What is the logic behind saying Piracy is stealing?

[schwarzkopf]

Telling people they can't make the same things other people make

That makes no sense. Copying something isn't making it ... saying that is as stupid as saying it is stealing it.

Be rational.

[Lightbull]

Same reason emulated NES games are illegal. Nintendo is taking down NES ROMs all the time from emulator sites.

[Total Crica]

That makes no sense. Copying something isn't making it ... saying that is as stupid as saying it is stealing it.

Be rational.

Bullshit. I can copy many things by making them myself. I just need the same resources that were used to make the thing I am copying.

[cparle87]

Honestly I think a lot of corporations and their representatives are refusing to respond to piracy in a sensible way (ie, embrace a modern distribution and pricing system) and that's greatly exacerbating the problem. I have absolutely no desire to torrent but I'm frequently reduced to it for lack of a better option. They just refuse to shut up and take my money.

But I don't think defenders of piracy are doing their side any favours by trying to pretend it's all hunky dory.

It's their property. They can distribute and price it however they like. Not like it does not give you the right to steal it.

[schwarzkopf]

I can copy many things by making them myself.

You are factually incorrect. Suggest that you look up what 'making' means.

[SethRoguen]

Telling people they can't make the same things other people make. That's oppressing people into having to buy what others make instead of being able to make it themselves for themselves. Fuck that. No one has any right to tell me I have to buy what they make if I have the ability to make it myself.

Really dont see the problem in that. The shitty thing is making something that someone else has made then distributing it to people. Private WoW servers, plagarizing books, etc.

[Twen]

If that’s what you think a bad person is you must have some pretty poor values. I guess all the volunteer time I’ve done food I’ve donated to the homeless, animals I’ve helped working at pet centres and more don’t count because I don’t pay already rich artist for songs.

Didn't read the whole thread so not sure if this was already addressed, but using "the artist is already rich" as a justification to take their product for free does not hold water whatsoever; if everyone acted the same way as you then almost nobody would pay the artist and they'd be left quite poor instead. So what exactly makes YOU so special that you can just skip paying and leave it to other people? Nothing, that's what - not even your voluntary good deeds, while admirable they have nothing to do with it. Not that the fact that someone has money would be a valid excuse to not pay for their product in the first place, come on now.

[SethRoguen]

I don't see the difference between one dude buying a show and then putting it on torrent for others to use and me inviting over 10 people to watch Game of Thrones on my cable TV. In both cases people watch it for free. What's the deal here?

The difference is that hundreds of thousands if not millions of people are getting access to that episode instead of a few of your friends.

for GoT specifically, there have been estimates of over a billion https://torrentfreak.com/game-of-thr...-times-170905/

[Katchii]

Telling people they can't make the same things other people make. That's oppressing people into having to buy what others make instead of being able to make it themselves for themselves. Fuck that. No one has any right to tell me I have to buy what they make if I have the ability to make it myself.

So....you're actually trying to argue that you have the skills, training, understanding, and overall technical ability to write, create, build, program, etc... absolutely anything and everything that has ever been or will ever be made including video games, music, movies, television shows, paintings, books, statues, software, and literally anything else that would fall under copyright or patent law...and therefore it is oppressive of someone to say that because you have the ability to make it....BUT DIDN'T...that it's illegal/ against the law to just copy and take it....

Are you fucking kidding me? That's the most ridiculously stupid out of your mind, completely unhinged from reality claim I've ever heard.

[Elim Garak]

There is no logic. It's just idiocy.

[Katchii]

If that’s what you think a bad person is you must have some pretty poor values. I guess all the volunteer time I’ve done food I’ve donated to the homeless, animals I’ve helped working at pet centres and more don’t count because I don’t pay already rich artist for songs.

While I wouldn't say shitty human being, it still means you are breaking copyright law. All of the good things you do that you listed don't magically make the bad/ illegal things you do OK.

[Kaleredar]

Have you ever borrowed a movie or CD or video game or any physical object from a friend? If so, then you have denied a potential sale to the company that created that object. Shame on you.

...except your friend then does not have that copy.

If you both wanted to utilize two individually, you'd have to buy two.

It's like why going to the grocery store, buying bread, and then giving it go your friend is legal, but your friend stealing a loaf of bread is not.

[Topaz]

This probably doesn't apply as much to success stories such as WoW, but as someone who is looking to go into the video games development industry.. if I busted my ass developing a game which I was relying on to sell for my income (as most devs do), I'd feel really shitty having people pirate my hard-earned work and get left out in the cold with nothing to show for the investment of time I put into making the game.

Just like any form of entertainment, you don't NEED it, you don't depend on it for survival, but the people who make them often do. Many forms of entertainment out there are optional and we have a large range of choices on what we choose to spend our money on to increase enjoyment in our lives.

On top of that, people might tell themselves "oh it's fine, this company probably makes enough money anyway..", while they might turn over a lot of profit, I'd also argue that the very things that exist in the entertainment industry that make the most money usually are the things that are entertaining the most people. What's the issue of having popular entertainment providers earning the most money? Why should that justify reasons for individuals to take their earnings away from them, no matter how small?

[Ahovv]

I love how hard people try and rationalize and justify their actions. People will go to great lengths to convince themselves that they are not shitty people.

Ah yes, potentially preventing another $10 from going to a multi-billion dollar corporation makes someone a shitty person. That's the REAL outrage

Considering most companies dodge their taxes to avoid funding basic public services, I really don't give a single fuck if I pirate from them. Now, would I pirate something like The Witcher 3? No, because it's a great game from an ethical company. Would I pirate something from some Hollywood studio? Sure.

[Alvito]

The question being what is the logic behind saying piracy is stealing is answered fairly well with asking why people think it is okay to take or have something they haven't paid for. Taking something you haven't paid for by definition is stealing. Often people will counter with some nonsense that they paid for it once and they now feel it is theirs forever, but that isn't a trend that carries over to almost any other form of retail and is a lame justification.

[yoma]

...except your friend then does not have that copy.

If you both wanted to utilize two individually, you'd have to buy two.

It's like why going to the grocery store, buying bread, and then giving it go your friend is legal, but your friend stealing a loaf of bread is not.

So as long as someone who uploads a movie to a streaming site deletes/destroys their copy so as not to possess one anymore, they are in the clear?

Your explanation doesn't justify your denying a potential sale.

Let's say your neighbor just mowed his yard. You need to mow your yard as well, so you borrow his and then give it back when done. You continue this system until you both die. You just denied John Deere a sale on a mower because you borrowed your neighbors.

In this same vein, if I set up a screen sharing environment where both my friend and I could both watch the same movie at the same time in different rooms with only one legit copy, is the one who doesnt have the physical copy with them pirating?

[Kaleredar]

So as long as someone who uploads a movie to a streaming site deletes/destroys their copy so as not to possess one anymore, they are in the clear?

Your explanation doesn't justify your denying a potential sale.

Let's say your neighbor just mowed his yard. You need to mow your yard as well, so you borrow his and then give it back when done. You continue this system until you both die. You just denied John Deere a sale on a mower because you borrowed your neighbors.

In this same vein, if I set up a screen sharing environment where both my friend and I could both watch the same movie at the same time in different rooms with only one legit copy, is the one who doesnt have the physical copy with them pirating?

See but here's the thing... when you're downloading a pirated film you aren't using a lawnmower or using a screenshare; you're pirating a film. And in none of those instances are you duplicating anything that would otherwise require ownership to utilize. When you pirate a film... you are.


Like honestly I don't really care if people pirate things. But the way they try and justify it to themselves is just stupid. Own it, don't try and justify it in your mind to excuse yourself from theft.

[PosPosPos]

So as long as someone who uploads a movie to a streaming site deletes/destroys their copy so as not to possess one anymore, they are in the clear?

Your explanation doesn't justify your denying a potential sale.

Let's say your neighbor just mowed his yard. You need to mow your yard as well, so you borrow his and then give it back when done. You continue this system until you both die. You just denied John Deere a sale on a mower because you borrowed your neighbors.

In this same vein, if I set up a screen sharing environment where both my friend and I could both watch the same movie at the same time in different rooms with only one legit copy, is the one who doesnt have the physical copy with them pirating?

In that idiotic lawnmower example, chances are that you would simply choose not to mow your lawn, because you are cheapskates/lazy enough to want to borrow one in the first place.

Which is the exact same argument for online piracy, even if you do prevent people from accessing intellectual property without permission, it's not like it's going to impact your sales much, if any.

[Deleted]

That is not an accurate definition.

Then please elaborate on how the definition of stealing can not be applied on piracy?

[chubbybunny]

I like how they say that pirating a movie helps fund terrorists...