J. Allen Brack and UBRS

[Leih]

Is anyone else triggered by J. Allen Brack repeatedly getting the capacity of Vanilla UBRS wrong? He said it at Blizzcon and repeated it again in articles like this one.

We've got some infrastructure stuff in place. We've got an old build that's up and running that we're using for reference. Most of this job is going to be infrastructure: making sure everything can work on a more modern setup. Then there'll be the design questions, ones that the community will have strong opinions on: should UBRS be 10-person, or 5-person? Things like that.

In the super early days of Vanilla, UBRS was originally open to as many players as you wanted (in very early days it was possible to enter with 40 iirc) and the version most Vanilla players were familiar with was the 15-man capped version which most people ran until the big 1.10 rework when they capped Strat/Scholo to 5-man and set UBRS to 10-man.

UBRS wasn't a 5-man capped instance until Cataclysm.

I sure hope Brack does a little more research if he wants to deliver AUTHENTIC vanilla experience :P

[Deleted]

I think you are wrong, it was 5 man capped in BC for sure, possibly changed even earlier. I do remember doing it with 10 people in vanilla, but then doing it many times with just 5 in BC. Then in pre-WoTLK patch everyone and their alt went there to get Jenkins title, it was 5 man back then for sure.

As for classic servers, I hope they'll do BC version of 1-60 content and classes. It was as good as vanilla, but without bugs and with perfect balance.

[ReVnX]

Not triggered but concerned.

I hope they don't change too much of WoW: Classic

I think you are wrong, it was 5 man capped in BC for sure, possibly changed even earlier. I do remember doing it with 10 people in vanilla, but then doing it many times with just 5 in BC. Then in pre-WoTLK patch everyone and their alt went there to get Jenkins title, it was 5 man back then for sure.

It was not changed to 5-man till Cata.

Capped at 15 at 1.3
Capped at 10 at 1.10

[Aeula]

It’s going to be set to patch 1.12 like the private servers most likely. So 10 would be accurate.

[Marc7]

I know you could go into UBRS 15 man, but I don't remember ever actually doing that? We did run it as a 5 man in my guild. TBH I don't remember this perfectly.

[Leih]

I know you could go into UBRS 15 man, but I don't remember ever actually doing that? We did run it as a 5 man in my guild. TBH I don't remember this perfectly.

I used to raid lead UBRS runs on my server, we had a pretty small RP community at the time. This was around patch 1.6 or so iirc.

We always ran 15-man, which was the cap. Wasn't much reason to take less people if you could field it, since there was no scaling back then. Taking less just made it harder for the sake of it!

I remember because when 1.10 came out and they reduced it to 10 half the people in our little community were like "omg how will we ever clear UBRS with 5 less people this is insane?!?!"

Of course it was nerfed a bit and turns out it wasn't that hard with 10 post-patch.

It's funny though - so many different memories. Even Blizzard can't remember how things were 100%

[Holdodlig]

Wow I hate to say it but you act like a douch with this guy.

What he's refering is 1.10 when Scholomance and Stratholme were changed to 5 man dungeons and he probably was mistaken. I played back in Vanilla and since it's been like 12 years since this patch anybody could have been mistaken, especially when you've been forced to change your mind because your boss asked to because whiny kids angrily asked you to do so.

And back in the day even if those "raids" were capped at 15 - 10 players they didn't gave a raid quality difficulty so he's right to ask the question. Back in the time when you had skill you could do the low tier raid content with half the players it needed.

[Leih]

What he's refering is 1.10 when Scholomance and Stratholme were changed to 5 man dungeons and he probably was mistaken.

Edit: For some reason I read UBRS & LBRS and didn't realise you switched gears to talk about Scholo and Strat. Ignore this.

I mean, they weren't, that's the point. In 1.10 they were made 10-man, not 5-man.

I realise this is a case of bad memory, but I found it funny and a little triggering that he talks about how it will be authentic while making such a mistake in the one example he used

- - - Updated - - -

And back in the day even if those "raids" were capped at 15 - 10 players they didn't gave a raid quality difficulty so he's right to ask the question. Back in the time when you had skill you could do the low tier raid content with half the players it needed.

It's not an authentic vanilla experience if you change raid cap sizes to something that was never the case in Vanilla. Maybe if they were making a Cata server but...

[Deleted]

Classic is Classic. They really push towards showing all you nostalgia kids you don't really want what you think you want.
Not the first time Bliz shows complete disconnection from their sponsors.

[Kaleredar]

So it begins... Which is the "the most vanilla-est" version of Vanilla? The 10 man? The 15 man? The 5 man?

"What about Stratholme?"

"Hey, my pally healer is unviable in Vanilla; fix it so I can be a holy paly! "

"Why don't we have a keyring; that was in Vanilla!"

"No no no, they added the keyring in 1.11; obviously the MOST vanilla vanilla patch was 1.10!"

"Why don't the Hakkari armor tokens require bijous like they did pre-1.11! The 1.11 version of just requiring a primal hakkari piece makes them too easy to get!"


...and so on and so forth.

The problem with Notalgia is that people will always remember it some way that it never actually was. If it's a private server, they assume that's because the private server is limited. If it's official WoW, they assume Blizzard "gimped" it in some way.

Funny how that is.

[Wries]

I mean, they weren't, that's the point. In 1.10 they were made 10-man, not 5-man.

I realise this is a case of bad memory, but I found it funny and a little triggering that he talks about how it will be authentic while making such a mistake in the one example he used

"They" as in Scholomance, BRD and Straholme were in fact changed to 5 man in 1.10
http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.10.0

But as you say UBRS was only capped to 10.

[Leih]

So it begins... Which is the "the most vanilla-est" version of Vanilla? The 10 man? The 15 man? The 5 man?

I mean, that is the question Brack is asking. And it's a totally legitimate question.

I'm not annoyed the question exists. I'm not even in favour of Classic servers myself.

As someone who played back then, I'm just annoyed because 5-man was NEVER the cap in Vanilla, so it shouldn't even be on the table in the discussion :P

[ls-]

So it begins... Which is the "the most vanilla-est" version of Vanilla? The 10 man? The 15 man? The 5 man?

"What about Stratholme?"

"Hey, my pally healer is unviable in Vanilla; fix it so I can be a holy paly! "

"Why don't we have a keyring; that was in Vanilla!"

"No no no, they added the keyring in 1.11; obviously the MOST vanilla vanilla patch was 1.10!"

"Why don't the Hakkari armor tokens require bijous like they did pre-1.11! The 1.11 version of just requiring a primal hakkari piece makes them too easy to get!"


...and so on and so forth.

The problem with Notalgia is that people will always remember it some way that it never actually was. If it's a private server, they assume that's because the private server is limited. If it's official WoW, they assume Blizzard "gimped" it in some way.

Funny how that is.

I mean, many people will be bitching about WoW Classic servers not being PS-like because they'll be getting waaaay less gold, balance will be different and so on.

PS after all is only an approximation and tons of guesswork in many cases, but now after all these years people believe that that's how retail Vanilla was, and that's what they'll expect from WoW Classic.

[Leih]

"They" as in Scholomance, BRD and Straholme were in fact changed to 5 man in 1.10
http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.10.0

But as you say UBRS was only capped to 10.

This topic is about UBRS, which is what Brack said. He mentioned nothing of Strat and Scholo. Please see the quote in OP!

[Revamp Man]

you guys deserve 100% vanilla nothing else

[Almaric]

Is anyone else triggered

No. Just you. Get a therapist. "Triggered" is not a real thing, it's called having a bitch fit.

[Deleted]

I always did 5man UBRS. Never saw reason why to do it as 10.

[Holdodlig]

I mean, they weren't, that's the point. In 1.10 they were made 10-man, not 5-man.

I realise this is a case of bad memory, but I found it funny and a little triggering that he talks about how it will be authentic while making such a mistake in the one example he used

You see, even you have a bad memory of the time :

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.10.0

"Stratholme, Scholomance, and Blackrock Depths now allow a maximum of five players"

[Deleted]

Horde side gettin people 'blood ready' early days of retail meant you ran UBRS during raid hours for 4 hours a night 15man teams (can't remember how early on they capped it, pretty sure we ran it 20man actually) killing Drakki'sath until everyone had their Onyxia necks ready.

[Leih]

You see, even you have a bad memory of the time :

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_1.10.0

"Stratholme, Scholomance, and Blackrock Depths now allow a maximum of five players"

Sorry this topic is about UBRS. Not sure what you're talking about Strat, Scholo and BRD for.