Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
In patch 4.1 we'll be introducing Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms, a new system intended to lower queue times. Call to Arms will automatically detect which class role is currently the least represented in the queue, and offer them additional rewards for entering the Dungeon Finder queue and completing a random level-85 Heroic dungeon.

Any time the Dungeon Finder queue is longer than a few minutes for level-85 Heroics, the Call to Arms system kicks in and determines which role is the least represented. In the case of tanking being the least represented role, the "Call to Arms: Tanks" icon will display in the Dungeon Finder UI menu where class roles are selected, and will also display on the UI when the queue pops and you are selected to enter a dungeon. Regardless of your role, you'll always be able to see which role currently has been Called to Arms, if any.

Call to Arms is meant to lower wait times by offering additional rewards for queuing as the currently least represented role. To be eligible for the additional rewards you must solo queue for a random level-85 Heroic in the role that is currently being Called to Arms, and complete the dungeon by killing the final boss. Every time you hit these requirements (there is no daily limit) you'll receive a goodie bag that will contain some gold, a chance at a rare gem, a chance at a flask/elixir (determined by spec), a good chance of receiving a non-combat pet (including cross faction pets), and a very rare chance at receiving a mount. The pets offered come from a wide variety of sources, and include companions like the Razzashi Hatchling, Cockatiel, and Tiny Sporebat, but the mounts are those specifically only available through dungeons (not raids), like the Reins of the Raven Lord from Sethekk Halls, Swift White Hawkstrider from Magister's Terrace, and Deathcharger's Reins from Stratholme.

This system is meant to address the unacceptable queue times currently being experienced by those that queue for the DPS role at max level. The long queue times are, of course, caused by a very simple lack of representation in the Dungeon Finder by tanks, and to some extent healers. We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little. While this system gives tanks and healers something extra, the incentive is being provided so that we can help players in the DPS role get into more dungeons, get better gear, and continue progressing.

While the gold, gems, flasks, and elixirs are OK incentives, we knew we needed something more substantial. We had briefly considered Valor Points and epics, but decided that wouldn't be working toward the goal of helping DPS players progress, and ultimately wouldn't keep tanks and healers in the Dungeon Finder system for very long. We settled on pets and dungeon-found mounts as they’re cosmetic/achievement items that players tend to try to get on their own, so why not change that up and offer them a chance to get some of those elusive pets and mounts in a way that also helps other players? Even if they don't get a pet or mount, or get one they already have, the gold and other goodies still feel rewarding enough that it won't feel like a waste of effort.

We think it's a pretty solid incentive to get tanks and healers queuing, give max-level players another way to collect the pets and mounts they so desire, and above all, to improve wait times for DPS players sitting in queues. In the case of lower level dungeons, it's actually not uncommon for DPS to be the least represented role, and so if this new system works out and we're pleased with the results, we may consider applying this same mechanic to lower level dungeons as well.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 1855 Comments
  1. DavidGX's Avatar
    Rewards that DPS will never have a chance at, ever. Fantastic =/
  1. mmoc08cc0ab8a0's Avatar
    nice, I can already see the WAVES of fail tanks in pvp gear queuing up to get the mount. We already get crittable druids in dps spec and gear, I guess it's time for the protection paladins with retri gear and the frost deathknights in blood presence.

    My guess? Hotfixed in two weeks.
  1. Grazul's Avatar
    A great decision, looking forward to this being implemented.

    Even if it is only a temporary fix, at least it will hold back the QQ for a little while. Also, being a tank, this will save me money and get me some neat stuff for putting up with the retarded healers and dps you get in groups most of the time.
  1. Zoma's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Korru View Post
    What a cheap way to fix the problem...

    3.3 Wotlk

    Players: People don't want to do Oculus.

    Blizzard: Hey guys, if you complete Oculus you get gems, and emblems, and a chance at a cool mount, COME AND GET IT!

    4.1 Cata

    Players: Tanks don't want to do heroics.

    Blizzard: Hey tanks, if you complete a hc you get gems, and flasks, and a chance at a cool mount, COME AND GET IT!
    Come to think of it, people didn't really start doing Oculus until it got nerfed to hell. That's not a solution I would recommend for current heroics.
  1. Merin's Avatar
    New tiny, testing centric feature added every week after they said no more megapatches =/ All of this seems like a stunt to push 4.1 back so their skeleton staff can work on Firelands longer.

    I don't mind reusing ZG/ZA I think it's neat actually, but from the lack of new assets and all of the little delays on things you can just tell they're down staff members due to Titan

    "Rewards that DPS will never have a chance at, ever. Fantastic =/"

    What, a smidge of gold, a flask no one will use and a chance at a rare mount that you can also get by going and soloing a dungeon/raid?

    What you get out of it is reduced queue times, you don't need any incentive. I swear, some of you DPS are like a fat kid at someones birthday party, sad that you cant have a third slice of cake. The entitlement and outright nerd POUTING over something that benefits them already is gross.
  1. Zoma's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by DavidGX View Post
    Rewards that DPS will never have a chance at, ever. Fantastic =/
    Rewards that have been in game for years.
  1. Viradiance's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Tryana View Post
    Who cares that the tank "might" get some pretty mount, or the healer.

    Does he/she take it from your inventory? Did he/se steal your drop? Are you crying over other people farming it and getting it earlier then you to?

    Do you realy feel like your 6K dps while hugging fire should reward you with anything else then a votekick after 45 mins in que?
    The problem isn't that the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount.

    The problem is that the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount for doing something that 90% of players are expected to do. The problem is that we both go into a dungeon, but the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount, while the DPS who came into the dungeon and did their job get nothing but a pat on the back and a participation medal.
  1. paloo's Avatar
    I really don't know what to think of this right now... We'll have to see how long dungeon queues are with this but if tank queues are still faster it will suck. ;< I mean fast queue and special reward = 2 rewards. Imo this is just not a problem that blizz needs to be fixing in such a way, tanking already gets rewarded with instaqueue, and it's not like tanking is hard.

    E: Or harder than DPSing for that matter
  1. Renowned's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowy View Post
    Wow, someone else actually figured it out! ^_^ This encourages tanks and healers not to queue until their Call to Arms is up or else they don't get as much as they could from running the Heroic.
    Did you people even read the whole post?

    If the call to arms is not asking for tanks, then it means there is no shortage of tanks. It doesn't matter if some of them are jerks and wait for it to swap back to CTA:Tanks, because there are enough tanks queuing in the mean time that you don't need them!
  1. Zalavaaris's Avatar
    Bollocks! Honestly, im fairly sure nothing I say or do will change this. Do I agree with it? No... But hey, what can I do? Might as well sit back and enjoy the shorter queue times that I SHOULD already have as a paying subscriber. Until then I shall wait in queue one minute for every thousand dps I do. Sigh.... Balls to it.
  1. Facepalmer's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Callypso View Post
    All people see is the 'small chance at a mount that dps will never get!!'. Oh man, the stupidity in this thread.



    I'll sum it up for you.

    - Right now, as a dps, you spend 20-30 minutes in the queue due to (mostly) lack of tanks. THIS CHANGE IS TO LOWER THAT TIME FOR YOU! Why would you care what the reason of that lower time is, if you're just signing up for the valor points and/or gear anyway?

    - It's not just mounts: It's gold to begin with, and in addition you have a CHANCE at getting a pet, mount or raid consumables. And you can get mounts/pets that you already have, most likely.

    - All the mounts mentioned are shiteasy to farm as any class. It's easier to just farm them in 10min in their original instance then spend 30+ min in a random hc hoping you a) get a mount, b) don't get a mount you already have. If it's mounts you want to farm, it's a lot easier to farm them in the old content than through this way.

    - Right now NO ONE signs up for random heroics to farm these mounts. So for the non-call at arms people signing up, all that changes is a queue time that's most likely lower... does it matter if someone else might get some extra gold, if all you're interested in is gearing your alt?


    This will encourage people to sign up more as healers and tanks. Personally I always sign up as one of those since I hate waiting. This will make heroic farming a lot more enjoyable on my alts that CAN'T tank or heal!
    dude, lets see a DPS share your ASTOUNDING insights (ie: copy and paste the blue post) who doesnt have a tank/heal offspec. How many ppl have Anzu, Rivendare and White hawkstrider? How many of these new wondertanks that blizz will conjure with bribing them with bags of tricks will stay and be tanks after they collect shinies...? (which didn't work in H Occ btw) and, HOW MANY tanks/heals will be willing to assist others to get the mount/pet etc if they got it easily themselves. Few, far and between. Well done Blizz. yet another band-aid... to help a broken limb.
  1. Mudip's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by dubbelbasse View Post
    And this, basically.
    Realize that the blue drake from the h-occulus bag was an extremely high drop rate, 20%ish? It's likely that the CTA mount drop rate will be the same as their chances from the original instance, about 1%...Now average out, based on your own experience of pugging random heroics, how long it would take to complete a random. Now think about the increase of tanks, and how the Q times for tanks will likely NOT be close to instant pops...

    Comparing this to random heroic occulus and the blue drake is like comparing the graph of a tangent function to a cow having sex.
  1. Facepalmer's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Renowned View Post
    Did you people even read the whole post?

    If the call to arms is not asking for tanks, then it means there is no shortage of tanks. It doesn't matter if some of them are jerks and wait for it to swap back to CTA:Tanks, because there are enough tanks queuing in the mean time that you don't need them!
    You really think there is a cause for a call to arms for MAGES COME TO HIS HEROIC!! HELP ME NEED YOU? um yeah cough right.
  1. Keosen's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    The problem isn't that the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount.

    The problem is that the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount for doing something that 90% of players are expected to do. The problem is that we both go into a dungeon, but the Tank or Healer "might" get a mount, while the DPS who came into the dungeon and did their job get nothing but a pat on the back and a participation medal.
    So basically if the times drop by 10-15mins you are not ok with it because the tank may got a mount?
    It's a mount and not even a nice looking one all the dungeon mounts are generic and ugly except if you considered a blue chicken a nice mount.

    I really can't understand the whine.
    People whining because they are getting 40mi queues as DPS.
    Blizzard is offering a solution by motivating tanks and healers to queue so the massive numbers of DPS get faster times and you not only whining again but you offering no viable alternative.

    I have 1 tank that doesnt need nothing from heroics so i stopped doing them for a month or so, now i'll join a couple of runs so you will get a little faster times shut up and get it.
  1. mmocfd8d985519's Avatar
    Good idea! People are gonna whine, but whats new?!
  1. randprin's Avatar
    if this hits live,then you have one fully raid geared palatank incoming to the LFD system.
  1. Mudip's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by sarethen View Post
    Good idea! People are gonna whine, but whats new?!
    I've started to notice within the past five years that most changes done by Blizz will always cause a tsunami of tears...indeed very salty tears.
  1. mmoc1527ec2bcd's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    I am disappointed.

    As a DPS, I am at a disadvantage soloing some content to receive these mounts to begin with. Now they are being offered as a reward to tanks, who already have instant queues and are payed small fortunes of gold to tank a single heroic.
    Tanks (or healers, or even dps) will have to queue solo to gain these rewards when they are in their respective call to arms, so the small fortunes that are paid to tanks are not combine able with this system.

    People also seem to forget that it is not just for Tanks, but for the role that is currently under representative in the LFG system. Ad hoc it would provide indeed incentive for Tanks, but as soon as tanks are going to flood the LFG system (because they want the mounts), the Call2Arms will switch to Healers, or even DPS (though I doubt dps ever will be under represented in LFG).

    Nevertheless I do agree with Hybridizing all classes; and allowing Rogues, Shamans, Warriors (with a second spec), DK's (with a second spec), Hunters (by reducing their dmg in said spec, and greatly increase the stats of the pet - or like some suggested to mount your pet), and Warlocks (by giving demon form an unlimited duration) as tanks. That way a lot more players who like the aesthetics of a certain class may role a tank, and increase the amount of tanks.
  1. Facepalmer's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Keosen View Post
    So basically if the times drop by 10-15mins you are not ok with it because the tank may got a mount?
    It's a mount and not even a nice looking one all the dungeon mounts are generic and ugly except if you considered a blue chicken a nice mount.

    I really can't understand the whine.
    People whining because they are getting 40mi queues as DPS.
    Blizzard is offering a solution by motivating tanks and healers to queue so the massive numbers of DPS get faster times and you not only whining again but you offering no viable alternative.

    I have 1 tank that doesnt need nothing from heroics so i stopped doing them for a month or so, now i'll join a couple of runs so you will get a little faster times shut up and get it.
    Tanks and heals aren't queuing due to their fail rate or lack of understanding for simple (and increasingly nerfed fights) or the increased fail rate of DPS, and lack of awareness of their environment. Bribing ANYONE or EVERYONE with gear, gold, flying birds or cookies isnt going to change the fact, that if Grim Batol pops up, a fail tank, shinies or otherwise, is going to bail.
  1. Biggsmack's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Grumar View Post
    so tanks/heals get a chance at mounts/pets just for playing the game? how about making another call to arms for BGs that give these rewards to PvPers, i mean there just playing the game like they like to, why not give them rewards
    So you're saying that you want them to give PVE mounts to PVPers for doing PVP? See anything wrong with that?

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