Drakkmur]

And it is odd that our numbers are so low, considering on Magmaw/Halfus/Twin Drakes most everyone is right at 11k or above.

Halfus and Magmaw are both buffed fights. I probably do 50% more dps on Magmaw than a typical fight and almost 100% more dps on Halfus than a typical fight. Do you guys run BH together? What is your dps like there? It would be a better gauge frankly.

On an aside Monteverdi, I did think Omnitron is a fight with a lot of rng. This was the last "farm" boss we had where we were consistently one shotting it. We were still wiping 3-5 times each week the first month or so after getting our first kill while generally one shotting everything else (we have one shotted reg Nef every week I think since our first kill in comparison). So it can be a frustrating fight to get down. If you guys are wiping a lot on this boss, I would recommend giving Asc Council a few pulls to break it up. While it seems like a tough fight if you just look at all the boss abilities, I actually think it is one of the easier ones and a fight pugs kill on my server (which tells you something considering my server stinks).

[Monteverdi]

Halfus and Magmaw are both buffed fights. I probably do 50% more dps on Magmaw than a typical fight and almost 100% more dps on Halfus than a typical fight. Do you guys run BH together? What is your dps like there? It would be a better gauge frankly.

On an aside Monteverdi, I did think Omnitron is a fight with a lot of rng. This was the last "farm" boss we had where we were consistently one shotting it. We were still wiping 3-5 times each week the first month or so after getting our first kill while generally one shotting everything else (we have one shotted reg Nef every week I think since our first kill in comparison). So it can be a frustrating fight to get down. If you guys are wiping a lot on this boss, I would recommend giving As Council a few pulls to break it up. While it seems like a tough fight if you just look at all the boss abilities, I actually think it is one of the easier ones and a fight pugs kill on my server (which tells you something considering my server stinks).

It's the same with BH. Obviously on Magmaw/Halfus our numbers are buffed, I'm taking that into consideration.

[y02mustang]

A lot of folks have already given sound advice, but I just wanted to reiterate a few points (also coming from a casual-raiding 10m guild, having downed Omnotron last night).

I looked at the earlier fights since you said those were some of your best attempts.

* designate someone to be on arcanotron at all time for interrupts, that Arcane Annhilator is a pain
-- even when his sheild is up, the interrupter needs to stay close to be ready when his shield drops; of course, do not dps his shield while it's up
* as long as magmatron and electron aren't active at the same time, be sure to stack up for magamtron to ease AOE healing
* when toxitron is up and the adds are due, warn your melee to take a few steps back and give themselves some distance in case the adds fixate on melee
-- similarly, be sure to slow/stun those adds and kill them right away, and don't let anyone run into them - they will detonate even if they are not hitting their fixated target
* make sure your acquiring target raider doesn't laser anyone with the flame thrower and also doesn't run out of range of heals
-- as mentioned above, it's awesome when a hunter gets it because a quick Feign and that threat disappears entirely, no flame thrower; same is true for rogues and mages
-- Anti-Magic Shield and other defensive cooldowns help with this burst of damage if it does go off
* make sure the tank is next to the construct when it is close to active so they can pick it up right away when it activates

** at 55 energy left, call all DPS and pets off the current target and call out for a switch to the next construct coming up. also recommend your dps not recast dots after about 57 energy, that should help with shields. the tank standing by the construct can taunt but turn off auto attack until the shield drops by itself.

Here is our log from last night, if you want to take a look. http://worldoflogs.com/reports/xosxx...?s=3987&e=4503 Note that it took us 8 minutes, so you don't have to down them in a hurry, just keep your mechanics in order and watch your positioning.

It looks like your mage was spellstealing, but even on the first attempts arcane annhilator was going off. Keep your interruptor on Arcanotron at all times.

Good luck on your attempts tonight!

Edit: Also wanted to note I recommend 3 healers if you can do so; especially if it's going to be a long fight.

[LazyOne]

My 2 cents.

1. I put my pet on passive between 55-60 energy to ensure my pet isn't a shield breaking baddie.

2. Something that helped us get our first downing of ODS was to change up how we handled the targeting beam from Magmatron. Rather than having the beam targeted raid member run away from the raid, the raid ran away from the beam. Everyone can see the big red line and it might be easier for your raiders to think of it in terms of something not to stand in as opposed to having occassional kiting of flames through the raid. Pick a direction for everyone else to move to (right or left of beam) and anyone that is too far out of position just stays where they are. Only time beam target needed to run from the raid is if everyone was in the cotten candy from Arcanotron.

3. Slimes from Toxitron need to be called out. If one fixates on a tank, then that slime is first priority to kill. Any slowing/freezing effects are a great help. If you get fixated, try to kite it through the poison cloud so it dies faster.

[Anyasha]

Drakkmur

Originally Posted by Monteverdi
And it is odd that our numbers are so low, considering on Magmaw/Halfus/Twin Drakes most everyone is right at 11k or above.

Halfus and Magmaw are both buffed fights. I probably do 50% more dps on Magmaw than a typical fight and almost 100% more dps on Halfus than a typical fight. Do you guys run BH together? What is your dps like there? It would be a better gauge frankly.

Yes...if you are doing 11k on Magmaw or Halfus something even more serious is wrong!

Just get them to understand their class a little better and the encounter mechanics they can utilize to their advantage.

Have them ask a player from a raiding guild on your server to practice at the target dummy with them so they can compare DPS, rotations, timing, etc. Preferably one who is nice and actually good (i.e. over 15k DPS unbuffed for rDPS, 13.5k for mDPS). There will be some gear disparity, but probably the single largest disparity will be the playstyle...just use it as a tutoring session!

[Episkopos]

Looks like you've received some solid general advice so far. Here are some specific tips:

Have your interrupters make a macro that includes /stopattack ( I think that's it) so they aren't hitting arcanotron after an interrupt. Including tanks if they are in the rotation.

Tank away from the new golem about to activate or pop a cooldown when picking up another golem. As someone said above, you can sometimes have two meleeing a tank before the old one deactivates.

Have the magmatron tank put their back to ranged or at least face so that ranged and melee are not lined up with the boss.

My guild has the primary target of the laser stand still and the raid makes sure they are not near or behind the target.

While you are still learning the fight, have melee move away from the poison guy when he starts casting the slimes. This will make sure you don't get an instapop, and reinforces the idea they should be helping to kill the slimes quickly

[Heringer91]

DPS is always going to look low on Omni from the movement and target swapping.

That's not always true, i guess when you 1st start it might be but (we still do normal modes, cant kill nef ...) the hunter and SP in my guild both hold 18-22k dps on omni, the only ones who drop notably our our warrior and feral druid, because of chasing adds, and running from 1 side of the room to the other.

Watch who is breaking shields, if the tank has to just stop attacking the boss, then stop
Don't miss the interrupts on arcane, they hurt
Have people being chased by adds turn and run, don't dps them. TURN AND RUN if you have low dps atm
Stand in the blue puddle from arcaneo, and pop lust you get a damage buff. (you also gain mana)
tank the bosses in toxic's poison cloud, they take dmg too (but don't stand in it your self)

the fight can be confusing, but once you get it, its easy

[Nonfictionless]

Dunno if this was said because frankly this whole thing has been a wall-o-text but with your dps being what it is you as the tank can help out a ton by dragging the trons into the poison bombs. They have a huge hit box so it is very easy to pull a tron to the corner of a cloud while you, the tank, are not effected and neither will your melee.

[tibben]

Attempt #1 - Tank did not get healed after getting hit with Arcane Annihilator (received ZERO direct heals for a full 7 seconds)
Attempt #2 - DK did not pop anti-magic shell during Flamethrower and received no direct heals while he was getting burned
Attempt #3 - Shaman was not topped off before Flamethrower and received no direct heals during Flamethrower, not even from himself, then he ankh'd right before Incineration Security Measure and killed himself
Attempt #4 - Too short to care
Attempt #5 - Priest received no direct heals during Flamethrower, not even from himself, then Hunter dies to Poison bomb
Attempt #6 - People were attacking Electron with his shield up and two people died to Static Shock because of this
Attempt #7 - People were attacking Arcanotron while his shield was up without dispelling him and the DPS DK got rocked by empowered Arcane Annihilator, then people attacked Electron with his shield up and Static Shock killed the Mage
Attempt #8 - Shaman got Flamethrower with no direct heals...again, Priest pulled aggro on Arcanotron, people attacked Arcanotron's shield and Hunter got wrecked by empowered Arcane Annihilator
Attempt #9 - Blew up Magmatron's shield and killed 3 people
Attempt #10 - Mage dies to Flamethrower from no heals (and didn't use CDs to survive), Shaman and Hunter die to Flamethrower from lack of heals
Attempt #11 - Empowered Arcane Annihilator, stop attacking Arcanotron's shield
Attempt #12 - Static Shock kills tank, stop attacking Electron's shield


So the main points are:

Either get new healers or find a way to teach your healers how to heal people through Flamethrower. They were not even trying to heal people with Flamethrower.

Your DPS are attacking the boss shields on EVERY ATTEMPT. They either need to learn how/when to switch targets or you will never complete the encounter...ever. Also make sure the tank is not attacking while shields are up...especially on Arcanotron and Electron.

Your DPS is low, but that is not what is causing problems. Horrible healing when Flamethrower is up and DPS/tanks attacking bosses while their shields are up is what is killing you. Make sure your raiders know what abilities they have that can reduce incoming damage if they are selected for Flamethrower and make sure your healers are aware and ready to heal the Flamethrower target. Make sure to call out when target switches are necessary. If it wasn't the DPS attacking those shields then you need to get on your tanks and tell them to stop wiping the raid.

[beingmused]

If your DPS simply can't handle switching at 50% energy each time, one tactic you can try is keeping the DPS in place, and having the offtank taunt the "inactive" (sub-50%) Tron over to the other side of the room, so that the main tank is always picking up the newly activated trons. It can make things easier on bad DPS because they don't have to move, and it kind of forces the switch at 50.