BFA filler, not necessarily bad

[Onikaroshi]

People always seem to use filler as derogatory, mostly cause show filler (Anime/TWD/Etc) can be quite dull. MoP was "filler" as it did not fully relate to the overarching stories being told, it was not stories known from other sources. People are assuming BfA is "filler" because so far we have no story and seems like a bridge from one to another.

But it doesn't mean bad, MoP was great, story does not always make an expansion, this isn't a tv show where you're wondering if Glenn really died and they're just stringing you along with Morgan filler.

[Queen of Hamsters]

There’s no such thing as a filler expansion. WoD is only deemed that because they didn’t support it post launch. Now they could do that again, and given people’s lukewarm reception to BfA, they might do that again. I don’t think they will, WoD lessons learned and all that.

There's no "lukewarm reception" though. In fact, thanks to Legion having been what it is, the fanbase seems to be way more hopeful and positive than they were moving from WoD to Legion, or the reception of MoP... Of course, not on MMO-C, these forums are never positive.

Take the announcement Cinematic, for example. Record-breaking numbers (7.7 million views in 2 weeks) and thus spread.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSJr3dXZfcg

[Onikaroshi]

There's no "lukewarm reception" though.

Take the announcement Cinematic, for example. Record-breaking numbers (7.7 million views in 2 weeks) and thus spread.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSJr3dXZfcg

Upvotes to downvotes is like 46 to 1, yea, that's far from lukewarm lol, you'd be expecting more like 50/50 if it was lukewarm. People bash things on MMO-C and suddenly they think everyone is bashing things?

I wish people would really stop looking at MMO-C as a good representation of the WoW population.

[plz delete account]

I disagree that BFA is a "Filler" expansion.

No, it doesn't leap up into ever scaling heights of escalating power like it's a season of DBZ (Though looking at the forums we're definitely going to see months of pointless yelling before we get anywhere). But it does get back to the core Warcraft Story: Alliance Vs Horde.

Are the devs good at telling that story? It's definitely a point of contention... but it's where the story is 'supposed' to be.

And also I've got hopes it'll be good.

*Core of the Warcraft story is Orcs massacring Humans and Draenei.

[Fayolynn]

Think something like Troll raid with Old God touches > Kul Tiras related raid with Nazjatar and Azshara and then something in Stormwind as culmination - I am almost certain we will end up raiding Stormwind in the end both because of novel "Before the Storm" and seeing how there is talk about Stormwind being the goal and the general vibe going on

Please no, the last thing we need is a repeat of the end of MoP. Also I think thats reaching a bit on the title. The Storm its referencing is the interfaction war itself and not Stormwind.

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MoP was great

What made MoP great? I'm personally looking forward to being able to skip it when the new leveling system is introduced.

[Broken Fox]

BFA isn’t even out yet so all it is is a reception to trailers and previews. I remember people being really hyped for WoD and look how that turned out.

[Sencha]

OP doesn't like faction war, then BfA is a filler expansion.

[angrys13]

One thing that forces me to feel that this is not a filler expansion is the topic from yesterday's dev Q&A with Ion about how gear and tier sets are being created.

They specifically stated they are coloring their art towards raid tier environments because, and I quote, "How would an OLD GOD THEMED PRIEST SET look like?"

Which, to ME, implies that the end-game for this expansion will indeed be a battle for azeroth, but not from a faction vs faction standpoint, but potentially old gods. I'm moving also towards N'zoth or maybe even one we haven't heard of.

[MyndZero]

• "When your thrones run red with betrayal... when your holy places burn and the shattered mask hangs above your hearth... only then you will know. And it will be too late."
  Hint sylvanas will do a good one on stormwind?

If it's a filler expansion, why do they have something from 2 expansions ago tellings you the future of the game? That seems pretty lore important to me, and so, not a filler expansion.

[Queen of Hamsters]

What made MoP great? I'm personally looking forward to being able to skip it when the new leveling system is introduced.

From an objective standpoint?

Development efforts put into it, pacing of content, features.

From a subjective standpoint?

Story, scenery, raiding, Challenge modes, world content, Isle of Thunder.

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BFA isn’t even out yet so all it is is a reception to trailers and previews. I remember people being really hyped for WoD and look how that turned out.

Correlation =/= causation.

WoD "turned out" as it did due to the lack of development put into it, shitty decisions all around, not because of people being hyped... Many of whom, were hyped simply due to WoD being about "not Pandas!!!"... I remember people saying the same thing about Legion whenever someone was hyped, and "look how that turned out".
If anything, I don't imagine them ever wanting to turn around the positive upward trends from critical acclaim and revenue by giving us another WoD.

[Directionalk9]

*Core of the Warcraft story is Orcs massacring Humans and Draenei.

The way god intended.

[AbalDarkwind]

-Two Faction capitals that have been in the game since WoW launched have been destroyed.
-The Factions and their leaders are all getting more of the spotlight to develop them further.
-Animosity between Sylvanas and Genn that has been built up since Cataclysm has come to a climax.
-Two locations people have asked about since the beginning of WoW are being added in Kul Tiras and Zandalar.
-Queen Azshara is going to be a major raid boss.
-The vestiges of the Kul Tirasian Sea Priests, Queen Azshara's direct involvement, and Old God experimentation in Uldir all seem to point towards N'Zoth being involved.

None of that seems like filler to me.

[Fayolynn]

OP doesn't like faction war, then BfA is a filler expansion.

In all fairness in the past Blizzards faction war story telling as left much to be desired.

[Steampunkette]

*Core of the Warcraft story is Orcs massacring Humans and Draenei.

The core of the warcraft story is actually "Terrible shit happens because there are awful people on all sides of every situation but there's good people, too, so we should probably try to get along, oops someone started another war!"

Though from a Horde perspective the story is probably mostly about the abuses of those in power enslaving others, whether it's the Demons who made the Orcs go from peaceful to bloodthirsty in the first place or the humans who spent time debating whether to enslave the orcs or commit genocide including the slaughter of infants (Genn was a proponent of the latter, by the way, and built his wall 'cause Lordaeron went for Slavery, instead! And after WC3 Daelin and later the Scarlet Crusade both decided to try out the genocide method).

The real story, of course is "Fuck! We didn't get the rights to Warhammer so let's rip it off without explicitly saying we're doing that!"

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-Two Faction capitals that have been in the game since WoW launched have been destroyed.
-The Factions and their leaders are all getting more of the spotlight to develop them further.
-Animosity between Sylvanas and Genn that has been built up since Cataclysm has come to a climax.
-Two locations people have asked about since the beginning of WoW are being added in Kul Tiras and Zandalar.
-Queen Azshara is going to be a major raid boss.
-The vestiges of the Kul Tirasian Sea Priests, Queen Azshara's direct involvement, and Old God experimentation in Uldir all seem to point towards N'Zoth being involved.

None of that seems like filler to me.

I would like to note that there's been no build up since Cataclysm.

In Cataclysm there was animosity, but the surrender of Gilneas was a thing and it essentially "Ended" the war between Lordaeron and Gilneas. Nothing happened in Mists. Nothing happened in WoD. Then we learn that there has apparently always been a continuing war between the two because Greymane is pissed and has had a continuing campaign of aggression even after he was ordered by the High King to knock it off.

[Onikaroshi]

What made MoP great? I'm personally looking forward to being able to skip it when the new leveling system is introduced.

Well, honestly, things that aren't the leveling, the endgame stuff is what made the expansion. I leveled 11 characters through mop during the expansion time, not the worst leveling, but far from the best.

[AbalDarkwind]

I would like to note that there's been no build up since Cataclysm.

In Cataclysm there was animosity, but the surrender of Gilneas was a thing and it essentially "Ended" the war between Lordaeron and Gilneas. Nothing happened in Mists. Nothing happened in WoD. Then we learn that there has apparently always been a continuing war between the two because Greymane is pissed and has had a continuing campaign of aggression even after he was ordered by the High King to knock it off.

The "surrender" of Gilneas was not something that was resolved; it was left open ended. That's why there's a BG of it. While you're correct that that conflict was left by the wayside in MoP and WoD, it was reignited in Legion because of Sylvanas' seemingly apparent betrayal at the Broken Shore and Genn's unresolved resentment.

I'll agree that there wasn't a steady build up of it, but two of the last four expansions lent a significant chunk of time to their conflict. The build up was there.

[Goobaman]

• Yes, it is a filler expansion, as we cant go about stopping sargeras AND taking care of the old gods in 4 years. Then whats left?
  
• If you recall, in MoP wrathion was warning of the legion, then we got WoD then legion finally came. All the quotes in legion regarding the void will lead into the same timeline.
  
• "When your thrones run red with betrayal... when your holy places burn and the shattered mask hangs above your hearth... only then you will know. And it will be too late."
  Hint sylvanas will do a good one on stormwind?
  
• As we battle of azeroth, im sure the old gods will wake up just like they did in MoP with the sha.
  
• Blizzard confirmed in a interview they like expansions story leading into the next, not popping out of no where like previous.

Filler carries a negative connotation, which is why you'll see tons of pushback.

I agree it doesn't necessarily mean devoid of meaningful content but sadly, WoD was and now the word filler is forever bringing people back to descriptions of WoD and BfA does not currently look like it'll be as empty as WoD was...but then again, i don't think WoD originally looked like it would BE so devoid of meaningful content..lol

From a story-telling perspective, i still disagree. Filler implies nothing of value occurs. I think you and any one else who thinks BfA won't have valuable events or storylines is completely out of touch, but that's my opinion. BfA is shaping up to deliver a story more like what players expected from WoW and i think they'll have to try to botch it.

[Steampunkette]

Also: The "Filler" Episdoes of the show Supernatural are the -best- Episodes.

They're the ones that get back to the core identity of "Two bros who go around killing monsters and saving people's lives" as opposed to the current "Reimagined Biblical Figures and their Angel Friend/Boyfriend play 'Three Men and a Baby' with Lucifer's kid". Like. Seriously. Even before they killed Death himself and helped God's sister get out of the void the show's meta-arcs were fucking ridiculous.

[Radaney]

MoP was seen as filler and it was my favourite expansion so.

[Fayolynn]

From an objective standpoint?

Development efforts put into it, pacing of content, features.

From a subjective standpoint?

Story, scenery, raiding, Challenge modes, world content, Isle of Thunder.

Objective Standpoint

Development effort on it's own doesn't make an expansion good because the effort can result in an inferior product.

Pacing of content was good outside SoO, but waaaaay to long was spent in that raid, it was the definitive content drought. https://imgur.com/a/sNVU0

Features, yes it had features which is a good thing, but he quality of them is subjective.

Subjective stuff

The story started off good but ended in a nonsensical shit storm. Everything that happened post Isle of Thunder was horribly handled. Tactically it made no sense for the Alliance to team up with the Horde Rebel faction in taking down Garrosh. From a story telling perspective he was getting desperate due to his side losing the current round of fighting. Logically the Alliance should let the Horde finish imploding due to infighting and then sweep in and clean up whatever was left. Instead due to the status quo needing to be maintained they team up with the rebels, but originally had to ask nicely to help out. The dominant faction had to ask the weakest faction to help out. It took player out cry before Blizzard saw how badly they were handling that and gave Alliance players the ability to call out Vol'jin and say you need us more then we need you. Then moving forward from there the Alliance helps depose Garrosh, gives control of the city back to Vol'Jins forces and leaves with an empty threat to end the Horde if they ever tried starting trouble again. That literally makes zero sense for what Blizzard claimed was the super power on Azeroth to do. They didn't Garrison forces in the city to monitor Horde activity, they didn't make any demands for lost territory to be returned or penalize the Horde in any way. They just walked away.

Scenery - Agreed, Blizzards usually does a very good job visually.

Raiding - Raids were good. The long time spent in SoO leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

Challenge modes - Agreed, I wish they would re-open these since they can scale our levels down now.

World Content - elaborate?

Isle of Thunder - Agreed, this was the highlight of the expansion IMO.

Overall I feel like the expansion was decent at best. Pandaria as a whole is just so different from the rest of Azeroth that it felt off somehow. The tone started off super light hearted and then they tried to make it dark towards the end but failed.

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Well, honestly, things that aren't the leveling, the endgame stuff is what made the expansion. I leveled 11 characters through mop during the expansion time, not the worst leveling, but far from the best.

I'll be skipping BC and MoP for future characters. I would skip WoD if they let us.