No buffs coming to hunters - official post

[Hayro1]

Hunters and paladins, on average, tend to be the most immature and impatient players - especially when it comes to having class changes implemented.

Wait, we're immature now because we're pissed at the current situation? yeah, you don't comprehend this thread or the discussions at all. And (almost) every single type of helpful posts to make things better have been written pretty well.

[tyrindor]

Hunters and paladins, on average, tend to be the most immature and impatient players - especially when it comes to having class changes implemented.

If you want to reroll just because you are not the most op class in PvP in 5.4, then by all means go and reroll.

I play my hunter because i like the class and how it plays, not because i can use multiple CDs in a row and then instantly reset them all for an instant PvP win...

First of all, pretty much all of the posts in here are PVE related. Honestly I could care less about PVP and feel that anyone playing WoW for balanced PVP should try one of the other thousands of games out there that does it better. Since WoW launched they've always focused on PVE first, and always will. Second, we've been meh this entire expansion. Again, PVE related.

Lots of 25 guilds dropped hunters from their core, and most world first guilds would only have 1 in the group during progression. They tend to stack 3 mages and 3-4 warlocks, which are also pure DPS classes. They claimed we'd be "relatively higher" this tier than last tier, and we simply aren't. We are still middle of the pack for many encounters. There's a few encounters we can get slightly ahead of the middle of the pack, but if you ever see a hunter doing #1 DPS in a 25 he is overgeared or overplaying the other players. On top of that, we bring almost nothing to raid other than DPS, especially when it comes to 25s. There's no reason to be taken over a warlock that sims higher, and has a portal that helps on virtually every encounter.

Also, I don't think a single person has complained about readiness removal. Every hunter i've spoken with has welcomed it... not sure what your getting at. We got nerfed for PVP, and honestly no one disagreed with it. We want PVE buffs.

Okaaaay thats the derpiest ptr patch I've ever seen ....

Like really with so much broken (not just with us hunter) how can a new build after a week be this small

We just had a similar sized PTR patch on Sunday or Monday... I forget. I admit I was disappointed not to see any hunter changes, even with them announcing they are basically done with us. I have hopes that with the new 540-550 testing, and upcoming 25H testing, they will see hunters are not in a good spot when it comes to scaling.

They are also scaling based on screwed up hit/expertise caps, since they can't seem to just allow us to reforge in the instance during PTR. Most of the raid is at 6-11% hit/exp depending on the fight being tested, and the majority of the time we can't even reforge inside. They fixed the one bypass, mounting then summoning them.

[Sydarm]

they buffed DKs

LOLOL

[Perrito]

they buffed DKs

LOLOL

i think is because the design of the encounters, this mean that melee will have a harder time vs range so they buffing the crap out of them so they dont lose their spots.

[Slot]

i think is because the design of the encounters, this mean that melee will have a harder time vs range so they buffing the crap out of them so they dont lose their spots.

If that is the case why not buff hunters because of all the multi dotting classes on multi dotting fights?

[tyrindor]

If that is the case why not buff hunters because of all the multi dotting classes on multi dotting fights?

We are lacking in both the cleave and multi-dotting departments... have been for ages.

Couple things that I think would be nice to see in the "hunter revamp"..
- Explosive Shot tweaked to actually do "explosive" damage to mobs around the target, damage to secondary targets would be greatly reduced.
- Beast Cleave damage nerfed slightly, however is trigged by both Multi-shot and Cobra Shot, lasting 6 seconds instead of 4 seconds. Allowing for a 100% uptime with a proper rotation on cleave fights without feeling like you need to MS every 3 seconds to ensure it never falls off.
- Serpent Sting given a small amount of initial damage for all specs, and lasting about 25 seconds in PVE (15 seconds in PVP) instead of 15 seconds everywhere. This would make multi-dotting a little more worthwhile.

Maybe I am crazy, who knows.

[Perrito]

If that is the case why not buff hunters because of all the multi dotting classes on multi dotting fights?

because they said that hunters are fine where they are, this is the kind of dps they want us to be able to do nothing more. so in their eyes you are fine. dont look at that warlock outdpsing you for 100k even in single target fights, he is just playing a gimik spec with a trinket that is counted as cheating. dont look at that mage playing arcane or fire either, they are a bit higher but they dont have as many utility as hibrids do. neither hunters but hey you can dps on the move so.

[Libertarian]

Draco, you're sorely mistaken if you think that 10 man is not tuned around raid cds. A lot of the guilds commenting did not do these bosses before item upgrades. We did Ra-Den in 525-530 (avg 528) where if we did not have a disc priest, we might as well just quit (guilds now are in 540+). This goes for horridon, megaera, durumu (paladin), dark animus, twins and lei shen too. And most of the reason we 3 heal bosses is because we actually need the raid cd. It's not like there's less abilities going out. We still have 6 rampages in 10 or same amount of movement between pylons on lei shen.

I think the big thing to note about hunters is that most classes bring 2 buffs/debuffs and a raid cd. Example: Rogue = sunder + attack speed + bomb, Warrior = 4% phys + fort/ap + sunder + banner, Shadow Priest = VE + Spell haste + Fort, Shaman = mastery + haste + totem, Druid = stats + haste + tranq, etc. We bring something + ap. That's it, and that something is always usually covered except for the rare occasions we swap people. And then blizzard acts like we have the best utility possible. Frost trap messes up slows and is only 50%, our knockback has to be glyphed, our stun requires pet focus, our aoe stun requires movement, tranq shot costs focus or glyph, widow venom is not baked into a spell like mortal strike or rising sun kick, our fear is limited to beasts, our cc requires precision rather than target, our immunity isn't even really an immunity for most things and stops our damage, on and on and on. But the biggest thing is that our damage is just flat out low. That's not to say we won't be comparable on a fight like Thok, but if you put us on any other encounter that requires multi target, swapping or cleave we will be the middle/bottom depending on gear. It's really that simple.

[Deleted]

Frost trap messes up slows and is only 50%

The only thing that makes frost trap situationally better than some other slows (excluding death and decay) is that it's stationary.

My raid won't allow me to use frost trap during most fights because it covers up almost ANY ground effect is a much bigger problem IMO -.-

[Slot]

The only thing that makes frost trap situationally better than some other slows (excluding death and decay) is that it's stationary.

My raid won't allow me to use frost trap during most fights because it covers up almost ANY ground effect is a much bigger problem IMO -.-

Now now blizzard has said that is our utility so I use it on CD. Best raid utility because its on a 30 sec cd.... Yup all the time!

[Kissthebaby]

lets talk about dark animus, 3 heal 2 tank vs 25 man?
lets talk about even quon, 2 tanking 3 healing vs 25 man?
lets talk about how many ppl you can bring to carry in 25 man vs 10 man even this week, how much more gold 25 man make vs what 10 mans are allowed. in 10 man you are pretty good carrying 1 ppl. in 25 man you can carry even 3, not to mention that in 25 man they will get loot and in 10 man they WONT.

in 25 man you will have a tranq, spirit Shell, barrier, DA or AM (im used to aura mastery but most ppl arent), banners, smoke bomb, AMZ, mana tide, hymz and all that that crap while in 10 man you wont.

You forgot to add that 25 man can stack 25 tanks right or 25 healers. 10 man must be harder.

[Himora]

Hunters really are in such a disgusting state at the moment, i was actually laughed at for trying to kill a priest in PvP, his renew was outhealing any damage i was putting out, and this was in full arena gear. Wildstar cant be released any sooner.

[Buttercheese]

Hunters really are in such a disgusting state at the moment, i was actually laughed at for trying to kill a priest in PvP, his renew was outhealing any damage i was putting out, and this was in full arena gear. Wildstar cant be released any sooner.

PvP isn't the issue, BM burst is just about the best in the game right now, and even survival or mm can put out good damage if they can keep from getting spammed with ccs.

The problem is the lack of scaling and utility in pve, combined with mediocre dps. It makes hunters an undesirable class for any kind of progression. Additionally, blizz seems to think that hunters are in a good place and have solid raid utility, which leads to a complete disconnect between the people playing the class with the intention of progressing, and the people designing and balancing the class.

[Libertarian]

The only thing that makes frost trap situationally better than some other slows (excluding death and decay) is that it's stationary.

My raid won't allow me to use frost trap during most fights because it covers up almost ANY ground effect is a much bigger problem IMO -.-

The biggest problem with frost trap is it overwrites or causes other slows to be ignored. Like a 70% slow could not be applied. Example: deathwinig phase 2 you obviously wanted the 70% slow to give the most time on slimes. Well the logical thing would be to place slow trap to get an instant 50% slow, and apply something like rogue slow or chillblains or something. But no if we did that 1. other class slows would not be applied and 2. as soon as they left the frost trap they went full fucking speed into the boss. So what's the logical step? Obviously allow frost trap and other slows on the same target, and only pick the best. But no we don't have that for some reason?

[Deleted]

Another patch going out and no changes.
And dks get buffed for the 50th time

Well, from what I saw this patch sims and such, were DK and warriors mostly in the bottom (Im not sure how accurate it is to follow them though), and as someone stated, they will need more to be able to compete with ranged. I'm more afraid how it will affect PvP however, knowing DK's can push insane dps as it is (they would need a bit more survavibility I guess), but its another topic.

I wouldn't ofc mind a buff for Hunters (who dont like to see their class get buffed?), at least specs like MM and SV so they could compete with BM. I dont mind being the lowest dps, someone need to be lowest, as long its not like 50k dps after or that insane (Mages, Locks, looking at you!). That would do fine for me that is in a in a random small guild that mostly just do normals, but I can understand Dracos and others that are there in the top and their concerns, since you bring either a class that can put insane awesome monkey ballz dps or great raid utility, best would be both ofc. And I understand their concern, were its not only about bringin the player, it IS about bringing the class as well, otherwise they wouldnt stack certain classes (like Rogues/Mages at HC DW).

Though I think Blizz could tweek Hunters a bit, and I by god hope they make the specs different and more variating with different niches at least. : /

[Deleted]

I am on a EU account but anyone in the US read the thread if you like the feedback bump it up please or offer any suggestions.
It is an intelligent solution to hunter dps in both pve and pvp, it addresses hunter burst and can make all x3 specs competitive (NOT OP NO.1 DPS SPOT).

Really this is the best solution I have seen to hunter so far and would be overjoyed if these changes were considered.

The only thing I disagree with is the belief pures should outperform hybrid but with mage, lock, rogue already doing just that and hunters failing to bring any utility (raid wide healing/dmg cds) I see where he is coming from.
Having said these changes would put hunter in roughly the #8 spot on par with balance druid and spriest.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...8718556?page=1

- - - Updated - - -

Well, from what I saw this patch sims and such, were DK and warriors mostly in the bottom (Im not sure how accurate it is to follow them though), and as someone stated, they will need more to be able to compete with ranged. I'm more afraid how it will affect PvP however, knowing DK's can push insane dps as it is (they would need a bit more survavibility I guess), but its another topic.

I wouldn't ofc mind a buff for Hunters (who dont like to see their class get buffed?), at least specs like MM and SV so they could compete with BM. I dont mind being the lowest dps, someone need to be lowest, as long its not like 50k dps after or that insane (Mages, Locks, looking at you!). That would do fine for me that is in a in a random small guild that mostly just do normals, but I can understand Dracos and others that are there in the top and their concerns, since you bring either a class that can put insane awesome monkey ballz dps or great raid utility, best would be both ofc. And I understand their concern, were its not only about bringin the player, it IS about bringing the class as well, otherwise they wouldnt stack certain classes (like Rogues/Mages at HC DW).

Though I think Blizz could tweek Hunters a bit, and I by god hope they make the specs different and more variating with different niches at least. : /

I was on the ptr yesterday and can confirm Warrior are beast mode. They are a world away from where they are on live, and rightly so.

[petok]

Once Lore told us “Please do not mistake silence for ignorance”, “please be aware that silence isn't necessarily a bad thing”
Than it was “We know your damage is low. We are going to fix it. If you don't believe that, that's your choice, but ranting about it isn't going to accomplish anything.”
And finally “We've already made all of the adjustments … this means that you'll be less effective in certain situations”
There were hundreds of comments by hunters between his first and last posts, none of them was taken seriously by developers.
We were told by GC that we are fine, our raid utility is fine and that our DPS will be relatively higher in 5.4.
Well, let’s pretend that we are really doing fine. And put dmg numbers aside for a minute.
As far as I remember, the new talent system was introduced in MoP to get rid of cookie cutter builds. But look at our talents. It seems like Exhilaration and Lynx Rush don’t even exist now. And Powershot? Some of our talents are absolutely useless, but no one at Blizzard gives a damn about it. It’s not a question of damage and balance, it’s not a question of utility or scaling, it’s not even a question of changes to class mechanics which we were told not to expect. It’s a totally different question – how can you tell your subscribers that “everything is fine” about their class and pretend at the same time that useless talents don’t exist? How can you spend entire PTR cycle and never find a minute to fix these talents? How can you expect us "not mistake silence for ignorance" after that?
Excuse my English

[Deleted]

There are classes and specs in more need of attention than hunters.

[clevin]

There are classes and specs in more need of attention than hunters.

Go away little troll.

Infracted - If you don't agree with someone, there are other ways to tell them you disagree.

[Drakoes]

There are classes and specs in more need of attention than hunters.

Not sure if troll or just another person who skim-reads the topic and posts here for the first time.

So like what then? Healers cannot be one of the biggest examples as resto shamans and resto druids are getting substantial changes in 5.4. Disc priests aren't in a dangerously low spot either, as usual.

Almost every melee also got significant buffs, including Rogues and DK's. DPS Monks have also been looked at a lot lately, according to some of the twitter feeds. So what's left? Casters? It's safe to say they're not underperforming or are in dying need of some buffs either just from the looks of 5.3.

For a class that isn't doing too great right now, especially as pointed out by some of the devs, it's reasonable that it gets some much needed attention in PvE.