Trump announcing on Weds that USA recognizes Jerusalem as the capital of Israel

[Felya]

Hamas and Hezbollah should be trolled. Responding to trolling with any type of violence is proof that they aren't seriously interested in peace.

No, they should be stopped. Trolling is a job well done for you, because unlike every Israel citizen... you are not in conscription... you will not face the results of their rage. Terrorist groups are not fucking noobs on WoW...

[PC2]

Be careful what you wish for.

The Guardian has it backwards. The problem is that Israel is wearing kiddie gloves and is more concerned about collateral damage than they are about the safety of the Israeli people. The only way to teach Hamas is by hammering them hard, thereby teaching the good folks in Gaza about all the destruction that Hamas brings.

[DarkTZeratul]

The only way to teach Hamas is by hammering them hard, thereby teaching the good folks in Gaza about all the destruction that Hamas brings.

No, that will teach the folks of Gaza to resist harder because Israel doesn't care about them and won't hesitate to kill them if it becomes convenient.

[Draco-Onis]

The Guardian has it backwards. The problem is that Israel is wearing kiddie gloves and is more concerned about collateral damage than they are about the safety of the Israeli people. The only way to teach Hamas is by hammering them hard, thereby teaching the good folks in Gaza about all the destruction that Hamas brings.

The Israeli government has no love for Hamas they aren't wearing kid gloves but they are aware that they aren't going to stop terrorism by proving them right. Also the more innocent people you slaughter the more you open the spigot of money from the other Arab nations not to mention fuel Iran's nuclear ambition. If things were this simple it would have been over decades ago. You can't win this with force period it's been tried.

[Shadowmelded]

What a shitty place for a school

Not much of a justification, especially when they were given the coordinates of it repeatedly. Let me guess, this was a "shitty place" for a hospital too?

[Skroe]

1) So much for the US even maintaing the pretense of an honest negotiator. Looks like Israeli/Palestinian peace won't be resolved by us.

2) Donald Trump is a hysterically bad negotiator. On what planet does one GIVE AWAY leverage for free? Trump just forfeited a very useful tool in negotiations against the Israelis and Palestinians.

For no reason at all.

Other than to satisfy his uneducated, paranoid, crazy, knuckledragger base.


This is cynically destructive foreign policy at it's worst that does not advance American OR Israeli interests. It's a sugar high, that will have damaging long term effects.

G fucking G.

[mvaliz]

Yep.

If a terrorist attacks a school or a marketplace, destroy their family's home, punish the whole family. That might be a good deterrent.

Tell me, if they bombed your family and children killing them all - would you dust your hands off and say "well, sure learned my lesson! That's what i get for following my beliefs!"? =\

[Kiri]

1) So much for the US even maintaing the pretense of an honest negotiator. Looks like Israeli/Palestinian peace won't be resolved by us.

2) Donald Trump is a hysterically bad negotiator. On what planet does one GIVE AWAY leverage for free? Trump just forfeited a very useful tool in negotiations against the Israelis and Palestinians.

For no reason at all.

Other than to satisfy his uneducated, paranoid, crazy, knuckledragger base.


This is cynically destructive foreign policy at it's worst that does not advance American OR Israeli interests. It's a sugar high, that will have damaging long term effects.

G fucking G.

Trump was never a negotiator. He was a successful businessman, which fooled people into thinking he is. This approach actually mirrors what he would do in the business world. Throw his weight around, show what he can do and destabilize the other side, since he can afford losses more easily.
It is actually not that bad a move, in a very cynical kind of way. His supporters will lap it up because he has shown to be a 'strong leader' there. If that increases violence in the ME, they will just see evil Muslims doing evil things, uncaring that Trump might have instigated stuff. Low chance of getting Americans killed, too. And if somehow something happens to the embassy, he gets a Carte Blanche to bomb Palestine. I know that this is the last thing the US would logically want, but that doesn't matter to him. It's a great distraction, there is very little he could actually lose, his supporters love him for it. The only thing that suffers is the image of the US in the eyes of the world. But he doesn't care about stuff like that, demonstrably so.

[Traveler Voltin]

So trump is getting flack for something Clinton and bush wanted to do.
Not surprised

[Deleted]

So trump is getting flack for something Clinton and bush wanted to do.
Not surprised

Have you ever wondered why they never did it?

[Theinquisition]

Not much of a justification, especially when they were given the coordinates of it repeatedly. Let me guess, this was a "shitty place" for a hospital too?

Yeah, especially when Hamas and other groups are firing rockets from those locations, right under the U.N.'s nose.

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Tell me, if they bombed your family and children killing them all - would you dust your hands off and say "well, sure learned my lesson! That's what i get for following my beliefs!"? =\

Well, I'd sure as hell make sure my kids didn't grow up to be terrorists and place the whole family in risk.

[Shadowferal]

Have you ever wondered why they never did it?

They apparently knew the reasons not to...
Unlike the dumbshit Trump...
Trump didn't seem to have complete understanding of Jerusalem decision: report

[Shadowmelded]

Yeah, especially when Hamas and other groups are firing rockets from those locations, right under the U.N.'s nose.

Not even Israel is claiming they were firing rockets from that location.

[Mormolyce]

I'll also note that it's precisely through admitting the Jewish claim how we can structure an Arab claim. Because, without that ancient history, what's left is the claim of conquest: Arabs lost the wars.
It's disheartening that Palestine supporters so easily develop skepticism, xenophobia, racism, against the Jews.

I think there's a BIT of a difference between land "your people" once ruled 2,000 years ago and a country you grew up in that had part of its territory seized in living memory.

For the record I am not on either side in the Israel-Palestine conflict. I consider that to be rather like covering your dick in honey and shoving it into a beehive. I am just talking about the philosophical justification for the creation of the state of Israel in the 20th century.

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They apparently knew the reasons not to...
Unlike the dumbshit Trump...
Trump didn't seem to have complete understanding of Jerusalem decision: report

I feel like "didn't have a complete understanding" is the new "intelligence failure".

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So trump is getting flack for something Clinton and bush wanted to do.
Not surprised

They "wanted to do it" but every six months of their Presidency, like clockwork, they vetoed it. They also did not issue any executive orders to its effect.

Your homework: find out why and report back here. I'll be grading your response.

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This is cynically destructive foreign policy at it's worst that does not advance American OR Israeli interests. It's a sugar high, that will have damaging long term effects.

G fucking G.

Everyone's focused on the furor in the Middle East this tipped off, I mean for good reason, but I noticed something else that nobody is really talking about.

One of the primary reasons that previous Presidents continued to veto this 1995 act of Congress was (apart from the fact it's idiotic)... it undermines the President's supremacy on matters of foreign policy.

Which um... was a key argument in Trump's travel ban case. So...

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Yep.

If a terrorist attacks a school or a marketplace, destroy their family's home, punish the whole family. That might be a good deterrent.

I want you to calm down and think about what you just said.

Forget that this is a dick measuring contest on the internet and assess that statement like a human being for a second.

[tyrlaan]

I hate my some Trump with every fiber of my being, but let's not let everyone else off the hook on this one:

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefi...sraels-capital

[Slant]

So trump is getting flack for something Clinton and bush wanted to do.
Not surprised

A bluff's only good as long as nobody calls it. Trump just put down his ridiculous hand without anyone calling it. Yes, that's how stupid this move is.

[Polyxo]

Yeah, especially when Hamas and other groups are firing rockets from those locations, right under the U.N.'s nose.

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Well, I'd sure as hell make sure my kids didn't grow up to be terrorists and place the whole family in risk.

They're beyond that. The general mindset in much of Palestine, especially Gaza, is that there is no point to them pursuing a peaceful negotiation, and that Israel will take what it wants from them, whenever it wants. The general belief is that they, and their family members will be killed or maimed by the Israeli military whether they involve themselves in any conflict or not. Unfortunately, Israel keeps providing case studies that show that they're right.

[McFuu]

Honest question, but why are all posters on MMO-C from Israel hyper-nationalist racists? Feels weird

i.e.



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Ye, how dare poeple critize Isreal.

It's not criticism. It's people legitimately saying Isreal can't do this, Isreal has to do this, etc...
Criticism would be, I think they could handle the situation with moving West Bank communities differently, I think that they should be more more careful when exercising force against hostile Palestinians who purposely hide amongst the populace.
Not shit like oh they can't move their capital, Jerusalem doesn't belong to them, they need to turn over their lands. It's tiresome. Out of all the countries in the world everything Isreal does is constantly scrutinized, while they are surrounded by assholes on all sides with little help. No one condemning Iran when they call for death to all Jews, or Egypt, the innocent Hamas only want them all dead too. But of course it's always Isreal fault they are mad at them.

[Polyxo]

It's not criticism. It's people legitimately saying Isreal can't do this, Isreal has to do this, etc...
Criticism would be, I think they could handle the situation with moving West Bank communities differently, I think that they should be more more careful when exercising force against hostile Palestinians who purposely hide amongst the populace.
Not shit like oh they can't move their capital, Jerusalem doesn't belong to them, they need to turn over their lands. It's tiresome. Out of all the countries in the world everything Isreal does is constantly scrutinized, while they are surrounded by assholes on all sides with little help. No one condemning Iran when they call for death to all Jews, or Egypt, the innocent Hamas only want them all dead too. But of course it's always Isreal fault they are mad at them.

Israel has the unique status of being the only active European colonial state.

[Trifle]

Criticism would be, I think they could handle the situation with moving West Bank communities differently, I think that they should be more more careful when exercising force against hostile Palestinians who purposely hide amongst the populace.
Not shit like oh they can't move their capital, Jerusalem doesn't belong to them, they need to turn over their lands.

I think they should handle the situation with constantly stealing Palestinian land, destroying their infrastructure and starving them with blockades differently. I think they should be more careful when deciding their capital, as East Jerusalem is still internationally considered to be illegally occupied by them.

Better ?