I'm sorry to say it, but leaving us 6 months in the dark is completely unacceptable..

[Valkrysa]

My guess is Classic can't launch until AT LEAST 6 months after BFA as they can't have BFA effected by anticipation for Classic. Since that would put classic out AT THE EARLIEST part way into 2019 it would be best for them not to talk about it at all until after BFA launch plus some buffer room.

[Ielenia]

Nothing inflammatory about an observation.

Please don't play coy. It reflects poorly on you. You know full well that the issue is with how you presented your observation. And I'm also sure you know that posting your observation was going to ruffle some feathers, especially with how you worded it. And you cannot claim it was incidental, because the vast majority of your posts, regarding Classic and/or current WoW, are all littered with that inflammatory way of posting.

I am quite sure that there are people unsatisfied playing Legion but feel like they cannot stop. Some of those are likely to feel a bit jealous of those who are excited about Classic.

This is another example. It's a useless statement with zero argumentative value, so the sole purpose of posting it is to bait others.

I mean, surely you've seen the many troll posts meant to incite Classic proponents?

Roughly the same number of troll posts meant to incite current WoW players? You apparently included?

[Vestig3]

Problem is out of all those that have experienced Vanilla only a realy tiny part will come back but i doubt they are excited they will just play it for nostalgic reasons and those that are currently playing legion and will play classic aswell will be excited when it launches but them turn that smile upside down when they experience it, gameplay wise vanilla wasnt that appealing, as for the rest i refer to my signature line, - Vanilla was legitimately bad; we just didn't know any better at the time -

[Maudib]

They can not use the old database structures, they have to build a new database...... They are not going to run a database that has no support contract, it is suicide if a corruption happens. Also they will not be using the old client as they would have to rebuild it from the ground up to work within Bnet distribution.

Do you know how easy it is to convert one database to another? very, very easy.

[meowfurion]

Many people quit because of the conveniences. Many will come back. Half a million at best. Which is serious income for a game that needs no innovation or more than a small dev team.

It's cool to hate classic though.

Source of your numbers?

Mine was clearly an exaggeration for a light-hearted prodding. Just curious where you got your idea that it'll be half a million at best.

I don't care if it's cool or not. I hate classic regardless of popular opinion.

[Vestig3]

It's cool to hate classic though.

You call it hate i call it people that use their brain and speak logicly while staying neutral.

[Maudib]

Please don't play coy. It reflects poorly on you. You know full well that the issue is with how you presented your observation. And I'm also sure you know that posting your observation was going to ruffle some feathers, especially with how you worded it. And you cannot claim it was incidental, because the vast majority of your posts, regarding Classic and/or current WoW, are all littered with that inflammatory way of posting.


This is another example. It's a useless statement with zero argumentative value, so the sole purpose of posting it is to bait others.


Roughly the same number of troll posts meant to incite current WoW players? You apparently included?

I'm not, and I sure don;t mince words even if people might need to seek out a safe space after hearing them.

Do you mean to tell me you don' agree with the statement: There are people unsatisfied playing Legion but feel like they cannot stop. Some of those are likely to feel a bit jealous of those who are excited about Classic.

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So you're forcing yourself to do something you DON'T enjoy, and you're shocked when you don't enjoy it?

What a twist.

I don't enjoy doing world quests, so I just don't do them. I enjoy raiding, doing M+, and PvP'ing with a friend, so I do those instead. It's not that hard.

Ummm... not me? I don't play live because I don't enjoy it. I play Vanilla, BC, and Wrath because I do.

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I'm fairly positive they already said they're not going to use the old 2004 client and server software, so no, it is not being re-released. You're getting new software with old content. Most likely based on the same engine as BfA, for simple expediency.

The rest is just you making random guesses that fly in the face of reality. If it was really that easy, we'd have had classic servers up and running already.

I'm fairly positive that Blizzard stated they had the old client/server running already... and this was months ago. They talked about getting it to work with the new instance servers.

[Erwarth]

Do you know how easy it is to convert one database to another? very, very easy.

No it's not. But you have proven many time how clueless you are about this topic.

[Ielenia]

I'm not, and I sure don;t mince words even if people might need to seek out a safe space after hearing them.

There is a difference between "not mincing words" and "being intentionally bait-y". And your posts indicate you lean much more to the latter than the former. I mean, even your signatures lend heavy credence to that theory.

Do you mean to tell me you don' agree with the statement: There are people unsatisfied playing Legion but feel like they cannot stop. Some of those are likely to feel a bit jealous of those who are excited about Classic.

Do you agree with this statement: there are people who are unable move on, unable to accept the fact the game they started playing has changed. Some of those are likely to lash out at others because they dare to enjoy the current version of a certain game.

[Deleted]

i want mooooooore!

[Jester Joe]

Ummm... not me? I don't play live because I don't enjoy it. I play Vanilla, BC, and Wrath because I do.

So why are you speaking for the millions of others that do?

There are people clearing world quests because they enjoy it.
There are also people not doing them because they hate them.

Who are you to say "Get over it... go log back into live and do another couple dozen world quests... you know you gotta."?

[Chaelexi]

Do you know how easy it is to convert one database to another? very, very easy.

I see you changed your tune from before of they will just use the old database........ It depends, you first have to build the new DB to import the data into and worry about possible corruptions from a 13 y/o DB. It is a lot more work than you think, even Blizzard said so in their interviews. AS I have said before I am a DC architecture consultant and been part of many large DC projects in both software development firms and public sector space.

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There is not really much to discuss from blizzard side. You are getting vanilla as it is. What kind of update did you want from them?

You are not though because Vanilla as it is will not run properly server side. They also have been very clear that they do not want to maintain 2 client software suites. But they have been clear that it will be a "Vanilla like Experience". There will also be many game breaking exploit fixes that happen, as well as bugs(IE falling through world at random due to spaghetti code)

[Torrasque]

I do not see any links. Statements like "It's a huge undertaking" or some such aren't quantitative.

Not looking for anything that you disagree with sure help you out, doesn't it? This goes back to the point that I mentioned with you adamanting ignoring key points or entire posts made against you. It's sure convenient for you when you make claims, don't support them with evidence, and then ignore your opposition.

you can believe what you want... but it comes down to what you believe they ARE doing technically... which is pure conjecture on anyone's part because we do NOT know.

Expect what has already been announced and revealed. I get your point, what they have already posted and shown us could not be in the final build, but you've provided no proof other than hearsay on that point. Perhaps assuming that you knew what you were going on about what too much to assume you could prove?

I believe that Blizzard will stand up Classic with the original client with only the most minor changes to security, server, and database calls. The database is easily imported to the new format. (Do you really think these companies make incompatible database versions without some form of conversion tools? Pffft. They would not still be in business.

Again, I've already posted links and shown you that your own points that you've mention are, in a very real matter of fact, security vulnerabilities... That means there is no "believing" or "opinion" about them, they are there, they are security vulnerabilities. Period.

Anyway... I think it's fine you think otherwise. You have a right to an opinion regardless of how wrong i feel you are. But I'm not upset... I'm not insinuating how "ludicrous" or "delusional" you are. You're just wrong and I'm OK with that. You though.. have real issue with someone disagreeing with you... the world is going to really be a hard place for you to adapt.

You have not yet provided any "proof" to your claims other than saying "I don't believe you no matter you say" regardless of how official it is because you believe that it is subject to change before release... I mean, how can anyone argue with logic that is that flawed that you're platforming.

Additionally, I never called you "ludicrous" or "delusional" so there no need to start getting offended. As I have already told you, which you keep ignoring, if you continue to take the "opinion" that you will not believe any evidence and continue to ignore anything that says otherwise, that close-minded nature and opinion of yours, not you, yourself, is ludicrous and delusional because you're refuse an opinion simply because it contrasts with your personal beliefs. Therefore, any evidence that is thrown at you, you just ignore and that simply makes your position look inane.

Also, you obviously don't know how games are built, especially WoW... and exactly why it is impossible to market the old game client legally. You ignore links to US commerce law regarding security parameters that a company would be forced to manage for client servers and you ignore Blizzard blue posts relegating to the many times over the years why they haven't taken on WoW Classic. If you flat out ignore direct evidence that has been linked many times throughout this thread and others, then you are, plainly, ignorant...

I mean seriously, do you even read what you post before you type it...

Think about it, you post stating that there are exactly zero issues with Blizzard releasing the 2004 client, claim that you're an expert opinion on program before you've toyed with the game's code yourself, but don't even know that, by itself, is a vulnerability... It's flat out sad. Yet here you are talking about understanding what is clearly several aspects of commercial business and game development that nothing more than armchair development theory and think you can flat out ignore anything that contrasts your "opinion" regardless of fact or even basic common sense... I mean, if you're going to defend a position you have to at least provide a shred of evidence if you don't want to appear completely and totally inane in your "point of view" or "opinion" or whatever you choose to strawman your position. It's just sad by this point, I was actually hoping that you knew something legit that you could shed on the topic, but it appears that you little more than an "opinion" who "believes" whatever they hell you want without proof. If you're simply not going to read the posts, links, or anything brought up or even look back to see all of the critical flaws that myself and others have addressed and asked for, then you're simply not worth the time to talk to. Which is unfortunate, because I had a higher respect for you at first, but you obviously are refusing to answer my questions regarding your position because you're really not the "expert opinion" that you made yourself out to be.

[SNES-1990]

... That's some next level tinfoilery, but Classic is happening. I'm all for letting the nostalgia crowd sweat in favor of the Live game, but Blizzard announcing something only to then not follow through would lead to a huge blowback not only from players that want Classic, but also from people with a sense for what's fair.

Hell, even I would be mad as fuck on account of the fans that just want Classic if Blizzard pulled such a stunt.

You must not be old enough to remember Starcraft Ghost

[Torrasque]

I see you changed your tune from before of they will just use the old database........ It depends, you first have to build the new DB to import the data into and worry about possible corruptions from a 13 y/o DB. It is a lot more work than you think, even Blizzard said so in their interviews. AS I have said before I am a DC architecture consultant and been part of many large DC projects in both software development firms and public sector space.

This is my issue with his posts, they flip flop and change because he truly doesn't know the architecture of either build of the game... He pretends to know it, and plays it off as if he's educated in the knowledge of both the technology and in the business model, which he is very much neither.

It's sad that he even chants that he's "An Expert" and "can hack into the original game" but literally knows nothing about the process or that even the ability to do that is security vulnerability for the original game... It's just pathetic.

[Vestig3]

So why are you speaking for the millions of others that do?

There are people clearing world quests because they enjoy it.
There are also people not doing them because they hate them.

Who are you to say "Get over it... go log back into live and do another couple dozen world quests... you know you gotta."?

Dont take that guy serious, he speaks about vanilla as if he has played it but he hasnt lol.

[Projectmars]

You must not be old enough to remember Starcraft Ghost

There's a difference between a game that has already released, has been proven popular, has immense community support, and is one that, while it will require a great deal of work to get working properly, has a lot of stuff that should be usable in rebuilding it verses a completely new game that was shaping up to not work the way they wanted it.

There's several factors that make it a completely different ball game than Ghost. To the point where it would be pretty bizarre if they just drop the project completely.

[Maudib]

There is a difference between "not mincing words" and "being intentionally bait-y". And your posts indicate you lean much more to the latter than the former. I mean, even your signatures lend heavy credence to that theory.


Do you agree with this statement: there are people who are unable move on, unable to accept the fact the game they started playing has changed. Some of those are likely to lash out at others because they dare to enjoy the current version of a certain game.

My sigs represent MY opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

I certainly do agree with your statement. It doesn't represent me however. After all.. THIS is a Classic forum. And is about the game they are bringing back. I wholeheartedly think current WoW is the worst it has ever been. It's not baiting, it's not intended to inflame anyone. I'm sorry it bothers you so much that I truly dislike the game you love. I check it off to personal taste.

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No it's not. But you have proven many time how clueless you are about this topic.

We must agree to disagree then. As far as I am concerned... a single database programmer can write code to pull data from one version of a database, and save it to another. It truly is as easy as that. It's done every day when a company switches technologies. I mean, it's not as easy as clicking "Save as"... but it is pretty damn easy.

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So why are you speaking for the millions of others that do?

There are people clearing world quests because they enjoy it.
There are also people not doing them because they hate them.

Who are you to say "Get over it... go log back into live and do another couple dozen world quests... you know you gotta."?

Exactly.. Some people like it, some people don't. I fully respect those people's desire to do so. But as soonas I say it's garbage content to me... those who DO like it take offense. Why those people just say... "Sorry you don't like it... I love it!" or some such. Instead people try and convince me that my dislike is unwarranted. I don't have to have a reason (although i have stated a many reasons)... I just do not like it.

[Ielenia]

My sigs represent MY opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

And you continue to play innocent, claiming ignorance of the obvious (and likely intended) effects the way you blatantly word your opinion.

You know full well that the "Classic vs Current" debate regarding WoW is a hot topic and practically a mine field. You have the opportunity of trying to start a civil, moderate discussion about the topic, yet you instead opt to throw more gasoline into the fire by "expressing your opinion", insulting people on the opposition and making inflammatory statements that serve no purpose whatsoever than to rile up others.

Since you refuse to admit this, there is nothing more to discuss with you. Though I will say one last thing:

I certainly do agree with your statement. It doesn't represent me however.

I wouldn't be so sure, considering the way you demean and insult others who are against Classic WoW or prefer current WoW, and how your posts basically have "COME AT ME BRO" flashing in neon light signs all over them.

Have a good day, I'm done.

[Maudib]

You are not though because Vanilla as it is will not run properly server side. They also have been very clear that they do not want to maintain 2 client software suites. But they have been clear that it will be a "Vanilla like Experience". There will also be many game breaking exploit fixes that happen, as well as bugs(IE falling through world at random due to spaghetti code)

I have never seen anything saying they did not want to run 2 client software suites. For a company that apparently feels "You think you do but you don't" I cannot imagine them going to the trouble to re-code the entire game from back then.

Instead.. I see them working to integrate the existing code to work with existing infrastructure and doing as little as possible. It makes sense as well when you consider the very few jobs they posted and filled... like 5 or 6... all infrastructure guys/gals.

If you have a source that says otherwise, I shure would appreciate a link... I certainly don't mind becoming more informed.