Nefarian Paragon Video, Cataclysm Hall of Fame, MMO Report, Comics

Originally Posted by Hateful

And all those people who brought in Locks for Yogg0 were also exploiting, right? Because they were the most efficient DPS in the final phase? Right?

The buff to damage applies to all classes that have DoTs, so Paragon brought in the class with the best DoT. What's the problem? You bring the class that will yield the maximum damage for your raid. They can afford the luxury of bringing in the most advantageous class and spec, as I'm sure many other top guilds can.

But after the yogg0 kill locks werent nerfed to do less dmg.

In this case something changed after the first kill. In the yogg case other guilds could acctualy redo the kill like the guild before them. In the nef case people could not. Here is all the difference.

I know it's been said but I want to echo it.

If you are going to blame someone blame Blizzard for their piss poor class balancing & encounter testing.

Originally Posted by empo

It was stupid of them to hotfix it after the first kill.

This. When are people going to accept that the druid thing wasnt an exploit. Rip scaled the best so they stacked druids. Just because those Fins had/leveled druids ready, then its not their problems. All this fallout is because Blizzard hotfixed one of the mechanics.

Originally Posted by Sneek

But after the yogg0 kill locks werent nerfed to do less dmg.

In this case something changed after the first kill. In the yogg case other guilds could acctualy redo the kill like the guild before them. In the nef case people could not. Here is all the difference.

Blizzard fixed the saronite thing and banned ensidia and took their loot and achievements away. Blizzard fixed the nef buff but didnt ban paragon and they kept the achievements and loot. Believe me they ARE looking at what was going on when a guild kills a boss for a wf. Even when you are considering it an exploit its still on blizzards side to decide if it was an actual exploit or clever use of game mechanics. So if they decide it wasnt one ... than it wasnt one. Period. Here is all the difference.

There still seems to be a lot of confusion about Paragon's Nef kill, so let me repeat the facts:

(1) There were no bugs or exploits involved with Paragon's kill. The kill was legit, and the feral druids' Rip was working correctly in combination with the dominate buff. The math about Rip has been done earlier on this thread, and the numbers check out. Please learn again your basic calculus if you don't agree. Or rest assured that Blizzard thoroughly checks through the combat logs of every world first kill for possible exploiting of bugs, and swiftly bans any offenders.

(2) Class stacking is allowed by Blizzard. When that happens, Blizzard usually reacts by implementing balancing changes. These changes occur all the time, and do not "posthumously" affect who is entitled to a world first and who isn't. Otherwise all the first kills would become invalid after almost every patch.

Finally, the guilds don't have any say in Blizzards decisions to change boss mechanics. All the top guilds generally agree that such changes should not be made while the competition is still going on, even if they are the one to get advantage of it. In this respect, Method has also been in a similar situation back when they killed Hodir HM first in Ulduar only to have Blizzard make the fight (nearly) impossible right after they had killed it.

Originally Posted by Culexus

Blizzard fixed the saronite thing and banned ensidia and took their loot and achievements away. Blizzard fixed the nef buff but didnt ban paragon and they kept the achievements and loot. Believe me they ARE looking at what was going on when a guild kills a boss for a wf. Even when you are considering it an exploit its still on blizzards side to decide if it was an actual exploit or clever use of game mechanics. So if they decide it wasnt one ... than it wasnt one. Period. Here is all the difference.

It can't be even considered clever use of game mechanics. They got a buff and used an ability to attack the boss as intended, normal use of game mechanics. The ability just happened to do very good damage, which blizzard overlooked.

Originally Posted by Lamperouqe

It can't be even considered clever use of game mechanics. They got a buff and used an ability to attack the boss as intended, normal use of game mechanics. The ability just happened to do very good damage, which blizzard overlooked.

Yeah thats right. Just didnt know which term to use for what i meant. Thanks for pointing it out clearer than i could.

LOL DLC

"Dont forget to set the oven to 13:37 before you throw in a Kobold!"

I also congrats all the Guilds for their achievements !

DLC epic too !

The ending made me laugh - meow. Grats to Paragon for downing this on heroic - definitely not an easy fight, no matter how you do it.

First of all, hello everyone from Russia.
In my opinion 10man is much harder, than 25 on most encounters.
And about that "Cataclysm Tier 1 Raid Hall of Fame"... I'm really sad you didn't check it before posting. One russian guild has world 2nd on H:Atramedes and world 3rd on H:Maloriak.
The guild name is "Карфаген" of Пиратская Бухта EU. Can't post links X_x

(1) There were no bugs or exploits involved with Paragon's kill. The kill was legit, and the feral druids' Rip was working correctly in combination with the dominate buff. The math about Rip has been done earlier on this thread, and the numbers check out. Please learn again your basic calculus if you don't agree. Or rest assured that Blizzard thoroughly checks through the combat logs of every world first kill for possible exploiting of bugs, and swiftly bans any offenders.


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If this mechanic was changed then paragon should have had their titles stripped and world first removed and they can kill it how all the other guilds have to kill it. It was obviously not intended and also not changed fast enough but rip hitting for 400k-800k is just an abuse of game mechanics. Other guilds get banned for abusing stuff that gets changed or is not working as it was intended to... They should be no exception.

Paragon didn't get world first nefarian kill Method did.

This video clearly showing paragon abusing mechanics that are not working as intended should not be up on the front page.

Originally Posted by Nicord

If this mechanic was changed then paragon should have had their titles stripped and world first removed and they can kill it how all the other guilds have to kill it. Other guilds get banned for abusing stuff that gets changed or is not working as it was intended to... They should be no exception.

Paragon didn't get world first nefarian kill Method did.

Why should they? They beat the encounter the way it was set out. How can they be held responsable for what blizzard does. Its like in a F1 qualifying where if Alonso did the fastest lap then Bernie Ecclestone comes out and says sorry we want to change two of the corners. If the owners want to change something than competitors CANNOT be blamed for that.

So why was exodus banned for yogg 0 world first? They did the encounter how it was set out then blizzard changed how something in that fight works like they did here (which made the fight FAR easier/faster) and banned them but no ban to paragon.

LOL Love how all the DCUO haters are keeping their mouths shut after this MMO report. Suck is blizz fanbois. (I don't think I can get an infraction from that because I'm not naming anyone specifically. Simply laughing at the blizz fanboys who so wanted DCUO to fail hard)

Originally Posted by freelapdance

Its like in a F1 qualifying where if Alonso did the fastest lap then Bernie Ecclestone comes out and says sorry we want to change two of the corners. If the owners want to change something than competitors CANNOT be blamed for that.

Except in that case they would obviously discard all old times and have new qualifiers.

Originally Posted by Culexus

Blizzard fixed the saronite thing and banned ensidia and took their loot and achievements away. Blizzard fixed the nef buff but didnt ban paragon and they kept the achievements and loot. Believe me they ARE looking at what was going on when a guild kills a boss for a wf. Even when you are considering it an exploit its still on blizzards side to decide if it was an actual exploit or clever use of game mechanics. So if they decide it wasnt one ... than it wasnt one. Period. Here is all the difference.

I was just pointing out the difference between the yogg0 and the nef kill. Im not on any guilds side or anything but it would be really nice if Blizz would treat any kind of "it was not ment to be killed like this" as equal.

I honestly really cant trust their judgement of what is a bannable exploit or clever use of game mechanics (as stupid as it sounds) coz IMO Blizz really doesnt care about any "fair race" but they want the content to last long (imo nef wasnt ment to be killed the first of the last bosses) so when they see a guild who can push it to the limit they have to do something.

Just my opinion on Blizz definiton of exploit/bug/glitch/clever use

Originally Posted by empo

Except in that case they would obviously discard all old times and have new qualifiers.

If it just was that simple in WoW, it's not like they are playing against each other at a LAN event. Maybe taking loot, achievements and reseting the boss so that they could keep attempting it would have been appropriate.

Hmmm...the point is : World 1st Nef kill goes to Paragon !
End of story.

There will always be a conspiracy theories and fanboiz complaining, but a fact is a fact !
Noone can`t deny it!

Gratz Paragon on awesome skills and progress in last two years!Wish there are some more incoming skilled guilds like them,to make future races even more interesting.

Originally Posted by noaireirei

What I don't like, is not the fact that they noticed that druids are capable of inflicting 800k crits on Nefarian, which is clearly a bug needed to be fixed.

Oh jolly, another "omg big numbers! exploitz111oneeleven!" post. Can you good sir please tell us benighted souls how much, then, should Rip tick for when you blow all cooldowns on it and multiply by 2250% ? Because that's how the encounter works. Thank you.